Holding and using the pick

[Pasha Alden]

Hi folks of mandoworld

Is there a specific way for holding the pick? Also once that is mastered: what is a good exercise for picking? Finally is it acceptable to use the fingers? Or is that the Brazilian way of playing? Is the use of the pick generally effective?

What is the longest the pick can last and how do determine when it is time for a new one?

Regards

Vanillamandolin

[bluenote23]

I hold the pick very loosely with my thumb and first finger with a little support from my middle finger. Ben Clark says to hold it so loosely that it almost feels like it's going to fall out of your hand. The direction you pick hits the strings is important. The pick should be parallel to the strings.

Compared to the guitar, I use a heavier and larger pick. I am use a fairly large, triangular Dunlop Ultex 1.14 mm pick. I haven't worn out any picks yet.

I started playing tunes I heard on the internet or on this forum, Old Joe Clark and Old Ebeneezer Scrooge, always alternate picking up-down-up-down. After six or eight weeks of noodling around like this, I was turned onto Ben Clark's video lessons and I find his broken scale exercises good for picking practice.

[Jim Garber]

There are many ways to hold the pick and many picks to hold as well.

As far as finger style: not very common but there is not reason not to, if you like it. In some mandolin orchestras, the conductor may ask that the accompanying sections play with fingers or just thumbs to not drown out the soloist.

AFAIK it is not generally the Brazilian way of playing. I play some choro and it is played with a pick on mandolin. The guitar players generally do play with fingers.

[Mike Bunting]

[QUOTE=Vannillamandolin;1117927]Hi folks of mandoworld

Is there a specific way for holding the pick? /QUOTE]
http://www.daddario.com/DADMediaLibr...0-b5bff12d8c18

[Pasha Alden]

Hi thanks to you Jim always such helpful advice and of course always something to learn. It's just that I produce a very interesting sound playing with my fingers, particularly when playing C and G.

Thanks Bluenote, that was also helpful.

I love this cafe. It will probably end up being my saving grace as there is no mando teacher in sight for miles, so videos, mando cafe and music is how I have to go about things.
Again my thanks
Vanillamandolin

[UncleDave]

This video shows D Grisman picking with his thumb for a bit. Interesting. It happens at :55
http://www.daddario.com/DADMediaLibr...grass_Festival

Thanks Mike for showing the D'Addario video link. Lots more good stuff to explore whilst recovering from the flu on NYE!

[UsuallyPickin]

On picks.... Don't over grip your pick. The wrist and hand need to be loose. Overgripping causes tension in the picking hand and that is to be avoided. If you don't drop your pick every once in awhile you are gripping it too tightly. A heavier pick takes awhile to get used to but it will produce a better tone. Remember play from your wrist nor your elbow..... Luck... R/

[Pasha Alden]

HI There

Thanks for this, it will help to work on the picking.

Hope the nasty flu bug leaves soon.

Vanillamando

[Pasha Alden]

Many thanks. Will remember those tips. I think at present I have a pick more suited for a guitar, kind of bought it with the mando, so not even sure of the make. Will sort that end January when I have the set up checked. Though I must say the scales are going on nicely and the strings are ringing.
Fingers slowly become less sensitive.

A prosperous new year to all of you in Mando world.

[mandopulu]

I personally love playing with my fingernails - of course they are a lot quicker and less prone to dropping than regular pricks. My music guru told me that while it's OK to do that, you should at least know how to use a pick. I haven't heard it on my (electric) mandolin, but on my (acoustic) banjo the difference in sound between pick and fingernail is quite clear, I've learned there are times when it just sounds nicer to use a pick. And of course sometimes fingernails break and have to be grown back.

Totally agree with R/ about holding it lightly, keep everything as loose as you can and feel the groove

I've known some of the mando players on the local (Irish folk) scene to scratch criss-cross patterns on their picks after they buy them - I don't know if it makes them any easier to hold though!



Pulu

[mandobassman]

Many great suggestions here, however, I would have to disagree with bluenote23's notion that the pick should be parallel to the strings. I have always felt that this is the way to achieve the worst tone. You may achieve more volume that way, but at the expense of tone. If you pick at an angle to the strings you will achieve a much warmer and more pleasing tone. This video of John Reischman shows a fine example of this. At 4:40 into the video he explains his pick hold and the affect on tone and you can clearly hear it. This is the way I have always held my pick. Basically, you need to do what is most comfortable for you and allows you to play cleaner. Not everyone plays the same. What works for John Reischman and Mike Marshall works very well indeed, but may not be right for you.

[bluenote23]

I stand corrected. Being a beginner, I shouldn't really be giving advice anyway.

[Mike Bunting]

Nothing is written in stone. From the cafe interview with Mike Compton,
"Q - Tell us about your right hand technique..pick, etc..thanks

A - Basically I hold the pick loosely between the ball of my thumb and the first joint in my index finger. The point is to create a fulcrum, to have a point of leverage. My remaining fingers are curled outwards in a sort of "fan" shape. (I heard someone say once that it helps to imagine holding a golf ball in your palm.) This loosens my wrist and forearm. Mostly the strings are struck with the pick held parallel to them , not at an angle. I like the tone a lot of pick pulls from the strings.
"

[Werner Jaekel]

Far from being the very good mandolinist I aim for I found the way to hold the pick depends on expression and speed of the tune before me. As a painter I hold the pick like a brush with thumb and first. Music and painting are very similar to me.

For expression and sentimental pieces very short, tip barely extruding finger tips with a very careful stroke varying pressure and contact. For faster pieces longer, half way, firm grip. Playing a set 3x3 the pick tend to vanish otherwise.

If you pick at an angle to the strings you will achieve a much warmer and more pleasing tone.

I agree with mandobassman.

The reason may be that the overtones are impaired. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overtone). With very fast playing overtones are drowned anyway, so the parallel attack would make no difference.

Usually I use the picks' tip only for slow pieces, otherwise the round side of it. My favourite pick Gibson Pure XH.

Thanks for this thread. Very interesting.

[Jordan S.]

Does anyone else rest (as a reference or anchor point) their ring and pinky fingers on the mandolin body as they pick with their thumb and first finger? Should I break that habit now and tuck those fingers loosely into my palm?

[Mike Bunting]

Break the habit right now. You can't pick just by wiggling your fingers around.
http://www.daddario.com/DADMediaLibr...21&MediaId=352

[Bertram Henze]

Does anyone else rest (as a reference or anchor point) their ring and pinky fingers on the mandolin body as they pick with their thumb and first finger?

You can either...

- rest ring and pinky and your middle finger as well and put an electric guitar under them all, or
- play the mandolin, letting your wrist do the motion

You decide.

[Jordan S.]

So I guess you know what world I came from, then...

[Bertram Henze]

So I guess you know what world I came from, then...

I guessed it, because I have seen it once: watch Mike Oldfield (basically a guitar player who always liked to toy with all kinds of other instruments) play the mandolin here; it works, but only because it is amplified. Without electric power, you can't just subtly order the volume from your amp, you must create it yourself.



Sometimes I pay a short visit to that world myself with my OM-tuned travel instrument, but even there I play wrist-based.

[8 String Samurai]

Well, this was timely! I was about to ask the very same question regarding resting fingers on the mandolin, as that's a habit I've found myself getting into (I guess my misspent metal guitar youth has been trying to return ). Thanks for the advice - I know what to focus on now...

[gauze]

my wrist still moves when I am resting my fingers on the surface of the mandolin.
I'm not windmilling a mando like pete townsend.

[tmsweeney]

Also the type of pick you use affects how you pick and the volume and tone

I know a lot bluegrass/Dawg players promote the big Wegan style picks but I have yet to try them
I used to use the little heavy purple tear drop dunlops - not so good for bluegrass but for other styles like old world or classical
they create a very clear bright tone
recently I've discovered exotic picks - tried the coconut shell - it has a nice scoop for your thumb but can be "clicky"
I tried camel bone and they are "crisp" but tend to cause a rattle like a snare drum as the pick drags away from the string
probably just my right hand technique or lack there of
what I like best now is the hoof or horn - the tone is a little muted compared to other materials but I like the warm feel ( as opposed to plastic) and the way it carry's the vibration back into my right hand/arm
hopefully a farmer somewhere is getting something out of that
best thing to do is try a few different picks until you find what works for you

[yankees1]

Go to petimarpress.com and there free videos on basic mandolin playing techniques.

[mandolinlee]

Here's my answer to the OP's question about pick life. I use the triangle shaped picks. Started w/ red Dunlop Tortex (.50 mm); then to the triangle shaped black Gibson medium and now use the White Clayton USA (.63 mm). The Tortex would wear down to be almost round, then start a new one. The black Gibsons, when new wore down like the Tortex, but as they aged (a student bought me 6 dozen several years ago) they would split and crack or have small 1/8 inch squares break out of them. The Claytons have been wearing well.

Yes, I use a thinner pick than is the norm on the 'cafe.

The secret to pick selection, is never be totally satisfied, always try something new.

When asked what the life of a sewing machine should be, Mr. Singer replied, "Only what it SEAMS".

Enjoy,

Lee

[Pasha Alden]

Hi ther

Many thanks. Presently experimenting with my fingers and I certainly think a different sound is achieved with a pick or with the fingers.

Am hesitant to play with the wrong kind of pick, lest I learn bad technique holding the pick. Though I am pleased to hear that even the old hands are still using their fingers for playing the mandolin and not just picks. <smile>