"Getting into Jazz Mandolin"

[montana]

Been working on the book "Getting into Jazz Mandolin" for a month now. I have tried to work with it as much as possible but it's hard to practice scales because of the hand streach and they are not fun(boaring). Still I know this is a great thing to do. Here is how I work with the book maybe some of you can relate how you work at it.

I've figured out the first 4 exercises are recorded at 120mm per 1/8 note (again it ticks me off the authors don't add mm markers). I start a new exercise and work on it till I get to the recorded tempo and start the next piece when I can play it at 60mm. So now I have 5 pieces I'm working on at various tempos none of which are at the desired tempo but slowly getting faster and cleaner. Hopefully they will all get to the right tempo eventually but I can see that this is going to take a lot longer to get through than I thought.

[CES]

As a beginner, it's been relatively slow going for me as well, but I'm finding significantly improved dexterity and strength just by doing the FFcP excercises at the beginning. I'm trying to get to the point that I have those down and know what I'm doing with the respective scales before I get into the tunes, because otherwise I'll never go back to the first part of the book.

I've been trying to minimize the "boring" part by working the scale exercises for 15-20 minutes and then working on tunes (in another book currently, but probably in the Jazz book within the next few weeks).

There's a lot of meat crammed into the book, so don't get too discouraged with what you feel is slow progress. It just takes time, unfortunately.

Good luck!

[David Horovitz]

While I don't have the Getting into jazz mandolin book, I'm familiar with the FFcP exercises Ted has been sharing for some time. The hardest note sequences for me to play are where you are supposed to fret with the pinky and play on adjacent strings (fifths up or fourths down). For example, 4th string, 7th fret, followed by 3rd string, 7th fret - each note with the pinky. This is hard enough to do cleanly and with little pain at slow tempo. I can play this with the other three fingers but it's just painful and hard to get a clean tone with pinky. I feel I have good hand position and have been playing for 10 years, so I don't consider myself a beginner in that sense. How many feel they can actually play this at what they would consider "full" tempo - i.e., what you would play during an actual performance or jam with others?

In my observations of professional players, I hardly ever see someone play with the pinky in this way. Is this really a practical thing to work on or only a means of stretching the fingers to enable more fluid playing with more natural/comfortable fingering (1st, 2nd or 3rd fingers)? I understand the concept of playing any scales/arpeggio in any position and starting from any finger, but the fact is there are just some fingerings that will never be as comfortable or practical as others.

[Steve Gorman]

I have been doing exactly what you are doing for 8 months or more. Dedicating myself to Ted's FFcP scales, just the four stock patterns, has improved my playing more that I can say. If you don't stop and just keep practicing consistently EVERY DAY for at least 15 minutes in a month you will be a lot better in 6 months you won't look at the finger board the same. If you practice an hour or more a day within six months you won't recognize yourself. The whole FFcP thing was the greatest musical contribution in my life. JUST BE CAREFUL! You can hurt yourself if your not paying close attention to your technique. Take lots of breaks and never allow a tendon to hurt. I think I posted on how to do contrast baths to cure tendon problems, lemme know if you want that info.


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[swinginmandolins]

I've been using the FFcP's for a few years now and I have to say they are more than useful in developing technique and playing ability. I use my pinky quite a bit when playing chord solo pieces especially, also good for doublestops among other things. One thing I did to strengthen my pinky is to do hammer ons and pull offs with it.
It can be boring doing scales and modes, but you can also make it now so by varying your right hand, and or the tempo. Another thing to consider is it may be boring but it is burning those tones into you head and soon you will be able to figure out melodies pretty easy as your mind and fingers will connect. I say keep on track with the book, Ted has a good system and knows what he is talking about.

[swampstomper]

I second (third? fourth?) the value of FFcP. In the specific case mentioned of adjacent string pinky (e.g. in the approach tones exercise from 1st FFcP), and also in the case of 2nd FFcP with the very long stretch between the 3rd and 4th, and 7th and 8th, realistically I don't use those particular combinations in many songs BUT I do use those positions a lot, so becoming familiar with each way to play a note on the fingerboard has opened things up tremendously for me.

BTW Mike Marshalls "Improvisational Concepts" book from his series starts right out with "4 ways to play the same scale", i.e. FFcP.

Now to keep it from getting boring: (1) agree to limit pure exercises to 10-15 minutes for a typical motivated amateur (e.g. me) -- and yes, stop if it hurts!!!, (2) enjoy the exercises by really concentrating on tone quality and smoothness of expression (Ted emphasizes this over and over!) and making nice sounds, (3) vary them by sometimes playing straight 8ths, sometimes swing them, sometimes Irish DUDDUD... you get the fretboard workout while at the same time working on right hand, (4) try to apply some of the techniques in your tunes or variations -- you will impress yourself and see the value of it.

For example I like Durham's Reel, which of course is in A. Move your hand up a half-fret and take the tune up to Bb (in "second position"), using 1st FFcP (which is where you start in first position in A anyway) -- that's easy enough with the I and V chords (Bb and F, were A and E) which are both in 1st FFcP, but more challenging (!) with the IV chord (Eb, was E) which you will find under your fingers -- without moving your hand -- at 4th FFcP. That's right, leading off with the pinky. The trick is to keep your hand in one position and see which FFcP you are in. In that same position the II chord (used in the bridge) is a C (was B) which is now sitting somewhat less comfortably in 2nd ffCP.

Then -- I repeat this exercise but now starting with Bb in 2nd FFcP (i.e. "first position"). Now you have the Bb and F arpeggios from 2nd FFcP but the Eb is now in 1st FFcP (1st fret 3rd string) and the C is now in a very comfortable 3rd FFcP.

This way I learn my FFcP while still playing music. And you hear alternative voicings which maybe later you want to try in other setttings.

HTH -- all I can say is, keep it up and you won't regret it.

[mando.player]

In terms of practicality, I like to view the FFcP exercises like working out. Athletes perform all sorts of exercises on a daily basis to prepare themselves for games. Some of it is completely applicable to their sport of choice and some of it is conditioning. On 4th and goal you're not going to see a lineman get down and do 100 situps or bench press 400lbs. But the mere fact that they can do these things helps them get the job done when the time comes.

You may not fret your pinky and index finger on adjacent strings very often, but when you do use your pinky the added dexterity will be noticeable. That exercise prepares your pinky to do other more practical tasks.

Hopefully that made sense...LOL

[pickloser]

I agree with Swampstomper--work on tone and fluidity and speed will come. At first, I tried to speed through the book as well as the exercises. That was a mistake; GiJM shows its value best with a cumulative effect over time, I think. I believe it has noticeably improved my playing. I spend about 20 minutes on GiJM on most days. If I really don't feel like doing it--I don't, which makes it seem less like work.

You might want to look at this thread: http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/sh...ad.php?t=47570

[montana]

Did you just work on the 4 scales and get them up to speed first 120mm before going on or continue on after you could play them comfortably at a slower tempo?

[JonZ]

I have been using FFCP a little differently, as described in the Adventures in Super-Efficient Mandolin Practice thread. Without going into a lot of detail, I use a computer program to schedule practice on each scale according to how well I am able to play it. This takes advantage of what memory scientists call "the spacing effect", which states that the best time to practice something is just before it is fading from memory. I have also mixed in four-note diatonic patterns starting from each finger. As my facility with a scale or pattern improves, I increase my speed goal.

This method keeps things interesting because I am not just plowing through the same exercises each day. It also helps you to have each scale or pattern available to memory out of context from what you usually play before and after. Ted's warm up has you play the major scale before each variation, but I found that playing the variations as separate exercises makes them more accesible for improvisation.

[MandoNicity]

I just got my copy today and thumbing through it, it looks to be some solid stuff! It has so much more then Ted has on his site. Haven't had a chance yet to work through it, but it looks to be just what I am looking for.