Fourth Finger or not to Fourth Finger, that is the question

[pops1]

There are times when I will shift up and use the ring finger, then in the next part I will come back down and do all the movement with the middle and ring instead of the index and middle. I think it is good to do both and use them when you think it feels better for you. I would not ever rule out the pinky, it is an essential finger in way too many tunes and even more essential when improvising leads in a closed finger position. I use that closed finger position in all of the leads I do when not in first position.

[Tobin]

When I look at a lot of players soloing they hang out in second position, grabbing that C with a third finger, dropping down to first only when they need to grab a B or an E. Has any one else noticed this?

The rules get more flexible when playing in closed positions, especially higher up the neck where the reaches aren't as far. One gets used to shifting a lot up there. But when in 1st position, getting that pinky into action is the best idea. It's much more efficient than shifting all the time when one doesn't need to.

[JeffD]

We are talking about what is standard, not what is right and wrong. One can depart from the standard in special circumstances, that doesn't mean there isn't a standard.

To my way of thinking, (just me), departing from the standard at times, for musical reasons, (playing up the neck, cool double stops available, next move is faster, etc.) or reasons of physical limitation, fine no problem. Avoiding the standard because it is easier to - well....

[Ivan Kelsall]

If you try to play a tune such as Herschel Sizemore's classic tune 'Rebecca' without using your little finger,you need to do a lot of unneccessary left hand movement. Some instrumentals were 'written' by players who use ALL fingers to maximum advantage & if you don't do that yourself,it's '' hard travellin' ''.

For me the question would be ''why not'' use your little finger ?. Here's Herschel playing 'Rebecca' & you can see the constant use of his little finger. Trying to fret those notes using another finger,as short as they are in duration,would be a challenge for the best pickers out there,
Ivan

[Dagger Gordon]

I had a wake-up call once when I had a tune with JP Cormier from Cape Breton.
He is a great player of guitar, fiddle and also mandolin, and it was just the 2 of us.

He has a huge repertoire and includes a number of tunes in keys other than the basic first position D and G etc.
It made me realise that my own playing was getting a bit predictable and that for most of the time I was hardly using my pinky. It is also true that I hardly played the first FRET.
But if you start regularly working out on tunes in F etc where you are indeed using the first fret, then the whole spread of your hand looks a bit different and you will probably find it helpful to use your pinky.
Furthermore, it is sometimes EASIER to play a tune out of first position, using the Bb note on the third string for example.

So to sum up, yes you can get away with hardly using the pinky - often just that B on the top string. But to generally strengthen your hand (not just your pinky) and get to know your way around the neck better -actually to become a better player - I think it is of great benefit to actively practise tunes in less usual keys and use all four fingers.

[AlanN]

If you try to play a tune such as Herschel Sizemore's classic tune 'Rebecca' without using your little finger,you need to do a lot of unneccessary left hand movement. Some instrumentals were 'written' by players who use ALL fingers to maximum advantage & if you don't do that yourself,it's '' hard travellin' ''.

For me the question would be ''why not'' use your little finger ?. Here's Herschel playing 'Rebecca' & you can see the constant use of his little finger. Trying to fret those notes using another finger,as short as they are in duration,would be a challenge for the best pickers out there,
Ivan

Terrific clip, Ivan. Had not seen this one before. And backed up by them Reno boys, to boot. Just great.

[Ivan Kelsall]

Hi Alan - I've had that clip on my PC for quite a while now - a good example of 'how to do it right' !. I played that Banjo back in 1992 in Owensboro - that's if it's Don Renos old banjo,which i'm pretty sure it is,
Ivan

[Manfred Hacker]

This discussion reminds me of "should I learn to read music".
And there will always be examples given of some great musician who does not read .....

[AlanN]

Hi Alan - I've had that clip on my PC for quite a while now - a good example of 'how to do it right' !. I played that Banjo back in 1992 in Owensboro - that's if it's Don Renos old banjo,which i'm pretty sure it is,
Ivan

I figure that clip is 20+ years old by now. Timeless, four shore

[guidoStow]

What a great project Scott! Thanks for bringing this wonderful interview and the research to our attention!

[Ausdoerrt]

It made me realise that my own playing was getting a bit predictable and that for most of the time I was hardly using my pinky. It is also true that I hardly played the first FRET.
But if you start regularly working out on tunes in F etc where you are indeed using the first fret, then the whole spread of your hand looks a bit different and you will probably find it helpful to use your pinky.
Furthermore, it is sometimes EASIER to play a tune out of first position, using the Bb note on the third string for example.

Yup, totally. I mean, try playing something in C#minor, for example, without the pinky

[Br1ck]

As a beginner, I got into the habit of just using three fingers because it was easier. As I learned more fiddle tunes, I began to realize the value of the pinkie. It kind of sucks to go backward on a piece you know, but relearning them with the pinkie is a good thing I think.

I've also been playing scales in every key, and I don't see how you could play the keys without open string notes any other way.

[RodCH]

My pinky callous is my second largest callous, after the index finger. A lot of passages (as I arrange them) tend to involve just those two fingers.

Since the point of mandolin is to stretch your fingers out along the fretboard instead of across it, you are giving up like 2 inches if you decide not to use your pinky. I can't see how that is a good thing.

I personally never had a strength issue with my pinky. Maybe I'm just lucky there. If I have a strength issue (causing buzzes) it tends to be my ring finger. No idea why. Everybody is different I guess.

[Sid Simpson]

I was sitting next to Reischman at a workshop with him. He corrected me when I used my pinky on the sixth fret, suggesting I save it for when I needed it. I believe the technical rule is two frets per finger, leaving the pinky for frets 7 and 8. Of course, mandolin players are a practical bunch and tend to focus on getting the job done. I think some of the more complex and technical stlyes likely reward following the "rules." Classical, choro, and jazz come to mind.

[jshane]

Sometimes you "need it" in other places on the fretboard. Like if you are playing:


F#-G-C#-D on the e and then a strings.... my pinky plays the "D"--- and that is nowhere near fret 7, and I sure as heck need it for that passage at speed.

I guess I am unsure just why someone would avoid using what amounts to 25% of your usable "fretting assemblage". What is the advantage of "saving it"?

[Mandoplumb]

The answer to use the picky or not is simple. Can you play any tune without using it? YES. Does it make it more difficult? YES so what's the answer use pinkie or not?

[Stevo75]

There are times when you would use the pinky for the 6th fret and would break the "two frets per finger" rule and that is when the "one finger per note in a scale" rule overrides it. For example, if you are playing an Ab major scale in first position, you would use your pinky finger for the sixth fret on the G, D, and A strings. Same with the Bb scale on the A and E strings. Just throwing this out there as an example of when to break the two frets per finger rule.

I was sitting next to Reischman at a workshop with him. He corrected me when I used my pinky on the sixth fret, suggesting I save it for when I needed it. I believe the technical rule is two frets per finger, leaving the pinky for frets 7 and 8. Of course, mandolin players are a practical bunch and tend to focus on getting the job done. I think some of the more complex and technical stlyes likely reward following the "rules." Classical, choro, and jazz come to mind.