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Thread: Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

  1. #1
    Registered User mbruno's Avatar
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    Default Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

    I've been writing up a chart for Bach's Prelude No 1 for mandolin for a student. They want to learn more classical styles so I figured this would be a good start since it's a bunch of arpeggios really. I'm posting it here for two purposes

    1. if it helps anyone, awesome
    2. if there are any mistakes, I'd love to know

    https://mattcbrunowordpres.files.wor...dolin-in-c.pdf

    Thanks!
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  3. #2
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

    Thanks, Matt. Was this an experiment to transpose it in a different key? Original for cello is in G and the two violin versions on IMSLP are in D to mimic similar fingering from the cello. Did you have a specific purpose in mind? A moderately difficult fingering exercise?

    Just for another take on it from a thread from a couple of years ago, Tom Haywood transposed it to G with some lowest notes up a bit to stay within the mandolin range. I myself have been attempting it on the octave mandolin so it almost sounds like a cello... not quite... though.

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    Default Re: Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Garber View Post
    Thanks, Matt. Was this an experiment to transpose it in a different key? Original for cello is in G and the two violin versions on IMSLP are in D to mimic similar fingering from the cello.
    ?? Original is Bach Well Tempered Clavier. First serious little tune I learned on the piano. And Gounod set a schmaltzy "Ave Maria" melody above it. This is original key.
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    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

    Apologies. I assumed that this was the ever popular cello piece. Bach uses similar melodies and themes throughout his works. Always best to be specific with generic “titles” to avoid confusion. I will take a look in the light of day.
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    Default Re: Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

    Easy mistake to make; I thought that might be the case. The first serious piece I played on my mandocello was the Prelude in G from Cello Suites. I came to find out both here on the Cafe and at CMSA events that everybody who picks up a mandocello plays the Prelude in G. Similar in the arpeggio format too, like a lot of Bach's string and keyboard works.

    Mbruno's work is a nice addition, maybe now everyone with a mandolin will try the Prelude in C !
    Jim

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    Default Re: Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Imhoff View Post
    Easy mistake to make; I thought that might be the case. The first serious piece I played on my mandocello was the Prelude in G from Cello Suites. I came to find out both here on the Cafe and at CMSA events that everybody who picks up a mandocello plays the Prelude in G. Similar in the arpeggio format too, like a lot of Bach's string and keyboard works.

    Mbruno's work is a nice addition, maybe now everyone with a mandolin will try the Prelude in C !
    Yes the Prelude from cello suite No. 1 is the Foggy Mountain Breakdown equivalent for cello

    The Prelude in C is a challenge for flatpickers - it's an easy piece on keyboard, guitar, harp etc on which these ascending types of arpeggio figures flow naturally with the hand. Congrats to bruno for the transcription.

  8. #7
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

    Ok, so this piece would be properly identified as Prelude No.1 in C major, BWV 846 from the Well-Tempered Clavier. Again, sorry for my confusion and overly quick assumption.

    I agree with catmandu2: this ain't no walk in the park for mandolin or violin. It just doesn't sit on the instrument like the cello prelude. I tried to play with the fingering as indicated in the TAB as well as working out my own and found it very difficult since there were few open strings and the stretches were a bit long at times. I would love to hear if Matt has recorded it.

    I checked out a few of the transcriptions for other instruments like violin and guitar and they essentially rewrote the Bach to fit the instrument. Some transposed to other keys like G or D but it still is difficult. Keyboards make the most sense. Or perhaps we need a different tuning for the mandolin to accommodate this piece?
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    Default Re: Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Garber View Post
    I tried to play with the fingering as indicated in the TAB as well as working out my own and found it very difficult since there were few open strings and the stretches were a bit long at times.
    My impression is that the fingering needs to be adjusted to be more practical on mandolin.

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    Default Re: Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

    As much as I appreciate the growing interest in Bach by all of you as well as Mike Marshall, Chris Thile, and Sierra Hull, I am getting more and more familiar with so-called "classical" (never really defined except for 1st Viennese School) music written for the mandolin. I have 3 degrees in music and until very recently I never heard of Calace or Munier--neither did my teachers or fellow professors. I was a vocal/choral professor and I get annoyed when the classical radio stations play instrumental transcriptions of songs by Schubert or Puccini--why not a singer?? Sing or play the music on whatever it was written for.
    I do appreciate the much better informed population of this thread, opening my ears to great music specifically for 8 string plucked instruments. Thank you!
    But yeah.... Bach is great on anything.
    Jim

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    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidKOS View Post
    My impression is that the fingering needs to be adjusted to be more practical on mandolin.
    Hey, David: Give it a try. I would be curious what you think. It looks to me that Matt's fingering is trying to avoid open strings whereas when we play the Cello Prelude there is a need for the open strings. I can play pretty much the first 9 measures in first position as long as I include open strings and move up to third in measure 10. Then I think it is possible to play the rest in first position.

    Listening to the piece on piano you hear the first note at the beginning of each half-measure held under the other notes of each arpeggio. In that case, as in the cello prelude, it would make sense to hold that note down and let it ring so open notes would be preferable I would think.
    Jim

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    Registered User mbruno's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

    The Cello Suites are great - but I would play those on a mandola or mandocello personally. While they work on mandolin, I miss the low end haha. Sorry if I didn't get the name exactly right but glad y'all figured it out

    I actually wrote up two variations of this piece - one with a lot of open strings, one with pretty much all closed strings unless necessary (like low G) which is the one I posted here. There are some tricky parts in the fingering with closed position for sure, but a lot of parts I find easier this way too. I can post the open variation later today - but personally, I don't like that variation haha.

    If David or anyone has suggestions for fingering updates, I'd love to hear them. While I spent a good amount of time to make this piece work for me and my style, I'm sure there are many other ways to play this and I'd love to know your thoughts.
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  17. #12

    Default Re: Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

    And, I wasn't even talking about the fingerings - but rather the 'picking' element. One tremendous disadvantage of plectrum playing is just this. I appreciate the exercise of playing Bach with a plectrum, on a mndln no less, but it's not aesthetically pleasing to me. I'm spoiled, yes, being a guitar and cello player.

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    MandolaViola bratsche's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

    Here is a thread I posted in June, 2014 (how time flies!) of my version of BWV 846 on mandola:

    https://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/t...-Major-BWV-846

    bratsche

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  21. #14

    Default Re: Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

    Well that was unfortunate timing there expressing my opinion. Bratsche's playing is terrific

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    Registered User Ken_P's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bach Prelude No 1 in C for Mandolin

    This seems like a job for a 10 string! I worked this up in about an hour just to see how it would go and I'm pretty happy with it. Playing is a little rough but I didn't have all day to practice. I will admit to being a total cheat, though - I did this as a multitrack session in Audacity and recorded each bar separately, I think the transitions from bar to bar are what make it tough on mandola/lin. It hardly required any reworking, though, I just moved everything from bar 18 on up an octave to keep it in range and revoiced the final chord very slightly into a mandolin friendly shape and everything else is as written. I played it entirely in first position (except for the final two measures) and across strings to allow the notes to ring out as much as possible. Enjoy!

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/1LLP...ew?usp=sharing
    Last edited by Ken_P; Jan-21-2022 at 5:36pm.

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