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Thread: deletion

  1. #26
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    Default Re: deletion

    Quote Originally Posted by mandocrucian View Post
    I don't like it.
    To me, not having the option to delete is the same as signing over all your intellectual property rights. I want the option to remove a post, for whatever reason, whenever I want, and without having to ask permisssion to do it. The "author" should have the right to let some page-long essay/explanation go "out of print". (E.g.: Perhaps the post is a dry-run or rough draft on some topic for possible eventual use in a published instructional manual.)
    The analogy between deleting a post and letting a book go out of print is a questionable one. If an author decides to let a work go out of print that doesn't give them the right to demand that libraries return any copies that they might have on their shelves. Letting a book go out of print doesn't remove it from circulation it just makes it harder to get hold of, once something has been published it's published for good. Posting an item to a public forum is like donating a copy of your work to a library (albeit a library that is easily accessible from anywhere in the world).

    Also, when someone asks a question I could answer I read the thread and I'll only post a reply if no one else has already made the points that I would. So if there's a good answer there already then I usually won't reply. If that good answer was to be deleted some time latter then that would leave the thread incomplete even though there may be people who would have been willing to answer the question freely, which seems unfair to me.

    Patrick

  2. #27
    Mike Parks woodwizard's Avatar
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    Default Re: deletion

    mandopete quote:
    I noticed something else - there's a feature that allows you state "why" you edited something. That's nice too.
    *********
    I like that too. Most of my editing is for my great spelling ofcourse. I really like everthing better.
    Last edited by woodwizard; Sep-17-2008 at 11:07am. Reason: spelling
    I Pick, Therefore I Grin! ... "Good Music Any OLD-TIME"

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  3. #28
    String-Bending Heretic mandocrucian's Avatar
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    Default Re: deletion

    Posting an item to a public forum is like donating a copy of your work to a library (albeit a library that is easily accessible from anywhere in the world).
    No it's not. Not if when you posted, you had the option of removal. You could say that you were actually "lending" the post/opinion. That's (see quote) like lending your lawn mower to a neighbor, and because you didn't ask for it back right away, he claims that possession = ownership and/or that you "gave" it to him permanently.

    There was a magazine that I did some interviews/writing for, and a number of years later, they sent me some form to sign in which they were claiming all ownership rights - to do whatever they wanted with it ...reprint in collection, online repro - and expected me to assent to that position. There was never any contract in which I relinquished anything except the right to first publication in the particular printed issue it appeared in. And I told them, "I never signed anything, giving up everything.....for no reimbursement" Magazines that do want that, send their writer a contract in advance of publication, spellling out exactly what they are buying.

    But, if anything I may write is to permanently become someone else's property, then that fact will be definitely be weighed in consideration of how much (or detailed), if anything, I want to "donate". And I'll probably think...."Nah, just to err on the side of caution, I may want to just keep this for myself."

    NH

  4. #29
    Registered User Doug Hoople's Avatar
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    Default Re: deletion

    I'll say it again.

    I really LIKED being able to edit without restriction.

    I didn't care too much about the delete, and would have been happy enough with a delete that left the post in place and left a "deleted by author" message trail, much like the "deleted by moderator for inappropriate content" messages that we'd see from time to time.

    I'll miss being able to edit without restriction.

    I understand and believe that our moderators and hosts have had massive headaches in this category, and understand their enthusiasm for limiting us as a means of retaining their own sanity.

    But I really LIKED being able to edit without restriction. I may be wrong, but I don't think I abused the privilege, and I believe my posts were clearer and more to the point because of my ability to edit them.

    I'm sorry that the abuse of this capability by the few has led to the loss of it for us all.

    And if I REALLY want to "measure twice and cut once," I'll write a book and publish it. The stupidities that ensue from the heat of the moment are part of the message forum experience.
    Last edited by Doug Hoople; Sep-17-2008 at 11:55am. Reason: Because I still can
    Doug Hoople
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  5. #30
    Registered User cooper4205's Avatar
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    Default Re: deletion

    You don't have to think twice and cut once -- you have three hours after you post to edit it. That should give someone more than enough time to reflect on whether a post made in the heat of the moment was in good taste or not.
    Wes
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  6. #31
    Registered User Doug Hoople's Avatar
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    Default Re: deletion

    Quote Originally Posted by cooper4205 View Post
    You don't have to think twice and cut once -- you have three hours after you post to edit it. That should give someone more than enough time to reflect on whether a post made in the heat of the moment was in good taste or not.
    EXCEPT if, upon hitting the Send key, you collapse in an exhausted heap from the effort of firing a "perfect," fast-paced response into a thicket of hot-pursuit cross-posting, and then you wake up 3 hours and 1 minute later drenched in the cold sweat of a nightmare wherein you were handed the reply that you really wanted to write.

    No, really... in all seriousness, three hours is not quite enough to correct after sleeping on it.

    Hmmm... I think I've dwelled on this enough by now. Better let it rest.
    Last edited by Doug Hoople; Sep-17-2008 at 3:43pm. Reason: Because I still can
    Doug Hoople
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  7. #32
    Registered User fishdawg40's Avatar
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    Default Re: deletion

    I see both sides. But don't see much of the mess the mods are talking about. I was on Craigslist today, in the "musicians" section. People would reply to different ads and what do you know, the original ad was gone. So I'm lost as to what that person was talking about originally. Probably better off without that knowledge anyways. Albeit that's Craigslist, here at the Cafe we're a little more civilized....well most of us are.

  8. #33
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    Default Re: deletion

    Quote Originally Posted by mandocrucian View Post
    No it's not. Not if when you posted, you had the option of removal. You could say that you were actually "lending" the post/opinion.
    I agree with you. To restate my point more clearly, posting an item to a public forum in the knowledge that there is no delete facilityis like donating a copy of your work to a library. My argument was really only aimed at posts added under the new system, whether or not you want all your old posts to remain now that the delete feature has been removed is between you and the moderators.

    Quote Originally Posted by mandocrucian View Post
    But, if anything I may write is to permanently become someone else's property, then that fact will be definitely be weighed in consideration of how much (or detailed), if anything, I want to "donate". And I'll probably think...."Nah, just to err on the side of caution, I may want to just keep this for myself."
    Which is a valid approach to take. There are probably a few people on this board who face a similar dilemma when asked to play an unpaid gig. If they make a living out of playing then they may so "no" on principle because it has the potential to hit their pockets. Life's a lot simpler for us hobby writers/players.

    Patrick

  9. #34
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    Default Re: deletion

    Quote Originally Posted by doughoople View Post
    No, really... in all seriousness, three hours is not quite enough to correct after sleeping on it.
    If you want to sleep on it before making your final decision your might be better off writing your post in a word processor and sleeping on it before you submit it. That way do don't wake up to find that your credibility has been detroyed because everyone's read your work of "genius" and even if you delete it now they will remeber you for it.

    Patrick

  10. #35
    Moderator MikeEdgerton's Avatar
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    Default Re: deletion

    Let's reiterate this one more time and perhaps assuage the concerns of those that are so strongly concerned about not being able to edit or delete their own posts. We certainly don't want people to feel they can't post because they might suffer financially. If you feel that your own post is going to cause you any harm, emotionally, financially or whatever, please contact any of the moderators with your concerns and we'll help you out. This isn't being done to harm you. It's being done so that we don't have to have a user delete his or her own posts then berate us for deleting them when we did not. It's being done because we don't want people flaming someone then editing their posts after they got blasted back. Both happened on the old software. It neutralizes those that want to play games. Those that simply have an issue with what they have typed haven't got any problems.
    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them". These are the words of J. Garber.

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