what is the difference between a pro band and a regional band? as far as singing, general sound stage persona. What do you think? can it be quantified or does it just happen?
what is the difference between a pro band and a regional band? as far as singing, general sound stage persona. What do you think? can it be quantified or does it just happen?
Well, they probably have a bus or a van to get around the country in. I've seen a lot of regional bands that I think are better than some of the national "pro" touring bands.
Mandofiddle
$$$$$
I never wanted them all, Just the ones I wanted.....
..talent...and incredible luck of being in the right place at the right time...
...more expensive mandolins
What do most pro's not have? Day jobs! I don't envy them just the groupies! Just kidding of course. I believe the pro's have time to focus and refine their craft and they have great motivation since their day job is their night job too!
Old Hometown, Cabin Fever String Band
taking a look at Rhonda Vincents schedule in the most recent bluegrass unlimited i would have to say that the "pros" must have a willingness to travel endlessly, not sleep at home, visit their families rarely, eat out always, earn $100's of dollars per week......the seldom scene is a great band that rarely travels, most of the band members have good day jobs yet their music has always been at the top, there are a good many regional bands who don't chose to take to the road but are capable.........
Well said here re: touring and it's associated benefits (?). I personally don't think professionalism has it's basis in touring - that's all hype we are expected to buy into. Many a pro has rejected this format. Many a pro has a day job or business to run, a family, a farm, or home they care about being at, and community responsibilities. The life of touring musician is not for everyone.
The only downside (if that) is the difficulty of gaining recognition as quickly, or amongst such a broad audience.
Really folks.
so If I'm talented, lucky, can go out and buy an expensive mandolin, buy a bus, quit my job and tour for 100's a week, I'm in the top of the heap???
I don't buy it.
I was really talking musical performance anyway. What qualities make a "professional sound" to a band?
I've often wondered the same thing. A couple of weeks ago, I was wandering around the grounds at a fest, happened upon a group which was jammimg, which included Greg Luck. He motioned me over, they didn't have a mandolin, so I took it out and "sat in". What struck me was their connectivity, their abilty to not step on musical toes, to listen, not overplay, not "brag", to chime in when the time came to chime in. A lot of little things made the big sound. I very much was a listener myself, and only asserted myself when I got the nod
Professional seems to have at least two meanings that fit this discussion. #The one is that the music is the primary means of financial support and the other has to do with quality of the performance. #They overlap but one doesn't guarantee the other.
The initial question seemed to be asking about the quality phase but by phrasing it as compared to a "regional band" could have meant the other.
What are you really asking?
2 easy was to tell a pro
1. They tune up before they get on stage.
2. They never call a tune they don't have down cold.
And they don't chat a lot between tunes. If someone has to tune, they either play a number meant to be played without that person, or tell a joke, etc... They never leave the audience to sit there without someone doing something entertaining.
Mandofiddle
I was talking with a couple of friends at a festival a couple of years ago. One is a former pro, the other is a current top pro in bluegrass. We were in the air-conditioned bus of the current pro, and the conversation turned to buses, the differences between them, the relative merrits of different models, manufacturers, and engines, common repairs needed on certain models, etc. I had nothing to add to the conversation.Originally Posted by (mandofiddle @ June 07 2004, 13:43)
It occured to me that professional bluegrass musicians, unlike more casual pickers, are bus experts.
John Hamlett
www.hamlettinstruments.com
I would say a recording contract with all of its perks (most, which have been mentioned already). I also agree that there are “pro’s” out there that haven’t gotten the break or don’t care for the break. Hell, look at what the Del McCoury band is up to these days. With that said, I would love to go to the Telluride Bluegrass Festival and sit in with a bunch of folks just to see how bad I suck…LOL!
..ya have to be....and you have to be able to drive one too...if not..your changing clothes in a Porto Potty...I was talking with a couple of friends at a festival a couple of years ago. One is a former pro, the other is a current top pro in bluegrass. We were in the air-conditioned bus of the current pro, and the conversation turned to buses, the differences between them, the relative merrits of different models, manufacturers, and engines, common repairs needed on certain models, etc. I had nothing to add to the conversation.
It occured to me that professional bluegrass musicians, unlike more casual pickers, are bus experts.
Tim, I WAS unclear. but Alan's answer is more on the line of what I'd like folks to discuss.
Bus mechanics I bet is experience. but just because you have a bus doesn't mean you sound like you ought to have one. Charlie Waller last time I saw him and the gents were riding in a rental van.
I heard tell if you're in Larry Stephenson's band and drive the bus, he pays you $5 more per hour, no lie...
I think bus = headache.
There is a very interesting conversation. I think the word "pro" can have many connotations.
1. One who makes a living playing music
2. One who is a very skilled musician/singer
3. One who treats music like a business, takes every
aspect of the business seriously (not just the
music) and is always on time, in character, and on
point
4. One who has somehow distinguished themselves
from the pack. often times this isn't just based on
skill level and has to do with luck/the ability to
connect with an audience etc...
I think any of these can make you a pro by themselves but having all four makes a legend.
I have always joked that whatever modest success I've had in music has been the result of punctuality ... but, that's only a half-joke as it has definately set me apart from the pack on several occasions. Show up on time, and know your part ... many others won't bother to do either.
One factor I've seen that has set pro-caliber people apart from the rest has been an overwhelming obession about music. I think all musicians are obsessive, but some take this character trait well beyond that of a healthy individual. They often fail at most conventional careers, and are often supported by spouses and parents for many years while 'paying their dues'.
Alan's comments about listening are also key. Most people conjure an image of WSM or some other famous band leader, but most pro's are support players. If you can't listen and take direction from the leader, your chances of becomming a pro are greatly diminshed.
The last time I went on tour I was in the company of a half-dozen pro's who were 'off duty' touring with their original band. Seeing what their personal lives were like convinced me that I should really follow that job lead I was offered just a few weeks before leaving on that tour. LOL!
I am happier, healthier, etc. than I think I would be if I were leading a touring life. Glad I got to take a 'test drive' before accepting a true long haul commitment.
- Benig
"One factor I've seen that has set pro-caliber people apart from the rest has been an overwhelming obession about music. I think all musicians are obsessive, but some take this character trait well beyond that of a healthy individual. They often fail at most conventional careers, and are often supported by spouses and parents for many years while 'paying their dues'."
Thats what I call a musician...the others I call rock stars, LOL!
What to pros have that regional bands dont? Access to other professionial peers in my opinion. Once your're talented or lucky enough to be in the loop with the pros you can really learn all the lessons that are to be learned. I think the music at that level is micro-analyzed and once you can get a chance to have the details pointed out (if you're lucky enough to have an articulate mentor) it opens up your ear and understanding to move your playing, your ear and your understanding ahead. Just being around great pickers makes a difference as well I think. There is something to be said for osmosis. (And playing and thinking BG for every waking moment of the day)
Just my two cents!
Several things set aside pro's to me, some of which have been mentioned
here already.
Pro's care about their craft, show up on time (or communicate well when
they aren't going to be on time), respect their craft and those who work
with them, and probably most importantly, respect the audiences.
Ged Foley, who plays with the Irish traditional band Patrick Street,
once said, "For the folks who come out, this is their big night out...
It's a date or a festival or a concert and it's a big time for them.
For us it's doing the same things another night, but we've got to
remember that they expect it to be special. So we have to come across
with a memorable experience, on demand." And from that I learned that,
to some extent, no matter how I feel, when I'm going to play for folks
I have to play for them. It says something about consistency and how
well a player can pull out a good and entertaining performance, no
matter what else is going on. Not just for the audience, but for
the music, too. I know there have been times when I had the option
to do less, to slack off, but I wanted to do the music right and so
that was my choice right then.
"Record contracts" mean nothing at all, it's just another bad job.
And anybody who wants can have a bus. All that takes is money, you
don't have to be smart, pretty or talented... <GG>
I guess "obsession" with the music is right, too. Those I respect as
"professionals" seem to have a deep relationship with the music and
its history...
Nice thread, thanks!
steveV
We are rank amateurs, but have a Winnebago and park near pro busses whenever we can in the hopes that some of it might rub off. Some of my friends consider this obsessive.
Always a treat to have some of the pros stroll by at a festival, check out your instruments and pick a tune with you! Have met some extremely nice professional,talented, and down to earth folks.
Ive heard the same thing about ol Larry....what a coincedence...our band leader is buying a 87 Silver Eagle....oh boy.....here we go.....I dont want to be a pro..and I dont want to drive a bus...work on a bus...I may put some diesal in a bus...thats it....Ive been there done that bus routine...
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