Lloyd Loar and Gibson Corp dynamic during his tenure there...

[Jim Hilburn]

http://books.google.com/books?id=fgT...gibson&f=false

Here's a good read about Guy Hart. I haven't gotten Spann's book but this shows how thorough it is. However it shows that Hart didn't come to work at Gibson till after the development of the F-5.

[billkilpatrick]

the "the hart"

[Ivan Kelsall]

If as a development engineer,you have an idea(s) how you can improve something that's already on the market,the first thing you need to do is to put your ideas forward to 'whoever' & get them to sanction a trial version of 'whatever' with the new ideas incorporated. Since Lloyd Loar was an employee,i'd assume that he had to go through the bosses at Gibson to sanction a trial build with the new ideas built in. If the new build was successful,he'd most likely get the go ahead to build the mandolins incorporating the new design features - if not.............. !. We must remember that LL was an accomplished mandolin player himself & it wouldn't have been without a great deal of consideration on his part,that he'd have put any proposals forward,backed up by his opinions as an accomplished player. And we all know just how successful the new design came to be. It may very well be that some of the new design features were around prior to LL's tenure at Gibson,but it's not just the new design features themselves that make something a success,it's how they're put together as fully functional features within the product in question,
Ivan

[billkilpatrick]

makes sense - most committee endeavors carry the boss's name.

[grassrootphilosopher]

... Charlie played a Gibson J-35 with the Monroe Brothers...

Actually Charlie Monroe played a Gibson Jumbo (built around 1935). I´ve never seen him pictured with a J-35. The classic Monroe Bros. pic proves the Charlie Monroe Jumbo (http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...oeBrothers.jpg and http://www.lib.unc.edu/blogs/sfc/wp-...2/SFC_p970.jpg). We all know that he switched to a D-45 later but after he had to sell it he played a Grammer guitar... (http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_ubouXZnjid...onroefront.jpg).

[Fretbear]

Yeah, the J-35 (Gibson Trojan) was the next iteration of the Gibson Jumbo that Charlie played.
In the pictures of Charlie that Olaf linked above you can see the tighter (smaller sunburst) on his Jumbo than the wider one that the J-35 had (see link below) and also that it is not the fancier Advanced Jumbo because the headstock is adorned with only the Gibson logo, and not the diamond and arrowhead inlay.

"Gibson introduced this low-cost model during the depression because the $60 Jumbo was not selling well. The J-35 was essentially a lower cost Jumbo model with several changes ($35 initially, though the price increased to $47.25 by 1941 for a natural finish J-35). Initially the J-35 was introduced as a Gibson Trojan, but the name was quickly changed to J-35 (there really very little difference between a Trojan and the J-35). These changes gave the J-35 a lower cost, but also a smoother tonal response, compared to the Jumbo's big raw quick sound. About 3000 Jumbo 35 models were made, more than any other pre-WW2 Gibson flat top. The J-35 was also made in about four different bracing variations: three tone bars with scalloped or non-scalloped braces (1936-1939), and two tone bars with scalloped or non-scalloped braces (1939-1942)."

http://home.provide.net/~cfh/gibson6.html

[MikeEdgerton]

According to Spann's list of employees Guy Hart was employed from 1923 to 1948. The titles shown are Accountant, General Manager, and President. I would assume that was the order of his titles and that his first job may have had little to do with choosing what was produced. I could be wrong about that.

[AlanN]

Yeah, Hart's name is not mentioned nearly as often as Loar's is. I first saw it on the back of The David Grisman Quintet LP, Kaleidoscope F-5. One of the F-5 mandolins pictured on the back cover was described as a Loar-Hart.

I would stare at that cover....They all wore bellbottoms.

[Jim Hilburn]

It was around 74-75 when Siminoff wrote that they should be called "Loar-Harts" in Pickin' mag and everyone ran with it thinking it must be correct. But it wasn't.

[MikeEdgerton]

If I'm not mistaken the truss rod and the two piece bridge are attributed to individuals at Gibson. I don't have time to do a patent search right now.

[wsugai]

Whether he was or not, he sure knew how to market the thing!

Orville Gibson can rightly be considered the inventor of the 'American mandolin'. It is not a term that is in general use, but I think it should be.

[TEE]

Theodore Mchugh patented the adjustable bridge and truss rod in colaboration with L.A. Williams.
Some other Patents....

http://fox-guitars.com/Gibson_Patents.html

[BradKlein]

Whether he was or not, he sure knew how to market the thing!

Orville was not the marketing genius. The mandolin orchestra craze was accomplished by the company that bought his product and name, after he was gone. His contribution was the initial invention, primarily.