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Thread: Om:   gold tone vs trinity college - differences?

  1. #1

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    I'm thinking seriously of buying my 2nd OM - started with a BardSong I bought real cheap - don't want to put more $$ into it to have it set up properly.

    I've narrowed it down to Trinity College or Gold Tone [BTW: are there others I should consider??] . The dealer I like to work with states that Gold Tone is similar to Trinity BUT much less $$. Is this correct?

    Folk of the Wood sound clips of Trinity College OM sure sound GOOD!

    Anyone here own either a Trinity College or a Gold Tone?

    Any informed advice appreciated. Thanks!

  2. #2
    Registered User steve V. johnson's Avatar
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    Scroll down a bit in the CBOM topic list and read thru the discussion called

    "How can I improve tc bouzouki sound..."

    My view is that TCs are really good, basically, but can be improved a whole lot with a few basic upgrades and some careful setup TLC. This thread bears that out pretty well, and even has a nice soundclip of the upgrade results.

    Also use the Cafe's search function and you'll find quite a few TC octave mando and bouzouki threads in CBOM, and quite a few folks here who play and enjoy them.

    I've had good results with other Gold Tone instruments, but I have not seen their OMs/zouks. A good place to start would be to find retailers who carry each of them and compare pictures of the two. Many of the Asian-made instruments are pretty similar and you should be able to start to tell how similar/different they are with a good look.

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    Registered User otterly2k's Avatar
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    The only Gold Tone OM I have ever run into in person was WAY over coated with finish... almost sheathed in a hard plastic coating. It sounded and played ok, but I can't imagine it would "open up" or mature much with so much finish on it. Also, it was very heavy as a result. That by itself was a deterrent for me.

    The instruments are probably similar in construction. My understanding is that there are one or two manufacturers that turn out similar instruments that get finished differently and have slightly different appointments and get stamped with different names for different markets. So probably not hugely different instruments. Obviously, it would be ideal to be able to compare them side by side, in person. Not sure you'll have that chance.

    If it was my decision (and the cost difference wasn't a deciding factor), I'd go with TC. I've played a few of them, and they are quite decent and not oversprayed. Like all inexpensive instruments (and a lot of expensive ones) will benefit from knowledgeable set-up work.
    Karen Escovitz
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    Golly, I hate to tell you this, but I must.
    The Gold-tone and Trinity College are almost identical.
    Price is the only reason to choose one over the other.

    The bad news is, the fret spacing is just off on those instruments. There is no way to get the intonation right.
    With careful bridge placement, you can cut the difference and set it for correct pitch from fret 2-4 or so. Above it will be flat, and below, sharp. As much of your playing is in that area, it can sound OK...but even the first fret will be noticeably sharp. It drove me nuts! I sent it right back.
    If it is not your main instrument and you are ok with a pretty twangy sound, you get good mileage for the buck with them. If you have a really good ear, you won't be able to stand it.

    My advice? Save your money and buy a real OM. A used Mid-mo, Petersen level 1, or beat-up Weber Sage 1 would be light-years better. You never have buyer's remorse when you buy quality. Plus, you can own it for nothing. Sell it later at the same price.

    I apologize for having to tell you this!

    Bob
    Hot Springs

  5. #5
    Registered User groveland's Avatar
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    Bob -

    I of course have a TC, and the intonation is perfect as it gets everywhere on the neck, at least that's what my tuner says and my ear confirms. #Perhaps there are good and bad TCs.

    Also, I have done comparisons against at least one of the makes you mention, and it is certain that item could not approach the TC in sound and playability at nearly 4 times the price. #Perhaps there are good and bad pieces in the higher-end, too.

    The bottom line is, as said so many times on this board, if you can, play before you pay!

    Edit: Couple more thoughts - As good as the TC is for the money, I wouldn't consider it in an 'upgrade path' from a low-end instrument. It would be more cost effective to save and order something from a well-respected luthier. I was listening to sound clips of Biemborn's "Torch and Fire" and marvelling at the zouk sound on those cuts. Those instruments are the real deal. YMMV.




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    I have never owned a TC, but I've played several, one OM and a few bouzoukis. Of the zouks, one was really bad (may have just been badly setup, can't really remember), the others were pretty good. The necks on the TCs are a little deep for me, but that's just personal preference.

    The TC OM I played had a nice tone, was easy to play, and played in tune. I liked it a lot and I've played more expensive instruments that were not as good.

    I've never seen a Goldtone OM, so I cannot offer a comparison.

    I think with many of these factory instruments there are often good ones and not-so-good ones.

    Quote Originally Posted by (otterly2k @ Feb. 19 2007, 11:22)
    The only Gold Tone OM I have ever run into in person was WAY over coated with finish... it was very heavy as a result.
    Does this kind of finish contribute significantly to the weight of a zouk? I've never been able to compare an unfinished instrument to one that's been finished.

    Patrick

  7. #7
    Registered User steve V. johnson's Avatar
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    Bob wrote: "... the fret spacing is just off on those instruments. There is no way to get the intonation right.
    With careful bridge placement, you can cut the difference and set it for correct pitch from fret 2-4 or so. Above it will be flat, and below, sharp."

    I have had this experience with some TC OMs, but not all of 'em, and the problems (fret placement, neck angle... whatever) varied a lot. The worst was on a new instrument bought from a dealer, and it was returned and replaced with a TC OM that was fine.
    Quality control, as I've mentioned before, seems to be better with TCs than with most of the other Pac Rim labels, but it ain't perfect.

    So if you buy a TC/Gold Tone, if you can afford it at all, buy it from a source with a good and clear return policy.

    Just from looking at the Elderly site (they don't always have Gold Tone OM pix there), the GT and TC sure did look very, very similar.

    Patrick, as to weight, yes, the finish does have weight, but I couldn't quantify what proportion the finish is of the instrument's total weight. I have a friend who sanded all the shiny finish off of a TC OM, and the result was lighter, definitely. I didn't think that the removal made much difference in the sound of the thing, tho it sure did make a difference in how it looked. <GGG>
    And he likes it much better that way... Last time I saw it, he hadn't finish-sanded it at all, so it still had very prominent scratch marks. He said he was going to use some finish-remover solvent on it and then finish sand it and put on some other very light finish material, but I don't know what's actually happened with that...

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  8. #8

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    Finally got to "test drive" a Gold Tone OM. #Briefly stated, I was impressed that $450 could buy so much #B U T #I was underwhelmed overall. #Bob (Yavor) from Hot Springs said it well - I'm gonna save my $$$ and wait till something better comes along . . . which might be a LONG time! #OM's don't exactly fall off the turnip truck (like guitars do) every day . . . ! At least I have my beater BardSong OM in the meantime.

    I'm just getting too old to spend much time with mediocre instruments . . . .




  9. #9
    Registered User otterly2k's Avatar
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    good decision.
    Karen Escovitz
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    Brian Dean OM #32
    Old Wave Mandola #372
    Phoenix Neoclassical #256
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    If you're gonna walk on thin ice, you might as well dance!

  10. #10
    Registered User groveland's Avatar
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    Good decision. #Check back when you're ready to buy that upgrade, though. #You will find there are mediocre instruments out there for 4 times the price, too. #I know I try not to disparage certain high-priced low-quality brands because people's livlihoods are at stake, and what we say here counts. #But there are over-priced brands out there.




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    I had a Trinity it was a good first octave but I wish I had waited, saved, and got my Flat Iron sooner instead. Your right, don't waste your time with mediocre instruments. You get what you pay for, if you keep your eyes open. GOOD-LUCK!

    Valle
    valle

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    I'm waiting for a used Weber Sage or similar flat topped OM to get for the next OM (my current/first is the TC that does its job for me adequately). I'm sure mine would benefit tonally from a better nut/bridge and maybe tailpiece.

    Jamie
    There are two things to aim at in life: first, to get what you want; and, after that, to enjoy it. Only the wisest of mankind achieve the second. Logan Pearsall Smith, 1865 - 1946

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    Registered User groveland's Avatar
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    JEStanek - Have you compared the Sage and TC side by side?

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    Nope. I just have heard good things about their flat top OMs. If you have, can you offer relative differences, please? I would imagine the Weber to be pretty superior due to more handwork and better qc of the fingerboard/fret positioning. Frankly, the best OMs I've ever seen/touched/heard (limited experience) was at the Philly CBOM-o Rama hosted by Judith and Otterly2K last year. Sobels, Brian Dean, and Chris Baird really make fine instruments with great artistry. I was fortunate to be able to have those in hand for an afternoon. They blew my TC away but my TC is a mass produced import with low end hardware.

    I would definitely consider Flatirons and the others mentioned above as future upgrades but (drumroll please)I'm saving all my money now for a hand-built mando by Brian Dean (see cat leave bag and now to un-hijak the thread)... SCGC.OM made a wise decision. The TC or Goldtone probably weren't way better than the Bardsong. By saving towards $1K you'll get more OM used for sure (that's my hope-for me too).

    Jamie
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    Registered User groveland's Avatar
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    This just in - Paul Kotapish has an article in which he quotes Steven Owsley Smith: "You get 90 percent of the tone in any cheapo instrument. It’s the last 10 percent that drives us over the edge and makes us want to scream when we get it." #I ask myself, "Having a TC now, for the additional $1200, does the Sage give me that extra 10%?"
    (http://www.acousticguitar.com/issues/ag89/bouzouki.html)




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    for $450 you can have an OM made by luthier Rick Felkel of Elloree Guitars. And you won't have to wait a real long time to get it either. He has a standard size but I'm sure he could customize it for you too. He made me a tenor guitar that came out really good. If I had it to do over again I'd have him use a slightly smaller body, shorter scale, and skinnier neck on the tenor guitar just to make it more comfortable for my short arms/fingers. But he did a good job. I don't know of a lower priced luthier out there. I've been thinking of getting a mandolin from him. His mandos are a very simple, yet nice design.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Om:   gold tone vs trinity college - differences?

    Quote Originally Posted by tannisroot View Post
    for $450 you can have an OM made by luthier Rick Felkel of Elloree Guitars. And you won't have to wait a real long time to get it either. He has a standard size but I'm sure he could customize it for you too. He made me a tenor guitar that came out really good. If I had it to do over again I'd have him use a slightly smaller body, shorter scale, and skinnier neck on the tenor guitar just to make it more comfortable for my short arms/fingers. But he did a good job. I don't know of a lower priced luthier out there. I've been thinking of getting a mandolin from him. His mandos are a very simple, yet nice design.
    I know this is an old thread...but...I came across it a few months ago, and this advice made a lot of sense to me, so I looked Rick up (Elloree is on Facebook) and found out his price has gone up to $600, which still seems reasonable, so I ordered a zouk with a red cedar top and black walnut back. It just arrived yesterday! Wow! Gorgeous instrument, fantastic rich tone, intonation right on the money. Great guy to work with, highly recommended. He's building me a mando next.

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    Default Re: Om:   gold tone vs trinity college - differences?

    Quote Originally Posted by Akradecki View Post
    I know this is an old thread...but...I came across it a few months ago, and this advice made a lot of sense to me, so I looked Rick up (Elloree is on Facebook) and found out his price has gone up to $600, which still seems reasonable, so I ordered a zouk with a red cedar top and black walnut back. It just arrived yesterday! Wow! Gorgeous instrument, fantastic rich tone, intonation right on the money. Great guy to work with, highly recommended. He's building me a mando next.
    Glad you revived the thread because I’ve been thinking about the very same wood combination from Elloree and would love to see photos and video of your instrument, including any options you selected. I suspect a new thread dedicated to that instrument and the experience would be of interest to many folks here so hope you’ll consider sharing! Will send a pm in case you don’t see this first.

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