Would've Thought The Majority Of Mando Players Here Were Bluegras

[JeffD]

100% of the real mandolin players are bluegrass. There's some that play that other stuff, jazz and classical and whatnot but that stuff ain't no part of nuthin' on mandolin.

[frshwtrbob]

100% of the real mandolin players are bluegrass. There's some that play that other stuff, jazz and classical and whatnot but that stuff ain't no part of nuthin' on mandolin.

I play the mandolin but I'm not a "real" mandolin player.

[journeybear]

I don't know how you can tell, but maybe this is some indication:

Gonna stick with the "maybe" there. These are the genre fora, which receive a lot less traffic than General Mandolin Discussions - that is, these statistics do not indicate a representative sampling of the membership. I think the reason Classical is second on that list has something to do with people interested in that area being not so interested in popular music (ie, non-classical) as far as the mandolin goes, and thus hanging out in that forum rather than General. I can't say for sure, but this seems a reasonable assumption. Conversely, I'm pretty sure that rock players hang out in General more often than the Rock genre forum - proportionally, that is - judging by how often their contributions show up there. There is also an American bias, owing to the nationalistic breakdown of the membership.

I don't play a lot of bluegrass, though I have explored it and gone to a lot of festivals and picking parties, and even had a band going for a little while, and still play it occasionally in two of my bands, though not as a prominent part of the repertoires. I came to it from a rock background, and it was an instrument that I could play (after failed attempt at guitar and more successful experience with bass), and sounded pleasant to my ears, which kept me interested long enough to become reasonably proficient on it. But it was music I wanted to play, not necessarily any one genre, and the mandolin was a means of facilitating this, as well as enabling self-expression via songwriting in addition to instrumental playing. Of course, I learned to play bluegrass - it was expected, after all - but I saw no reason to limit myself to one genre, but rather tried to play in as many as I could, reflecting my own varied musical tastes. (I would have to add swing, calypso, and reggae to Jeff's list in post #20, though that could be just me.)

I say all this by way of explaining why I believe there is more, much more, that the mandolin is capable of doing than playing bluegrass. Indeed, I bristle when it is suggested that that is what is expected of it, or all it is meant to do, even though that is the most common association most people have with it. I have come to pretty much expect that attitude from people unfamiliar with the instrument, as bluegrass IS probably its most common application - at least as far as the general public knows. But here, where people have had considerable experience with the mandolin and have hopefully explored its capabilities, it is actually disheartening to learn people still cling to what I see is a somewhat antiquated view of the mandolin. I would like to think mandolinists have evolved since the heyday of bluegrass - over fifty years ago. I'm all for the instrument being played as well as possible, but that includes more, much more, than bluegrass.

As much as David Grisman and others have accomplished since then, and even though there have been some big pop hits featuring mandolin, and it does show up in country and rock more often than it used to, it still plays a larger role, proportionately, in bluegrass than any other popular music form (in America, anyway, though certainly not in Italy. ) And even with their involvement in a tradition that has deep roots and goes back decades, it shouldn't come as that much of a surprise that bluegrass players here do NOT represent a majority. I would hope they wouldn't be; the instrument and its players and applications should have been evolving. I would also not be surprised if bluegrass players represent a sizable minority, perhaps the largest one. It's understandable, as so many excellent mandolinists have played bluegrass and had long careers playing lots of shows and producing lots of recordings, thus contributing greatly to public awareness of the instrument. It is also a genre which provides many opportunities for mandolinists to play very impressive instrumental passages, and even lead a band and become a star. But the mandolin, like most instruments, is capable of being played in a great variety of ways. Personally, I resent being pigeonholed, being subjected to the assumption that since I play mandolin I must play bluegrass. I understand when someone comes up to me from the audience or on the street and assumes this - it's probably all they know - but at the Café, people should know better.

Ultimately, sadly, as much as we love our mandolins, we are pretty small fish in a pretty small pond. As long as we play an instrument mostly known for playing a small niche genre with a minuscule market share and very limited visibility or public awareness, we're bound to be stuck here in pretty stagnant waters. Apologies to Bill Monroe, but as far as most people are concerned, both bluegrass and mandolin ain't no part of nothin'.

[JEStanek]

I'm with Jack Roberts on this except I listen to less Bluegrass than other genres but I do appreciate a good BG instrumental. Some may consider it heretical but I can't listen to Bill Monroe recordings for more than a song or so. I like how Compton and others perform his music I just can't handle the recording quality and that high lonesome singing.

I do bet the majority of viewers, users of this forum are likely to be BG folks but when you've got multiple genres to pick from the majority may be in the 30% range and not the 50-80% range.

Jamie

Jamie

[journeybear]

Sorry for the length of my rant, but not the gist of it. I may be overthinking this stuff - happens - but some things just set me off, and one of them is people underthinking things. Anyway ... It may well be true that more viewers are interested in bluegrass applications than any other single genre, but that does not constitute a majority - there are way too many genres - but rather the largest minority. Maybe I could have just left it there, guess I couldn't ... Oh well ...

[drbluegrass]

I plead plain ol' ignorance. I've only been interested in playing mandolin for about a year or so and I'm relatively new here. I do have a strong preference for BG on the mandolin but I also really like jazz (especially swing) on the mando too. Can't say that I can remember hearing classical played on a mandolin but I'd like to hear it.


Tom

[JEStanek]

Since it's Bach's birthday....

[Beanzy]

Mandolin brought bluegrass to me.
I've avoided too much of the ITM so far as I played so much on the whistles etc there's no point in doing that yet.
classical is just so much part of what I've always done I can't imagine not doing it.
But my core pursuit is the BG & OT jamming at the moment.

One thing I would say is this is an English language forum so we'll get a very poor 1st hand perspective on the non-english speaking world where the mandolin holds a cente stage place in the music culture. I'm thinking specifically of Italy & Greece here.

[Jim Yates]

I enjoy playing bluegrass and would not want to give it up, but I would go nuts if it were all I could play. I love playing jug band tunes and Irish, Welsh, Celtic, blues, folk, swing and even a bit of classical mandolin. My sister-in-law is Lithuanian and I have learned a few tunes from her culture. My daughter-in-law, while she was born in Canada, is of Filipino heritage and I have learned some Filipino tunes on the banduria as a result. I have arranged Joseph Spence tunes from the Bahamas for twin mandolins and today was working on a twin mandolin version of Irving Berlin's Blue Skies. I'm no David Grisman, just a fairly average mandolin player, but I have varied tastes.

[Bernie Daniel]

I enjoy playing bluegrass and would not want to give it up, but I would go nuts if it were all I could play. I love playing jug band tunes and Irish, Welsh, Celtic, blues, folk, swing and even a bit of classical mandolin. My sister-in-law is Lithuanian and I have learned a few tunes from her culture. My daughter-in-law, while she was born in Canada, is of Filipino heritage and I have learned some Filipino tunes on the banduria as a result. I have arranged Joseph Spence tunes from the Bahamas for twin mandolins and today was working on a twin mandolin version of Irving Berlin's Blue Skies. I'm no David Grisman, just a fairly average mandolin player, but I have varied tastes.

And you have a massive collection of Canadian fiddle tunes to learn on your mandolin starting from Western onto the Ottawa Valley and then to Cape Breton!! Good luck!

[JeffD]

Can't say that I can remember hearing classical played on a mandolin but I'd like to hear it.

[Appalachia]

I'm not a fan of bluegrass at all. I got into the mandolin during my freshman year of high school from hearing Eric Robertson play a menagerie of styles around campus during lunches and after school. I liked the sound of the mandolin, but initially the main reason I wanted to start playing one was because of the size; I wasn't a fan of the width of the fingerboard on guitars, but didn't mind the the extra stretch going along the fingerboard that happens on mandolins from the fifths tuning. This meant that I was really introduced to the instrument independent of genre, which I think is a good thing, because, honestly, if I had been introduced to the mandolin through bluegrass, I doubt I would've ever had an interest in it.

Now, more on styles. I'm not into bluegrass, jazz, classical, klezmer, celtic, swing, blues, and many of the other mainstays, so I'd say that I'm probably in a very small minority on this board. As for what styles I am interested in, others would probably classify it as newgrass, but I feel as though newgrass has become used to describe any new music with bluegrass instrumentation, which is just too broad to be useful in my opinion. The Punch Brothers latest album is probably the closest thing to an example I could give for what I'm into, but it isn't quite adequate; while it's most definitely not a bluegrass album, it still has it's heritage in bluegrass. To clarify a little more I'd say that the mandolin music I'm most into is acoustic indie-pop with and experimental slant towards chord progressions and melody (that's a mouth-full). Pretty much I'm interested in the "what isn't quite yet to be" (that makes me sound like a trendster; I promise, I'm not). I'm definitely more interested in the percussive chordal use of the mandolin than it's melodic use, just not a constant every offbeat percussive chordal use .

[pefjr]

A good number of mandolin players, and thus a good number of Cafe folks, are interested in more than one style of music.

Correct, can't hold down a musician to one genre, that'd be cruel and unusual punishment. Can't hold them to one musical instrument either. I told the wife this , but... she said, " Stop right there!.. I ain't buying nothing beyond what you just said!!"

[JeffD]

[QUOTE]

This meant that I was really introduced to the instrument independent of genre, which I think is a good thing,

I guess I can say the same thing. I was (and still am) more enamored of the mandolin, than any particular type of music played on it. Its good for me at least because it keeps things fun.

Now, more on styles. I'm not into bluegrass, jazz, classical, klezmer, celtic, swing, blues, and many of the other mainstays,

I was going to make a joke here, and say "So umm... I guess that leaves, umm... acoustic indie-pop with and experimental slant towards chord progressions and melody." But I won't.

so I'd say that I'm probably in a very small minority on this board.

Aren't we all?

Seriously for a second. I like it all. I really do. My main passions change, but I don't dislike too much. Who knows, I may even develop a passion for acoustic indie-pop with and experimental slant towards chord progressions and melody, once I hear some. I understand it "isn't quite yet to be".



The main thing is, however, and always has been, the instrument itself, for the reasons you mentioned plus my own contrarian anti-whatever is too popular leanings.

[Jim Yates]

And you have a massive collection of Canadian fiddle tunes to learn on your mandolin starting from Western onto the Ottawa Valley and then to Cape Breton!! Good luck!

I do play many Canadian Fiddle tunes on the mandolin, Bernie, and attend local old time fiddle contests (as a spectator - my fiddle playing is restricted to inside my house when my wife and the cats are all out).
I often play through books of Canadian fiddle tunes compiled by Don Messer and Jamie Snider and others. I don't know why that slipped my mind.

[journeybear]

... the mandolin music I'm most into is acoustic indie-pop with and experimental slant towards chord progressions and melody ...

Now just a second - that's a typo, right? Did you mean to say "acoustic indie-pop with an experimental slant towards chord progressions and melody?" That makes grammatical sense to me. Musical sense, too.

I'm definitely more interested in the percussive chordal use of the mandolin than its melodic use, just not a constant every offbeat percussive chordal use .

I hear you. The rhythmic role for mandolin in bluegrass, in its customary, traditional application, IS pretty limiting. It keeps things moving, though, and in opposition with the bass playing on the down beat it can really swing. But yeah, there is a whole lot more you can do with it than that, and if you are interested in exploring these possibilities you will probably find more satisfaction in other genres. That's one thing I like about all three acts I play in - each operates in a few genres, and I get to mix it up a lot. It's been a long time since I played in a strictly bluegrass band, and that role - chop a lot, pick a little (sounds like a song from "The Music Man," doesn't it?) - is something I don't miss. But I do use it when called for, and even throw it in sometimes in non-bluegrass tunes. It's one tool in the toolbox, one color in the pallette, and while it would be a drag if that's all you ever got to do, it would be a shame not to use it when it's the right thing at the time.

[Appalachia]

Now just a second - that's a typo, right? Did you mean to say "acoustic indie-pop with an experimental slant towards chord progressions and melody?" That makes grammatical sense to me. Musical sense, too.

Yep, that's a typo. Thanks.

[drbluegrass]

Thanks Jeff. That was very cool.


Tom

[JeffD]

I am going out on a limb here, but I am going to guess that there are more choro fans than there are bluegrass fans. While Brazil only has 2/3 the population of the US, choro is a lot more popular in Brazil than bluegrass is in the US. I might even guess that there are more choro mandolin/bandolim players than bluegrass mandolin players.

That doesn't show up in the cafe statistics, however.