What kind of mando for Celtic/Irish music?

[michaelpthompson]

I saw that rotary knob and wondered. Obviously doesn't have the newer digital electronics like the current models. Even the celebrity would probably have a better preamp than that, at least for control. Or perhaps not, I may be reading too much into the analog type control knob. After all, some people believe that nobody has yet improved on 1950s era humbucker pickups for electric guitars. :-)

Thanks for the tip, I was seriously jonesing for that from the description, but for what I'm doing, you're probably right about the Celebrity.

And FoldedPath, thanks for the tip. I've written etiquette guidelines for sessions myself, though I'm usually somewhat of an anarchist. A lot depends on the personality of the session. Some are very TRAD, others are more free form. The one I play now even allows sheet music!

[mikeyes]

That's what I've been led to understand also, although again we're talking here mainly about how they started to show up in trad revival bands like Planxty, and more recently in groups like Dervish. I could be wrong here, but I get the impression that the use of mandolins in pub sessions has been a more recent thing in the last 10 or 20 years, following on the coat-tails of bouzoukis and trying to find a way to fit in among the louder melody instruments.

Mick Moloney played the mandolin in his first album of tunes and was playing it in London in 1969 when I first saw him. Mandolins have been around the scene for as long as the Mckenna inspired banjo has and possibly longer than zouks. The use in pub sessions may be later, however.

[Jill McAuley]

Aye, there's a track on "Paddy in the Smoke" (live recording of London pub sessions) that features a mandolin playing priest if I'm not mistaken, circa '69-'70? Would have to check the liner notes for exact tune, player and date recorded...

Cheers,
Jill

[Daithio]

Capt. Francis O'Neill refers to the mandolin in his "Irish Minstrels and Musicians" (1913). He writes of a Thomas F Kiley, a friend of Edward Cronin (who contributed many tunes to O'Neill's collections), "'The Connemara Fiddle,' as we facetiously termed the mandolin, was his favorite instrument, however. In playing Irish dance music he displayed a facility of execution almost inconceivable."

[Jill McAuley]

Aye, there's a track on "Paddy in the Smoke" (live recording of London pub sessions) that features a mandolin playing priest if I'm not mistaken, circa '69-'70? Would have to check the liner notes for exact tune, player and date recorded...

Cheers,
Jill

Ok, got home and looked this up: Paddy in the Smoke was first released in 1968, and the recordings were done on location at London's "The Favourite" pub - in the liner notes it mentions 1966 as being when the first session was played at The Favourite. The track in question featuring the mandolin playing priest features "Father O'Keeffe" on the mandolin and "Tommy Maguire" on accordion, playing a few jigs - "Condon's Frolics/James McMahon's Favourite".

Cheers,
Jill

[Avi Ziv]

Jill - that's a fabulous recording. Been listening to it for a number of years

Cheers,

[fatt-dad]

I'm kind of with Brent on this one. I say go loud or go home. The arched top f-hole mandolins (a-body is my preference) are just louder - you can hear yourself in a jam. Think about your fiddle players: You think they have one for Irish, bluegrass and old-time? No - they have one in standard tuning and another in cross tuning. Nobody messed with different body or hole shapes. Nobody started using black walnut or mahogany. It's setup and technique.

Got to be heard though!

f-d

[Paul Kotapish]

From 1966:

[Eddie Sheehy]

Derek Wardell of the Wolfe Tones was playing mandolins in the 60's - made an impact on me then. I had an old bowlback that I noodled on in the late 60's. A few local musicians also had mandos in the late 60's. I credit Derek as the innovator. The zouk was introduced in the late 60's by Moynahen, Lunney, and Irvine.

[Jill McAuley]

Jill - that's a fabulous recording. Been listening to it for a number of years

Cheers,

Indeed it is - great selection of players and great selection of tunes!

Cheers,
Jill

[michaelpthompson]

Just downloaded and listened to it. Some great craic in there all right.

[chasgrav]

I'll second Steve-o's suggestion of a National RM-1 resonator mandolin. I have one that I use for Irish sessions (not bluegrass, though). It's loud, but sweet and pleasing to the ear. It meshes very well with fiddles, boxes, etc.... It's also beautiful, and extremely well-crafted. Great for Celtic, blues, jazz, oldtime, folk, etc.... Just not a great bluegrass instrument, IMO.

My Gibson A50 is very sad and lonely and may be headed for the classifieds soon.

[michaelpthompson]

Have to admit, I really like that vintage look. I've played in sessions with banjos and resonator guitars and nobody objected, and this actually looks nicer. And I hear good things about the way they sound too.

[Tim2723]

Even as the Ovation Guy, I'll third (?) the National Resonator for the job at hand. Very loud, beautiful instrument. Maybe bit more than the budget. They're around the two grand mark. Not that much more than a new MM-68 though.

[danb]

Late to the party here- but for what it's worth..

the best mando for Irish is the one you have. Pick it on sound, what floats your personal boat, what you can afford, what brings you joy. Be really up-front with yourself about that decision, and never let the instrument hold you back mentally.

There are great ones in the big bucks range, but the biggest thing about picking your axe is mental. You gotta love it

[Bertram Henze]

There are great ones in the big bucks range, but the biggest thing about picking your axe is mental. You gotta love it

Yep, sometimes it takes a reminder what is important.
Who would go to a party with an escort because his wife is too ugly?

[Tim2723]

I'll agree that you should love the instrument you choose, but the instrument has to do the job in order for you to love it in the long run. I can't say how many mandolins I've really loved playing yet rejected simply because they couldn't do what I needed them to. How many of us end up with a mandolin that mostly gathers dust because it isn't the one we need for the jam? Both criteria need to be met. There are thousands of posts here that go something like "I love my XYZ, but I need something louder, brighter, darker, yadda yadda."

Isn't that kind of what this thread started out as? "I've got this mandolin but I need something else..."

[Bertram Henze]

Isn't that kind of what this thread started out as? "I've got this mandolin but I need something else..."

If I need something else, I don't really love it. But some might ask this question on behalf of complete strangers in a session, and those are the ones who don't count.

It does its job for me => I love it.
It does its job for somebody else => nothing

[Tim2723]

Well yeah, Bertram, that's pretty much it. You might love the style, the look, the finish, the playability, the tone, the mojo, everything. But if it's not loud enough, then you won't end up loving it. Or rearrange those in any order you choose and add others as you see fit. They all have to work to be the prefect mandolin.

[Brent Hutto]

I don't want to run afoul of JeffD but personally I would not participate in any gathering for which my favorite instrument does not suffice. If I have a good-sounding, fun to play, well made ff-hole mandolin I'm not about to go blow a whole evening of my life sitting around "making music" on some instrument I don't like as well just to fit in or so I can hear what I'm playing.

But perhaps I undervalue the sheer joy of having my ears assaulted by fiddles, banjos and resonators for a few hours.

[Bertram Henze]

perhaps I undervalue the sheer joy of having my ears assaulted by fiddles, banjos and resonators for a few hours.

Seriously, you probably do
Amongst the best sessions I ever attended were the ones I emerged from with tinnitus in my ears.

[Tim2723]

...personally I would not participate in any gathering for which my favorite instrument does not suffice..

But if your favorite instrument seldom sufficed, would it remain your favorite for long?

[Brent Hutto]

Chicken and egg I guess. If I spent most of my time in loud sessions perhaps it would not have become my favorite. But I don't so it did but if I did it wouldn't have. Or something like that.

What's the old saying? A chicken is just an egg's way of making more eggs.

[Jill McAuley]

I think Dan B's post hits the nail on the head.

Also, for folks who are mentioning "what if you love your mandolin but it's not loud enough, so it's not up to the job?" - well here's my tuppence worth: we're mandolin players, we're not going to compete volume wise in a session - for myself, I just want to go along and play and have a bit of craic. If lack of volume affected my enjoyment (which it doesn't), I'd bring the tenor banjo. One thing that will put a dent in my enjoyment is an instrument that I don't enjoy playing - crummy action, neck profile that doesn't suit me, those are the things that would make me want to put it back in it's case.

For Michael, regarding the Nationals - you see them going second hand a fair bit in around the $1200-1400 range. I've considered one sometimes as it'd be good for busking with, unusual enough to catch the eye and get the punters to pause, and perhaps drop a few quid in the case while they're there.

Cheers,
Jill

[Steve-o]

For Michael, regarding the Nationals - you see them going second hand a fair bit in around the $1200-1400 range. I've considered one sometimes as it'd be good for busking with, unusual enough to catch the eye and get the punters to pause, and perhaps drop a few quid in the case while they're there.

Cheers,
Jill

Elderly has a used National RM-1 up for sale. I played it a couple weeks ago and the action and sound were excellent IMO. Wish I had the cash to pick it up.