Results 1 to 18 of 18

Thread: Have you ever seen anything like this?

  1. #1
    Jo Dusepo, luthier Dusepo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    London, UK.
    Posts
    815

    Default Have you ever seen anything like this?

    Have you ever seen anything like this? This is an Iranian Tanbur but the same process could be applied to any bowlbacked (or even flatbacked) instrument in the same way. There's an extra half or slightly less of a body over the soundboard. It seems to reflect the sound in an interesting way.

    I am a luthier specialising in historical and world stringed instruments. You can see more info at my website.

  2. The Following 12 Users Say Thank You to Dusepo For This Useful Post:

    + Show/Hide list of the thanked


  3. #2
    Lurkist dhergert's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Blue Zone, California
    Posts
    1,866
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    Looks like an extended armrest and/or palm rest to me. And yes, it has to affect tone, but volume may be unaffected; like with suspended pick guards, the sound gets out, albeit perhaps with some latency.

    Interesting looking at her documents and instruments on the wall and the room she's performing in. She appears to also specialize at least in her regional stringed instruments.
    -- Don

    "Music: A minor auditory irritation occasionally characterized as pleasant."
    "It is a lot more fun to make music than it is to argue about it."


    2002 Gibson F-9
    2016 MK LFSTB
    1975 Suzuki taterbug (plus many other noisemakers)
    [About how I tune my mandolins]
    [Our recent arrival]

  4. The following members say thank you to dhergert for this post:

    Dusepo 

  5. #3
    Professional Dreamer journeybear's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Northeastern South Carolina, west of North Carolina
    Posts
    15,340
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    So that piece is removable? Because it's gone in the second song. Unless she switched instruments. I really like the right hand technique. Those very fast notes she gets pulling the fingers in succession, opposite the usual method for brush strokes - brilliant.

    PS: In answer to your question - no. Thanks.
    But that's just my opinion. I could be wrong. - Dennis Miller

    Furthering Mandolin Consciousness

    Finders Keepers, my duo with the astoundingly talented and versatile Patti Rothberg. Our EP is finally done, and available! PM me, while they last!

  6. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to journeybear For This Useful Post:


  7. #4
    Registered User Simon DS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Peace and Love
    Posts
    2,403

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    Really like the Tone of both of them.
    I was wondering if the video had been edited because it seems that there are a lot more cars in the second one, and the light seems different. But maybe not. Maybe someone handed her the second instrument quickly.
    It does seem as though she is the musician at the shop trying out instruments.

    Do they play these instruments with a pick?

  8. The following members say thank you to Simon DS for this post:

    Dusepo 

  9. #5
    Jo Dusepo, luthier Dusepo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    London, UK.
    Posts
    815

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    Quote Originally Posted by journeybear View Post
    So that piece is removable? Because it's gone in the second song. Unless she switched instruments. I really like the right hand technique. Those very fast notes she gets pulling the fingers in succession, opposite the usual method for brush strokes - brilliant.

    PS: In answer to your question - no. Thanks.
    I'd never thought of that! Perhaps it is removable. I guess we'll never know if the video was cut or she removed it quickly.

    The playing technique is typical of the tanbur (تنبور), it is indeed great for creating a 'wall of sound'

    Quote Originally Posted by Simon DS View Post
    Really like the Tone of both of them.
    I was wondering if the video had been edited because it seems that there are a lot more cars in the second one, and the light seems different. But maybe not. Maybe someone handed her the second instrument quickly.
    It does seem as though she is the musician at the shop trying out instruments.

    Do they play these instruments with a pick?
    Nope, played with fingers, using the special technique often.

    Here's a google translate of the video's description which provides some more info:
    In a meeting with Professor Saeed Zolanuri, I got acquainted with an interesting instrument in their beautiful workshop.
    This instrument is two-sided with two completely different sound colors and can be played with both sides.
    The master told me the interesting story of this instrument, the main model of this instrument was designed and made by Master Khodavardi about 200 years ago, who took the trouble to redesign and reconstruct it and did valuable work to make this art and invention a memory for the future.
    I also had the good fortune to play with this unique instrument for a few moments
    My Farsi is very limited, but the word 'ostad' which has been translated as professor might be better translated as Master musician/Maestro.
    I am a luthier specialising in historical and world stringed instruments. You can see more info at my website.

  10. The following members say thank you to Dusepo for this post:


  11. #6

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    The little upstroking flourish with all the fingers totally different than flamenco rasgueado - but achieving the same effect. Cool

    Don't know how many variations of finger patterns/rasgueados exist in this type of music - in flamenco there are a great many - but of course flamenco toque is about as elaborate as it gets..

  12. The following members say thank you to catmandu2 for this post:

    Dusepo 

  13. #7
    Registered User William Smith's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Sugar Grove,PA
    Posts
    3,364
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    I must say that was awesome! Loved that instrument demo. On the first tune, that piece on the top is odd, I wonder if it has a bar of metal on the underside to get that sound?

  14. The following members say thank you to William Smith for this post:

    Dusepo 

  15. #8
    Registered User Ranald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Ottawa, Canada
    Posts
    1,715

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    Reminds me somewhat of a prim or bisernica, the smallest form of tamburica or tamburiza, played in Serbia, Croatia, and neighbouring countries. I suspect the instruments are distant cousins. By the way, my neighbour from Iran said that my mandolin reminded her of a Persian instrument.
    Robert Johnson's mother, describing blues musicians:
    "I never did have no trouble with him until he got big enough to be round with bigger boys and off from home. Then he used to follow all these harp blowers, mandoleen (sic) and guitar players."
    Lomax, Alan, The Land where The Blues Began, NY: Pantheon, 1993, p.14.

  16. The following members say thank you to Ranald for this post:

    Dusepo 

  17. #9

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    I enjoyed this music.
    I also enjoy the group that frequently posts on YouTube - Trio Mandili. There appears to be a similar instrument being played. I'm way, way, over my skis but it seems like the neck has the fretboard of a mountain dulcimer with a gourd or "gourd-shaped" body.
    It's all good.

  18. #10
    Jo Dusepo, luthier Dusepo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    London, UK.
    Posts
    815

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Oliver View Post
    I enjoyed this music.
    I also enjoy the group that frequently posts on YouTube - Trio Mandili. There appears to be a similar instrument being played. I'm way, way, over my skis but it seems like the neck has the fretboard of a mountain dulcimer with a gourd or "gourd-shaped" body.
    It's all good.
    The instrument played by Trio Mandili is a panduri, a traditional instrument from Georgia.
    I am a luthier specialising in historical and world stringed instruments. You can see more info at my website.

  19. The following members say thank you to Dusepo for this post:


  20. #11

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    Two sided instrument? Need to import this to mandolins. Two tunings, two genres, no neck bowing.

  21. The following members say thank you to Richard500 for this post:

    Dusepo 

  22. #12
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Brisbane, Australia
    Posts
    200

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    Very intriguing. If the tanbur is reversible, and has been flipped between the two segments of the video, then the only way I can make sense of it is that it has a very shallow body (the same thickness as the neck) with a soundboard on both sides, and on one of the sides a 'half bowl' body which has the bridge under it. Hard to see whether the half bowl is partially enclosed, or completely open at the neck end. Quite different sounds, that's for sure.

  23. The following members say thank you to tom.gibson for this post:

    Dusepo 

  24. #13
    Mando accumulator allenhopkins's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Rochester NY 14610
    Posts
    17,378

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard500 View Post
    Two sided instrument? Need to import this to mandolins. Two tunings, two genres, no neck bowing.
    It's been done, sorta. Turturro "Turnover," mandolin on one side, ukulele on the other. The overwhelming, successful appeal of this concept can be judged by the scarcity of mando/ukes you see being played.

    However, Elderly tried to get $900 for one they had a while ago. I played one once, at Vintage Fret Shop in Ashland NH. It combined a thin, tinny mandolin sound with a dull, plunky uke sound. I also considered purchasing one that Scott Freilich had at his old Top Shelf Music in Buffalo; he ended up selling it to a member of the Turturro family who wanted to collect all the Turturro instruments he could find (Nicholas Turturro was also "noted" for inviting the Peanut Ukulele; clearly a luthiery genius).

    So, good luck with the two-sided, reversible mandolin! There are some threads on the Turturro "Turnover," which you can search if you care to.
    Allen Hopkins
    Gibsn: '54 F5 3pt F2 A-N Custm K1 m'cello
    Natl Triolian Dobro mando
    Victoria b-back Merrill alumnm b-back
    H-O mandolinetto
    Stradolin Vega banjolin
    Sobell'dola Washburn b-back'dola
    Eastmn: 615'dola 805 m'cello
    Flatiron 3K OM

  25. The following members say thank you to allenhopkins for this post:

    Dusepo 

  26. #14
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Westchester, NY
    Posts
    30,736

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    Quote Originally Posted by allenhopkins View Post
    It's been done, sorta. Turturro "Turnover," mandolin on one side, ukulele on the other. The overwhelming, successful appeal of this concept can be judged by the scarcity of mando/ukes you see being played.

    However, Elderly tried to get $900 for one they had a while ago. I played one once, at Vintage Fret Shop in Ashland NH. It combined a thin, tinny mandolin sound with a dull, plunky uke sound. I also considered purchasing one that Scott Freilich had at his old Top Shelf Music in Buffalo; he ended up selling it to a member of the Turturro family who wanted to collect all the Turturro instruments he could find (Nicholas Turturro was also "noted" for inviting the Peanut Ukulele; clearly a luthiery genius).

    So, good luck with the two-sided, reversible mandolin! There are some threads on the Turturro "Turnover," which you can search if you care to.
    See, Allen... we have so much in common. I actually owned a Turturro Turnover (no, not the apple flavor). I agree it sounded like "not." Thin body and sound hole went through on both sides. More than you ever want to know about this maker and this instrument here: http://www.mugwumps.com/turturro.html
    Jim

    My Stream on Soundcloud
    Facebook
    19th Century Tunes
    Playing lately:
    1924 Gibson A4 - 2018 Campanella A-5 - 2007 Brentrup A4C - 1915 Frank Merwin Ashley violin - Huss & Dalton DS - 1923 Gibson A2 black snakehead - '83 Flatiron A5-2 - 1939 Gibson L-00 - 1936 Epiphone Deluxe - 1928 Gibson L-5 - ca. 1890s Fairbanks Senator Banjo - ca. 1923 Vega Style M tenor banjo - ca. 1920 Weymann Style 25 Mandolin-Banjo - National RM-1

  27. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Jim Garber For This Useful Post:


  28. #15
    Mando accumulator allenhopkins's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Rochester NY 14610
    Posts
    17,378

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    By the way, I meant to say that Nicholas Turturro "invented" the Peanut Ukulele, not "invited" it.

    Probably wouldn't "invite" one myself; got enough ukes for now...
    Allen Hopkins
    Gibsn: '54 F5 3pt F2 A-N Custm K1 m'cello
    Natl Triolian Dobro mando
    Victoria b-back Merrill alumnm b-back
    H-O mandolinetto
    Stradolin Vega banjolin
    Sobell'dola Washburn b-back'dola
    Eastmn: 615'dola 805 m'cello
    Flatiron 3K OM

  29. The following members say thank you to allenhopkins for this post:

    Dusepo 

  30. #16

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    Quote Originally Posted by allenhopkins View Post
    By the way, I meant to say that Nicholas Turturro "invented" the Peanut Ukulele, not "invited" it.

    Probably wouldn't "invite" one myself; got enough ukes for now...
    Interesting link to Jake’s site. He waxed effusive about this uke, so maybe Tuturro stumbled into something, but something best left to injection molding. I’m thinking about how the staves (ribs) have to be contoured to make this shape. I also note that the current molded bowl back uke is considered pretty good. Given the tendency for armchair acousticians to pull definitive theory out of (appropriately) thin air, we could have an extensive discussions on how a two-bowl instrument actually functions. Meanwhile, I gues the Peanut, as well as the Turnover are collectible curiosities regardless.

  31. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Richard500 For This Useful Post:


  32. #17
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Westchester, NY
    Posts
    30,736

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    I have also seen ukuleles made of two cocoanut shells glued together to make a similar body shape but I am guessing the cocoanut shells don’t sound as good. While I hated my turnover I’d love a peanut uke for the fun of it. Of course I don’t *need* it.
    Jim

    My Stream on Soundcloud
    Facebook
    19th Century Tunes
    Playing lately:
    1924 Gibson A4 - 2018 Campanella A-5 - 2007 Brentrup A4C - 1915 Frank Merwin Ashley violin - Huss & Dalton DS - 1923 Gibson A2 black snakehead - '83 Flatiron A5-2 - 1939 Gibson L-00 - 1936 Epiphone Deluxe - 1928 Gibson L-5 - ca. 1890s Fairbanks Senator Banjo - ca. 1923 Vega Style M tenor banjo - ca. 1920 Weymann Style 25 Mandolin-Banjo - National RM-1

  33. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Jim Garber For This Useful Post:


  34. #18
    Jo Dusepo, luthier Dusepo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    London, UK.
    Posts
    815

    Default Re: Have you ever seen anything like this?

    These peanut ukes remind me of the Oud Kumethra (meaning 'pregnant oud') which has a similar, but much larger shape and is built in the same way, with ribs. I've not built something of that shape, but I have built similar shapes with bowl-backs that bent into the neck, and it requires a bit more practice and sanding to get right but it's perfectly possible, so I imagine the peanut/kumethra shape works much the same way. Unfortunately difficult to find a picture of such a body which has not been decorated with an extra layer of decoration on top. Maybe this says something about how hard it is to get perfect joints!



    What struck me about the original video was the extra half-body on the top though. That was what I'd never seen before.
    I am a luthier specialising in historical and world stringed instruments. You can see more info at my website.

  35. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Dusepo For This Useful Post:


Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •