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Thread: Loar Picture of the Day

  1. #1076
    Registered User f5loar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    I got to pick on this one many times in the past 30 years and it was such a joy to see it each time. The owner liked hearing me pick it for him.

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  3. #1077
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    You'd think about everything that can be said about F-5's has been said, but I would like to know more about what led to their creation. In other words, was it totally Loar who brought about the concept, or is it somewhat coincidental to his hiring. There are at least 5-6 specific things that were changed from the existing ovals and a couple had patents under others names, not Loar. (McHugh?) Thinking truss rod and adjustable bridge.
    Also, you'd think there would be some prototypes. Seems like they would have needed quite a bit of testing with such a drastic change to the arching.
    Anyone?

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  5. #1078
    Registered User f5loar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    The invention of, if you want to call it that, the Gibson F5 Master Model was indeed a team effort at Gibson. By this time they ruled the mandolin world but it was starting to loose it's appeal as the roaring 20's came into play which changed musical styles. Loar was already a well known player, instructor, had a degree in acoustical engineering and was an endorser of Gibson mandolins. Hiring him was a smart move and together with other management guys like Williams and Hart, Loar was able to indeed work on a proto-type, which we now know as the June 1, 1922 F5. It appears they fooled around with this one (maybe a few more that have not surfaced) enough to get it right and the specs were written and drawn up for the 6 or so master luthiers at Gibson to begin production by November, 1922. The tap-tune to the soundboard (spruce top) is the mystery part of the mystic. What did Loar hear in his ears that would cause them to do adjustments to get it right so to speak. Or was he just playing the part of supervisor over these high end instruments. The signed label no doubt was a sales gimmick and it worked, because after Loar left in late 1924, there were no more signed labels and yet the sound of the F5 did change enough you knew something at the factory was not the same. The biggest problem Gibson had is the F5/H5/K5 series were not the success they had hoped for. Most all of the mandolin orchestras had gotten use to the F4 series (shorter neck, round hole) and that's what they preferred. Very few thought the F5 was enough improvement to the sound they were after, to justify the higher cost to get one. Then you throw in the Virzi thing and again, they were not use to that sound either, so most stuck with the F4 types. So that's my quicky take on this. It would take a big chapter from a book on Gibson to explain everything that went on during Loar's era and there is already enough out there to ponder upon. I'm sure Darryl Wolfe can say more than I have here in probably fewer words.

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  7. #1079
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    So Tom, when you say June 1, is this the one Gilchrist is restoring currently?

  8. #1080
    Registered User Timbofood's Avatar
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    I seem to recall a statement in an interview about Julius Bellson preferring the sound of his F-4 to the F-5. Not speaking disparagingly but simply from a personal taste view. Was that "colour" over "power" or familiar versus "new"?
    Maybe the wrong spot for that, I apologize.
    Timothy F. Lewis
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  9. #1081
    Registered User f5loar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    To answer both, yes that's the same one. The previous owner had died and it's being restored for it's new owner. Julius Bellson was into the classical sound that the F4 seemed to have over the F5. As far as "power" there are some really powerful sounding F4s out there. Herman Von Bernowitz who had conducted the DC area mandolin orchestra since the 20's told me he could lead the orchestra with his '21 F4. I got to play it and have to admit it really cut with power. However, would I be happy playing "Rawhide" on it, no. Because there is such a huge difference in the sound/tone of the F4 to the F5 I'd have to say the "new" had nothing to do with it. If those guys thought it was better to them, the extra $$ would not bother them. They would all have owned an F5. But think of Dave Apollon who played Gibsons and others like Lyon Healy/Bacon mandolins before the F5 came out. When he heard the F5 he was hooked, just like Monroe. Both Apollon and Monroe stuck by the sound of the F5 until the day they died.

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  11. #1082
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    I guess I'm fishing for information that has been lost to history.
    In the "Gibson Story', Bellson's book they have the photo of Loar in the corner of the Experimental Laboratory and the engineering dept. with guys at drawing boards. I would guess they must have made some prototypes that weren't finished and never saw the outside of the plant.

  12. #1083
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    In the picture of Lloyd at the plant he's holding a 10 string mandola sized A5 type instrument. Who know about that one? Do we know where it is?

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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    I just discovered I should be reading more Siminoff before asking these questions.

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  15. #1085
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    Yes, the Siminoff site has a lot on Loar. Since you asked about the 10 string, it is a mando-viola, A model with the mandola body and F holes. No signature label since it was likely only one made for Mr. Loar. Serial no. 70321 puts it not too long after the first F5 with serial no. 70281. And it's got a Virzi in it. Likely one of the prototypes to get the virzi.

  16. #1086
    Registered User Glassweb's Avatar
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    the Loar 10 string is (i think) owned by one Hank Risan.

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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    There's nothing viola about it. I think it should be called a mandolinola.

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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    February 18, 1924 Loar #75700 with Virzi - this is a previously documented Loar but these are new pictures and Carter Vintage Guitars gave us the green light to share the photos sent directly to us. If you have questions, best to ask the people that have possession of it.

    Mandolin listing at Carter Vintage Guitars | Mandolin Archive

    February 18, 1924 Loar #75700


    February 18, 1924 Loar #75700


    February 18, 1924 Loar #75700


    February 18, 1924 Loar #75700


    February 18, 1924 Loar #75700


    February 18, 1924 Loar #75700

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  22. #1090
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    And to cap it off, Sierra Hull playing it.


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  24. #1091

    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    It has the Virzi and sounds great in Sierra's hands!
    "Those who know don't have the words to tell, and the ones with the words don't know so well." - Bruce Cockburn

  25. #1092
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    Quote Originally Posted by Teak View Post
    It has the Virzi and sounds great in Sierra's hands!
    Agreed. Except for the pick click. I'd like to hear Sierra's critique on #75700. Thanks for posting this Scott.

  26. #1093
    Registered User James Rankine's Avatar
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve-o View Post
    Agreed. Except for the pick click. I'd like to hear Sierra's critique on #75700. Thanks for posting this Scott.
    Just need to scoop that pesky florida and she'll be fine.

  27. #1094
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    I'm glad that I'm not the only one bothered by the click. That really took away from fully enjoying that video. That is a beautiful sounding instrument. I'm sure Sierra has a blast playing it.
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  29. #1095
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    I guess proper technique of the day would have had you play behind the extension.
    I can't help noticing the obvious hand applied swipe of dark color on the bass side of the back.

  30. #1096
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    Thank you for sharing the beautiful pictures and video of the Feb 18, 1924 Loar #75700 with Virzi. Here is a recent video of the sister of this beauty: Feb 18, 1924 Loar #75701 also with Virzi. Enjoy!

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  32. #1097
    rock in rôle Paul Statman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    Quote Originally Posted by Hajd View Post
    Thank you for sharing the beautiful pictures and video of the Feb 18, 1924 Loar #75700 with Virzi. Here is a recent video of the sister of this beauty: Feb 18, 1924 Loar #75701 also with Virzi. Enjoy!
    Beautiful stuff, there, Hajd - and a gorgeous Feb 18th! Thanks for posting.

  33. #1098

    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandolin Cafe View Post
    And to cap it off, Sierra Hull playing it.
    And the Shure SM-81 seems like the ideal microphone for test driving acoustic instruments. It's as 'honest' as any microphone can be. Affordable at $250 used. Plentiful. Been around for years. And music store videos really suffer from weird sounding rooms, often full of sympathetically vibrating banjos and whatnot - so a single cardioid mic, fairly close, makes some sense from that point of view, too.
    BradKlein
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  35. #1099
    Purveyor of Sunshine sgarrity's Avatar
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    The almost perfect July 9th selfie.....with a Dec 1st, '24....
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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  37. #1100
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    Default Re: Loar Picture of the Day

    Quote Originally Posted by sgarrity View Post
    The almost perfect July 9th selfie.....with a Dec 1st, '24....
    Nice pic!
    ..... f5joe

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