Odd scale length

[steve-o-reno]

I apologize for such an academic question, but. . .

Would it be possible to make a good sounding long scale mando, or short scale OM with a scale length of 16"-18"?

I play a tenor ukulele that has a 17" scale and that's a good, comfortable size for me. I'd like to get a mando or OM for Celtic music, but I'd like something between the scale of a mandolin and an OM.

Or is this just inherently impossible? Thanks for any input.

[ErikAitch]

Nothing's impossible! I have a baritone uke that's a 20" scale... but it sounded terrible last I played it, as it has a few cracks and at least one loose brace.

Seems pretty straighforward to me; what is that seems unlikely to you?

[Michael Lewis]

Steve-o, the scale length you like is about right for a mandola, a 5th lower than a mandolin. You can get some more latitude by juggling string gauges. Heavier strings for shorter scales, lighter strings for the longer scales.

[labraid]

my favorite scale for the mandola is the 18.1".

[Paul Hostetter]

Would it be possible to make a good sounding long scale mando, or short scale OM with a scale length of 16"-18"?

A mandolin and an octrave mandolin are tuned an octave apart, so which are you after? 16" is too long for any mandolin - there are plenty around at 15" however. Early Nationals and Sobells, anyway.

If you're determined to keep GDAE, even 18" is short for those pitches, the strings will really flop around and be very hard to tune. So you can retune to CGDA, real mandola tuning, for which (I agree with Brian) 18" or so is a great scale.

I play a tenor ukulele that has a 17" scale and that's a good, comfortable size for me.

These are usually tuned way different and use nylon strings. You're considering too many variables to get a clear answer. Maybe you need a double-string tenor ukulele, strung with nylon?

I'd like to get a mando or OM for Celtic music, but I'd like something between the scale of a mandolin and an OM.

I think you're going to have to use CGDA rather than GDAE.

[steve-o-reno]

Thanks a bunch for all your replies and info. I thought it might be difficult to find what I was thinking about - a 17" scaled, GDAE tuned instrument.

So some compromise will be in order. It sounds like the closest I might get is either 15" mandolin tuned GDAE or an 18" mandola in a CGDA tuning.

This sounds like they'll need to be custom instruments, so the search begins.

Thanks again!

[Paul Hostetter]

You can tune a 17" scale to CGDA. You can even tune a 16" scale to CGDA, if you're willing to live with some tradeoffs.

[Bill Snyder]

I do not know what quality level of instrument you are wanting but Trinity College has a mandola with a 17" scale length available. Here is one from The Music Motel.
First Quality Music sells this Michael Kelly with a 17" scale.
Point being that they are available if you look around.

[steve-o-reno]

Thanks for the additional info.

I wanted a GDAE tuned instrument since there seems to be more material available for them. But that tuning with the scale length I wanted appears to be out of the question.

It looks likes it needs to be a mandola with 17"-18" scale and I'll just have to find what what material I can.

Like everyone I want the best quality I can afford. I like the look & style of the Trinity College although I'm not sure of the sound quality. So I'll probably try to find a good used custom instrument. Hopefully it will be affordable, or at least maybe the seller will take a credit card!

[otterly2k]

steve-o...
Since you seem to be new around here...I'll take a moment to recommend that you keep an eye on the Classifieds here on the Cafe site. Especially the "Used Instruments" section. New stuff is posted daily and you can find some really good deals. In my experience (I've bought and sold through the classifieds) it is a great resource. You can also post in the "Wanted" section if you know what you're looking for. It is at least as reliable as any other online forum, and more reliable than most (imo) b/c it's a small community and most of the people who post instruments are folks who would not want to lose their Cafe privileges by scamming other community members.

If you know your price range, folks here might have some recommendations to offer you. If you end up going with mandola, keep your eyes open for a used Mid-Missouri... these are reputedly excellent and good buys. There has been a lot of discussion of TC OM's around here, but I'm not sure I recall any particular discussion of their mandolas. They do make a decent OM (with a relatively short scale for an OM) for the $ (generally in the $500 range, give or take). I haven't priced or tried their 'dolas, but perhaps others here have.

KE

[jackofall]

Steve, any material you can find for mando or OM can be played just fine on mandola. The intervals between the strings are the same (5ths). It's just that with the different tuning the tunes will be transposed into a different key by the instrument.

No reason you can't use the mando material. If you want to pitch-shift mando tunes into mandola keys to play along with, try The Amazing Slow Downer or Audacity - both are just a Google away.

[Potosimando]

I have a 17-5/8"-scale flat-top Octave Mandolin (actually manufactured as a short-scale Octave Mandolin, "Celtic Cross" by Neill Russell, Vancouver B.C., in 1994) that I did some experimenting on a few years ago, and it sounds pretty darn nice tonally, and has very respectable volume.

To get beyond the floppy-string thing, I installed mandocello strings (Russell called them "toeing cables", when I told him what I proposed to do). #The instrument is not as hard to play as you might think, because I have the action set relatively low...and the larger strings just aren't a big deal re. playability (believe it or not). #I also put on a cast tailpiece and had the braces carved down for increased volume (the luthier repair person said not to worry about the top collapsing or sinking with where he left the braces...and the top hasn't sunk one iota in four years). #In fact, I just now took the little guy out of its case for the first time in a few months and it's still in tune. I also had a ToneGard made for increased volume.

I seldom play the instrument though, because I have a higher-quality carved-top mandola (17-1/2" scale). #On those rare occassions that I play a "big boy", I almost always choose the mandola because of its higher-quality sound.

From my standpoint OM's are much more versatile to play than mandolas because of the necessary transposing with the mandola (that and the OM's reaching down four steps below the mandola...lot to be said for that low G). #If my two big-boy instruments had the same tonal quality, then I'd choose the OM hands-down. #For me it is not as easy to transpose for the mandola as suggested above; it's quite difficult for me.

Steve-o-Reno, if you are willing to put up the cash for non-insured shipping ($50 or so each way...the instrument already is fully insured), then I probably can be convinced to send it to you to check out and learn from. #No big deal sending it, as I have gone as much as two years without even taking it out of its case, and it really is a credible little OM and should be appreciated from time to time, if only to resolve a bit of curiosity.

If interested, then contact me through email link and not through this thread.