Alan Jackson at the Station Inn

[Caleb]

Even the Hag (who I love) couldn't really pull it off in his "bluegrass" sessions...

Wow, thanks for the heads up on this; it slipped past me somehow. Really loved the sound. More folk/country than BG, which is a sound I prefer.

[JH Murray]

Haggard's album works as a country/BG fusion. Not strictly BG, which is perhaps why it was snubbed for the grammy award that year. It might have been nominated if it had been released today, what with the Goat Rodeo disc winning best folk album. I did enjoy Haggard's album as honest music. David Lee Roth has never been honest in anything he has done, imho.

[grassrootphilosopher]

@ Willie: You don´t ruffle my feathers. I know my bluegrass when I hear it (and when I play it). For example, I quoted "Blue Night" with the Greene, Rowan citybillie Blue Grass Boys as a prime example of bluegrass. If that ain´t I don´t know what is.

@ Tom f5loar: It seems that my probably poorly outspoken music theory was not clear enough. I don´t criticise the instrumental abilities of the pickers. I did neither criticise the Jim & Jesse outfit (far from that). And when your brother picks with Jesse, he does not play unison notes... right? That´s what I´m getting at.

The "Jump"-song is based upon the opening riff. This is played (at least the way I hear it on my computer) in unison by Scott Vestal, the mando player (Jorgenson), the guitar guy with "the hair" and the fiddle player. There´s no harmonizing in it, no orchestration, no complex (=bluegrass) sound. It´s just the riff in unison. And when the lead singer sings the line about the record machine the chorus singer does the same line in unison, or am I hearing it wrong? That ain´t bluegrass. What´s more, the vocals are not unison, they are off, pitchy... or am I wrong here also? Or am I wrong and you like just that?

On the other hand nobody would claim that the Haggard song in this thread is no bluegrass if the Haggard guitar solo and his vocals were left out or replaced by Junior Sisks vocals. Anybody to disagree? So does it boil down to a vocal timbre and the way you play a guitar solo that the whole song is kicked out of bluegrass?

So help me out, what kind of arrangement, orchestration etc. makes bluegrass and will make a musician like Randy Travis, George Strait, Keith Urban, Dwight Yoakum, Kenny Chesney etc. sound like bluegrass.

It has been mentioned that Alan Jackson did not do well playing the guitar. I noticed that too. He does not pull the chords through, just touches on a couple of strings in a chord. Apart from that, he quits playing when he sings quite a bit. But then... folks like J.D. Crowe stop playing when they sing (chorus). And I´ve seen Bill Monroe and Jimmy Martin stop playing when they sang. It´s just plain difficult to sing right when you´ve got something else going on.

[sunburst]

On the other hand nobody would claim that the Haggard song in this thread is no bluegrass if the Haggard guitar solo and his vocals were left out or replaced by Junior Sisks vocals. Anybody to disagree?

I disagree. It would be a country song if Junior sang it, just like it's a country song with Merle singing it. It is a good song and a good performance, I liked it much better than the stuff you hear on "country" radio stations, but it isn't Bluegrass. Guitars, mandolins, fiddles, banjos, "Dobros", basses; all were used in country music long before they were used in Bluegrass music. When those instruments are used to play other types of music that doesn't necessarily make it Bluegrass or country either.

[grassrootphilosopher]

I disagree. It would be a country song if Junior sang it, just like it's a country song with Merle singing it. It is a good song and a good performance, I liked it much better than the stuff you hear on "country" radio stations, but it isn't Bluegrass. Guitars, mandolins, fiddles, banjos, "Dobros", basses; all were used in country music long before they were used in Bluegrass music. When those instruments are used to play other types of music that doesn't necessarily make it Bluegrass or country either.

That´s the way I like it. I see your definition of bluegrass. I accept it. What you think is bluegrass is bluegrass in my book for sure. But my idea of bluegrass is somewhat more vast. This is neither good nor bad, just my opinion. It would be fun (for me) to meet (face to face) and to draw the line what may be bluegrass for one and the other and what is not. I see fine jam sessions.

[Cheryl Watson]

Wow! That really happened!

(In reference to You Tube video, Bluegrass style "JUMP"):
Yes, it is really nearly unbelievable that it ever happened! No wonder comments have been "disabled" for that video. But, I DID get a good laugh out of it and I guess that is good for my health

[Willie Poole]

Holding Things Together" is a great song and Hag did it as well as anyone could do, and I love it myself, but `tain`t bluegrass by a long shot....

[sunburst]

...Hag did it as well as anyone could do...

Yep, he nailed it.

[f5loar]

Back to the "Jump" bluegrass video, whenever I feel really down and out I can watch that video and it seems to cheer me up. Just seeing that old rocker come out so casual to sing this well known Rock hit with this all bluegrass band in his relaxed style of singing makes me happy because he sure appears to be having a great time. That or he is on some designer drug that made him happy to be there that night. You can't help but smile

[Willie Poole]

On "Songs Of The Mountain" this morning they had Janie Frickie singing using The Roys as her backup band and she is calling her music "bluegrass" now and all she is doing is singing most of the songs she did when she was a touring country singer, she no longer get many offers to tour with the Nashville crowd so she has changed to trying to make a comeback doing what she calls bluegrass but it is still her old country songs and to me that is not bluegrass ...Her voice is sort of raspy also....she calls her album "Country with a bluegrass twist" or something like that.....

Again, I only watched about three or four songs, I just can`t take it...

Willie

[shawnbrock]

Yep Willie, you nailed it. Just what I said 2 pages ago, the country wash ups always end up in bluegrass, if they're lucky anyhow... And they'll get some, (a lot) of support.

[f5loar]

or they wind up with a breakfast show on the strip in Branson, MO ! Janie looking pretty good for 61 but she washed up in 1988. Not sure why even bother with a comeback, bluegrass or not after that long off the scene. But hey, if they can bring Leon Russell back for MerleFest anything is possible.

[Markelberry]

I bet he was just havin fun, and I bet no matter what road some musicians took in life their is still a time they go back to the same old shade tree and have some lemonade

[Mike Bunting]

This performance by Jackson reminds of this one by a well known Rock Artist a few years ago which has pretty much been forgotten like New Coke. Surround yourself with 6 to 10 of the best superpickers in bluegrass and jump in the middle and sing any song you want and it's going to sound like bluegrass music. Just glad Mr. Monroe was not alive to see this one: PS: Note the mandolin picker they choose. Not a cheap band of pickers.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-VZ2mrpBZs

That one was appalling and hilarious at the same time. I guess the band was getting paid enough to hide their embarrassment.

[almeriastrings]

Have to say that (yet another) turn-out by the top session pickers around does not do much for me at all. They are all great pickers - but it says nothing of the commitment, ability or (sometimes) taste of the person who hires them. It is like painting by numbers. I much prefer to see a real and original band, not an off-the-shelf one, no matter how good the individuals involved. The Dillards were original. So were NGR, Hot Rize, Bluegrass Alliance, Country Gentlemen, Seldom Scene and many others. Going way back the Stanley's made their own sound from Monroe's roots. I have yet to hear a single, genuinely creative, original and memorable thing from any of these "off the self" outfits. In so many cases they are are just adding Blue Grass "decoration" to modern country music (or worse... much worse!)

[roysboy]

If Alan Jackson makes a roomful or a stadium full of music lovers happy when he sings and picks ...mission accomplished .

Musicians and singers usually don't get into the 'biz' to please other musicians and singers . They love what they do first , in whatever capacity they do it , but ultimately, as professionals ,I think its about giving something to someone by way of our gift . As 'corny' as that may sound , I've been in the trenches for the best part of 50 years and with very very few exceptions no matter what player I worked alongside , they really WANTED to be there to fill the room with a good musical vibe and make folks happy . Its the musicians in a crowd that are always the hardest to please . I think its because we are too often listening with our heads and not our hearts .

[JH Murray]

I know the country music scene in Nashville is rather odd, but is this the new normal? That those who can be country music stars will play pop/rock, and when they can't be superstars any more, they will play bluegrass instead?

[Herbm55]

?....but is this the new normal? That those who can be country music stars will play pop/rock, and when they can't be superstars any more, they will play bluegrass instead?

AJ is still pretty much a superstar and has never really went the "pop/rock" route. I do know it's widely reported he listens to a lot of bluegrass on the tour bus and his guitar player, Scott Coney, is a longtime Tony Rice admirer. None of that, in and of itself, will make for great bluegrass, but to compare this to what David Lee Roth did is laughable.

I listened to the whole show (and I don't own a single Alan Jackson recording) and I heard a guy that sounded really nervous for the first few tunes but gradually got a bit more relaxed as the show went along. Yes, he did some country singing with bluegrass instruments, but I can cut him some slack because it won't hurt bluegrass music. Maybe some of the AJ fans that bought those 60 million country records will look into bluegrass. They might discover they like Blue Highway or even Junior Sisk. Who knows?

Herb M.

[George R. Lane]

I could care less about if Alan Jackson can sing bluegrass or not. I want to know which mando Adam was playing.

[FLATROCK HILL]

AJ is still pretty much a superstar and has never really went the "pop/rock" route. I do know it's widely reported he listens to a lot of bluegrass on the tour bus and his guitar player, Scott Coney, is a longtime Tony Rice admirer. None of that, in and of itself, will make for great bluegrass, but to compare this to what David Lee Roth did is laughable.

I listened to the whole show (and I don't own a single Alan Jackson recording) and I heard a guy that sounded really nervous for the first few tunes but gradually got a bit more relaxed as the show went along. Yes, he did some country singing with bluegrass instruments, but I can cut him some slack because it won't hurt bluegrass music. Maybe some of the AJ fans that bought those 60 million country records will look into bluegrass. They might discover they like Blue Highway or even Junior Sisk. Who knows?

Herb M.

Welcome to the Cafe Herb M. Looks like this was your first post here. Your post was the most sensible one on the entire thread.

[Timmando]

I've got the Haggard "Bluegrass Sessions" cd and I like it. Granted its not Flatt and Scruggs, but it is good music. When I listen to it, it puts me into the Mac Wiseman mode. I wish Stuart had done more mandolin backup, maybe a lead break. And what is with all those scratched in (or silver pen) signatures on his mandolin? I can't see the headstock...is that a Lloyd Loar with all those signatures on it?

[Caleb]

I've got the Haggard "Bluegrass Sessions" cd and I like it. Granted its not Flatt and Scruggs, but it is good music. When I listen to it, it puts me into the Mac Wiseman mode. I wish Stuart had done more mandolin backup, maybe a lead break. And what is with all those scratched in (or silver pen) signatures on his mandolin? I can't see the headstock...is that a Lloyd Loar with all those signatures on it?

Is that the same mandolin he uses on his show? Ever now and again on his show he'll really cut loose on it. The guy is scary talented.

[f5loar]

I've got the Haggard "Bluegrass Sessions" cd and I like it. Granted its not Flatt and Scruggs, but it is good music. When I listen to it, it puts me into the Mac Wiseman mode. I wish Stuart had done more mandolin backup, maybe a lead break. And what is with all those scratched in (or silver pen) signatures on his mandolin? I can't see the headstock...is that a Lloyd Loar with all those signatures on it?

Tim since you seem fairly new to the café , Marty's F5 copy was made in the early 70's by Chris Warner. If you look closely at the details it's not that close to a real Loar. Marty says Johnny Cash carved his initials in it without him knowing it and from there Marty decided to get as many as he could on it. Most of the ones that signed it are long gone. It does have a great tone to it but then Marty knows how to get that great tone from most any mandolin/guitar. Not sure why the Hag CD didn't have more of a bluegrass feel to it but then I don't think the upcoming AJ or JF CDs will either.

[sunburst]

It does have a great tone to it but then Marty knows how to get that great tone from most any mandolin/guitar.

The only time I ever talked to Marty Stuart he said he has owned a lot of other mandolins, including Loars, but no other mandolin has worked for him like this one, so it has always been and still is his "main axe".

[Russ Jordan]

I've got the Haggard "Bluegrass Sessions" cd and I like it. Granted its not Flatt and Scruggs, but it is good music. When I listen to it, it puts me into the Mac Wiseman mode. I wish Stuart had done more mandolin backup, maybe a lead break. And what is with all those scratched in (or silver pen) signatures on his mandolin? I can't see the headstock...is that a Lloyd Loar with all those signatures on it?

Ronnie Reno is producing a Merle Haggard/Mac Wiseman duet cd.