Variations on tunes

[Paul Brett]

I've played with a fairly wide variety of musicians and like the Irish language depending on where you're from your tune/accent is a little different. I'm from Kilkenny, Ireland, and while the tradition is strong at the moment there has never been a "Kilkenny sound" like you describe Donegal fiddle playing or the Sligo flute players. That's not to say that there are no distinctive musicians around me and I have had the pleasure of playing with people who have infinitely more talent than me.

My predicament is when I try to learn a tune by ear I find it difficult to find a common denominator for the tune. Take St Anne's Reel, a tune I learned from a group of musicians at a session in Kilkenny. I then met a flute player from Cork who played the second part completely different and I couldn't follow it. Then take my favourite recording of it from the transatlantic sessions and there are slight variations in part A and more distinct variations on part B. So I looked up some tab and lo and behold the tab is different to all the versions I've heard. In fact I've never found 2 pieces of tab that match. This isn't exclusive to St Anne's, but to many tunes. I understand the way the tunes have travelled, the oral way of passing them on and I guess different styles have complimented the tunes. So finally to the question.

Is there a best source of tunes? Somewhere to find the basic tune without any ornamentation or am I left to wander the vast forest of variation?

[Bren]

Even the "basic" tune will differ quite a lot from one notation to the next, let alone form one player to the next.

For what it's worth, I found the versions notated in the [Ho-ro-gheallaidh] series of books to be the best basis for playing with a variety of musicians from different backgrounds. Also from Scotlands music
Only a basis, mind! (and I mean " best among notation sources" - learning by ear from good players is still the best)

Although the focus is on Scottish tunes, the selection of Irish tunes in these books are the nearest thing to a common repertoire you'll find

[M.Marmot]

I'd imagine that for Irish sessions then O'Neill's 1001 would be the very fella that'd see you through manys the session...

I'm no expert with regards playing tunes, its something that i'm only turning to recently, but i'll volunteer my own thoughts with regards tunes and ornamentation.

Um, basically i figure that most tunes are often encountered, in playing, recordings, tabs and notation already pre-ornamented and the problem seems to be that folks learn from these sources verbatim, then when playing if anything veers from this learned version spanners do be thrown in the works.

These days i figure first you get familiar with the tune, listen to it, maybe even different versions of it, then practice it stripping away any thing that seems excess, and try and find the essential parts that make its identity, the rhythm, the basic melody points, and thats what you internalize, then you use that skeleton as a foundation to ornament on.

I'll give a link to an interview with Robin Bullock (who,i believe, has known to prowl these boards from time to time) who discusses something like this approach with more coherence than me http://www.mandozine.com/resources/CGOW/bullock.php

I feel that if learning tunes are approached in this manner then it allows you more lee way to adapt in a session as you are not comitted to playing pre-set ornaments but you will be sure of the integral tune structure and can move from this to adapt to the demands of the session. Also it does not preclude the possibility that you may work up a tune as a favorite piece with your own ornamentations for leading or solo playing.

But, take my advice with a grain of salt, its offered honestly and its the course that i have set myself, but there are other more qualified hands here-a-bouts who may offer their own take on things.

[Paul Brett]

Thanks for the responses, just last night I got in an argument with a guy over which verse went where on the song Paddy's Green Shamrock Shore. One of us had the Paul Brady version and the other had a version learned from a session. Balancing 3 kids under 6 and trying to keep my collection of tunes expanding is getting hard.

[Steve L]

I wouldn't rely on O'Neills (or really any printed source) for definitive settings of session tunes. The Foinn session sets (the CDs, not the books) from the Comhaltas are a decent foundation but nothing is really set in stone.

Bren, I'm saying this just realizing I've never seen the book you mentioned but I have heard it's a good one.

[DougC]

I assume you play mandolin. That in itself poses some technical concerns. But the answer to your question of WHY the music is different on most every source is that it has ornamentation and melodic variation. You knew that - right? Well learning how to do the ornamentation and even some melodic variation yourself will give you a huge advantage in parsing out the 'core' of the tunes. Also learning where they are usually placed in a tune helps.
Look for:

• double stops
• triplets
• cuts or grace notes
• short and long rolls
• slurs
• slides
• crans etc.

See Q-12 and Q-12 in Robin Bullock's interview link above. It's very clear and from a mandolin player too!

[Jill McAuley]

I wouldn't rely on O'Neills (or really any printed source) for definitive settings of session tunes. The Foinn session sets (the CDs, not the books) from the Comhaltas are a decent foundation but nothing is really set in stone.

Bren, I'm saying this just realizing I've never seen the book you mentioned but I have heard it's a good one.

I'd second the recommendation of the Foinn recordings as a decent enough source for basic, no frills versions of tunes. That said there's nothing to say that they're the definitive versions of the tunes, I don't think you'll really find that anywhere. In many ways the version of the tune that matters, in all our cases, is the one that is played at our own local sessions.

Cheers,
Jill

[taterbugman]

Get what you think the tune sounds like in your head, then play it the way YOU hear it... I play one skrewed up version of King of the Faeries, but it's what I hear in my head every time i sit down to play. Plus everyone I've played it for that knows it still recognizes it and usually says "I like your version of that". In the big picture, we play to please ourselves, right?