Bach on the mandolin

[Gina Le Faux]

I really enjoy playing Bach on my mandolin, every time I play a piece I find different ways of interpreting it. Here's my interpretation of the Gigue from Cello Suite No 2 by J.S. Bach



Anyone else playing Bach on their mandolin?

[JEStanek]

Nicely played. Thanks for posting.

Jamie

[fatt-dad]

that's just great!

f-d

[John Goodin]

Thanks for sharing! It's always good to hear a familiar piece played in a new way.

John G.

[MLT]

I like your intereptation. Thanks for sharing.

[Jim Garber]

Is that an Embergher? Interesting esp with that dark top. Thanks for the nice playing on your video.

[Gina Le Faux]

Hi Jim, My mandolin has no label, but Ken Baddley, the mandolin maker and restorer thinks it is an Embergher. According to Ken, Embergher did make some mandolins with dark tops but they tend to have been refinished to the normal lighter colour. It's a brilliant mandolin to play and the sound is fabulous. :-)

[mattdowie92]

https://soundcloud.com/mattdowie/bac...om-cello-suite

Here's my attempt at the prelude from the 1st cello suite.

Only been playing mando for for 4 days. Any feedback/tips would be very much appreciated to help me improve. My mandolin is a Gold Tone gm-50 it sounds great but the recording quality is very bad.

[Ken_P]

https://soundcloud.com/mattdowie/bac...om-cello-suite

Here's my attempt at the prelude from the 1st cello suite.

Only been playing mando for for 4 days. Any feedback/tips would be very much appreciated to help me improve. My mandolin is a Gold Tone gm-50 it sounds great but the recording quality is very bad.

For four days of playing, that's really impressive. I'm willing to bet you have significant musical experience beyond the mandolin, right? I'd guess a bowed instrument, since you obviously know your way around the fretboard pretty well. In any event, keep up the good work - can't wait to see what you can do in another four days

[bratsche]

Hello Gina and Matt,

A hearty welcome to both of you! Please consider joining the Bach on Mandolin social group. It hasn't been hugely active of late, but perhaps that's because it needs some new blood. There are lots of us around here who enjoy playing Bach. (For me, it's the main reason I got started in this whole plucking endeavor!)

bratsche

[Jim Garber]

Bach is always interesting and challenging. Some pieces are less difficult but the challenge to me is to make it musical. Sometimes we need to play some of his simpler pieces so we can concentrate on the phrasing as opposed to getting overwhelmed by playing the notes. I try above all to make it flow and to make it sing. Whether I am successful is something else but that is my goal... with Bach or any other music.

[mattdowie92]

Hey Ken, thanks for the kind words!
I've been a guitarist for about 8/9 years, playing rock, blues and jazz mostly. I kinda cheated learning that because I went straight to tab. Although I do intend to get my sight reading down asap!

[mattdowie92]

Hi Jim, I love Bach. Some of my favourite music, and it sounds great on nearly every instrument.
I know my playing of Bach is not the most musical at the moment, I will be working on making the phrases flow and really focus on dynamics and tone. If you can recommend any simpler pieces arranged for mandolin I would love to give them a shot! :D

[Red_Label]

Very cool thread! Wonderful playing.

I've loved Bach's works since I used to learn some of his violin concertos by ear on electric guitar back in the early 80s. I went on to study classical guitar in a program run by Christopher Parkening a couple of years later.

So when I picked-up the mando about ten years ago, one of the first things I did was pickup some Bach violin sheet music that I had laying around and learn the Gavotte from Partita No. 3 in E. I played for about a year and then sort of put the mando away and didn't really do anything with it until a few months ago. Now I find myself passionate about the mando and yesterday I downloaded the sheet music for Preludium from Partita No. 3 and I'm about 5 or 6 lines into memorizing it. I can only do it at about half speed (I've got Vanessa-Mae's awesome recording of her doing it on violin as a measuring stick). Besides loving the "mathematical/logical" style of most of Bach's work, I also chose this piece to learn as a tour de force that I could work on to elevate my mando chops. It's been very frustrating to be a seasoned guitar player (29 years of playing/gigging/teaching most styles) and have to go back to such a basic level on the mando. So I figured I'd just dive-in on something hard and get the party started. After 4-5 hours' work on this piece I'm already feeling more confident and comfortable on the mando. I'll eventually work-through and memorize the entire piece and use it as daily practice, working toward a decent performance of it. I prefer to use actual MUSIC to work on, as opposed to mindless scale practice. Bach always did a great job at melding technique and musicality. I never found the Paganini Caprices to be as interesting/musical as Bach for my tastes.

[JeffD]

Gina that was beautiful.

[Curt Palm]

If you can recommend any simpler pieces arranged for mandolin I would love to give them a shot! :D

Dix Bruce out at www.musixnow.com has a simple duet of a Bach Bouree. I've recorded both parts and then play one part against the recording of the other part. Its a nice introduction to Bach on the Mandolin. Also check out the Deborah Chen's website www.stringthingm.com .
Both Mr. Bruce and Ms. Chen have been helpful to me.

You can find the Bouree on the downloads page (at the bottom) at musixnow.com.

[bratsche]

Besides loving the "mathematical/logical" style of most of Bach's work, I also chose this piece to learn as a tour de force that I could work on to elevate my mando chops. It's been very frustrating to be a seasoned guitar player (29 years of playing/gigging/teaching most styles) and have to go back to such a basic level on the mando. So I figured I'd just dive-in on something hard and get the party started. After 4-5 hours' work on this piece I'm already feeling more confident and comfortable on the mando. I'll eventually work-through and memorize the entire piece and use it as daily practice, working toward a decent performance of it. I prefer to use actual MUSIC to work on, as opposed to mindless scale practice. Bach always did a great job at melding technique and musicality.

Red_Label, as one who shares your love and appreciation for Bach, I admire your approach and attitude. I can only imagine how tough it must be coming from a guitar background, with its completely different tuning and fingerings. That takes guts! Coming from a violin/viola background (in which I had learned and internalized a fair bit of Bach solo repertoire), the transition to the mando family equivalents was about "half there" already. But my right hand had a whole lot of catching up to do. For simpler movements, it wasn't so bad, and I could put together a creditable rendition of them in fairly short order. I haven't tackled the Preludio in particular (as I kind of ODed on it at one time as a violin student, heh!), but I decided to tackle the famous Chaconne as my "tour de force" movement, in my effort to hone my plectral chops. That has paid off in more ways than I can count! As it's been in my memory for so long, I can practice this or that passage whenever I have an instrument in hand for a few minutes, and it's something one can never fail to glean new value from. As a twenty-something, I learned the notes, and as a fifty-something, I'm still plumbing the depths of the musicality of that wondrous masterpiece! It's not quite up to public performance level (though I've played it for private and non-critical, appreciative listeners) but it's getting there, little by little. There's nothing quite like JSB to keep fresh the interest and challenge of playing, is there?

bratsche

[Red_Label]

Red_Label, as one who shares your love and appreciation for Bach, I admire your approach and attitude. I can only imagine how tough it must be coming from a guitar background, with its completely different tuning and fingerings. That takes guts! Coming from a violin/viola background (in which I had learned and internalized a fair bit of Bach solo repertoire), the transition to the mando family equivalents was about "half there" already. But my right hand had a whole lot of catching up to do. For simpler movements, it wasn't so bad, and I could put together a creditable rendition of them in fairly short order. I haven't tackled the Preludio in particular (as I kind of ODed on it at one time as a violin student, heh!), but I decided to tackle the famous Chaconne as my "tour de force" movement, in my effort to hone my plectral chops. That has paid off in more ways than I can count! As it's been in my memory for so long, I can practice this or that passage whenever I have an instrument in hand for a few minutes, and it's something one can never fail to glean new value from. As a twenty-something, I learned the notes, and as a fifty-something, I'm still plumbing the depths of the musicality of that wondrous masterpiece! It's not quite up to public performance level (though I've played it for private and non-critical, appreciative listeners) but it's getting there, little by little. There's nothing quite like JSB to keep fresh the interest and challenge of playing, is there?

bratsche

Thank you for your input and agreed on all counts. Now that I've overcome the hurdle of getting used to smushing my left-hand fingers into such small spaces, it's definitely my right-hand that needs the most work. I've got a good right hand on the guitar, but the double-courses of strings on the mando has definitely posed a challenge. Also, when I play guitar I tend to anchor my right-hand pinky (actually, it "floats" along the pickguard area). So I've had to get used to the closed-fist picking style on the mando. But I've started to feel comfortable in all of that. Just took a month of two of dedicated repetition and now it's starting to feel awkward when I don't use proper technique.

I'll have to have another close listen to the Chaconne. Haven't heard it in years. I plan to work on some of the Vivaldi works down the road. And I've been working on some very old "Early Music" pieces (Domna pos vos ay chausida, Estampie No. 3) on the mando as well. Learning those by ear and tabbing them out. For the past two years I've played nylon string guitar at the local Ren Fair and this summer I'd like to have some more period correct pieces (albeit played on a mando instead of a lute, or some other such early stringed instrument).

[Jim Garber]

I haven't tackled the Preludio in particular (as I kind of ODed on it at one time as a violin student, heh!), but I decided to tackle the famous Chaconne as my "tour de force" movement, in my effort to hone my plectral chops.

In my humblest of opinions, I believe that the Chaconne is prob the biggest challenge for any mandolin player. Bratsche, you have the advantage of a bowed instrument background but I have yet to hear anyone play that movement on the mandolin with the soul and emotion that a violonist can achieve. Best of luck with that.

For the past two years I've played nylon string guitar at the local Ren Fair and this summer I'd like to have some more period correct pieces (albeit played on a mando instead of a lute, or some other such early stringed instrument).

A little confusing: period-correct for the mandolin or period-correct for the Ren Fair? The mandolins we play -- meaning metal strung tuned to violin tuning -- are not period-correct for renaissance music in any case, but there is really nothing wrong with playing these older tunes on a more modern instrument.

[Martin Jonas]

I'll have to have another close listen to the Chaconne. Haven't heard it in years. I plan to work on some of the Vivaldi works down the road. And I've been working on some very old "Early Music" pieces (Domna pos vos ay chausida, Estampie No. 3) on the mando as well. Learning those by ear and tabbing them out. For the past two years I've played nylon string guitar at the local Ren Fair and this summer I'd like to have some more period correct pieces (albeit played on a mando instead of a lute, or some other such early stringed instrument).

For early music on mandolin (although as Jim has said that's not a period correct instrument), check out the "Medieval Music" social group here on the Cafe (Link).

Martin

[bratsche]

In my humblest of opinions, I believe that the Chaconne is prob the biggest challenge for any mandolin player. Bratsche, you have the advantage of a bowed instrument background but I have yet to hear anyone play that movement on the mandolin with the soul and emotion that a violonist can achieve. Best of luck with that.

Thank you, I think. Different things move different people differently. The Chaconne version that really did it for me was on a classical guitar... and that, long before I ever began my mando-journey. I always found the bowed broken chords in the piece to sound stilted and unconvincing, particularly the ones played top to bottom, even in the hands of the best virtuoso players.

Now I 'hear' the piece in my head mostly in Gm, after my viola and then (more satisfying) mandola efforts. I wouldn't dream to try it myself on mandolin, any more than to get out a violin and attempt to play it after all these years of just playing violin at Christmas and Eastertime. I'd love to hear someone with real classical mandola chops, like Jacob Reuven or Avi Avital, do the Chaconne on one of those wonderful flat-top instruments that they play. (No slight intended to the bowlback virtuosi, it's just not my personal preference.)

I think "soul and emotion" are not dependent on the type of instrument or the mechanics used to manipulate the strings, nearly so much as on what lies inside the interpreter.

bratsche

[JeffD]

One thing about Bach, for the musician who is not classically oriented, is that learning to play Bach well teaches more than playing Bach well. The lessons carry over to just about every other kind of music.

To my experience this is not the case with all music. I could go after Astor Piazzolla style tango music with all the effort I can bring, and, in reality, I will get competent at tango, but perhaps not so much with anything else.

Bach helps me with finger placement and efficiency, sight reading, rhythm, right hand technique, musical memory, western harmonies, a whole ton of things. Working on Bach makes me better at music, be it old time, or celtic, or bluegrass, or whathaveyou.

So while working on anything has its own rewards, some rewards are more generalizable.

[Red_Label]

A little confusing: period-correct for the mandolin or period-correct for the Ren Fair? The mandolins we play -- meaning metal strung tuned to violin tuning -- are not period-correct for renaissance music in any case, but there is really nothing wrong with playing these older tunes on a more modern instrument.

Period-correct for the Ren Fair. They're not too hard-core about everything (instruments OR music) being period-correct at my local fair, because I live in MT and you're just not going to find any/many musicians here who own period-correct "exotic" instruments from the Dark Ages and play a bunch of old Dowland pieces (although I've got a ton of his stuff in sheet music -- I've only learned a few over the years). I just love the music and am not hung-up myself on playing period-correct instruments. I don't even feel the need to get a bowlback at this point. More than happy to play whatever on my Breedlove KOs.

[Red_Label]

One thing about Bach, for the musician who is not classically oriented, is that learning to play Bach well teaches more than playing Bach well. The lessons carry over to just about every other kind of music.

To my experience this is not the case with all music. I could go after Astor Piazzolla style tango music with all the effort I can bring, and, in reality, I will get competent at tango, but perhaps not so much with anything else.

Bach helps me with finger placement and efficiency, sight reading, rhythm, right hand technique, musical memory, western harmonies, a whole ton of things. Working on Bach makes me better at music, be it old time, or celtic, or bluegrass, or whathaveyou.

So while working on anything has its own rewards, some rewards are more generalizable.

I'll agree with this as well. Back in my classical guitar-focused days I used to do a number of Bach works. I found most of them to be challenging -- to the point that I had to "step-up" to be able to perform them and this elevation in skill carried-over well to everything else.

[Red_Label]

For early music on mandolin (although as Jim has said that's not a period correct instrument), check out the "Medieval Music" social group here on the Cafe (Link).

Martin

Will do that. Thanks!