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Thread: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

  1. #1

    Question got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    really i just want to know if anyone has had any issues as shown in the photos...i have never seeen anything like it before, but perhaps some of you have. i am considering buying tthis instrument and it would be good to know beforehand if i should just avoid it. so yeah, the line down the back where the two pieces of the back meet, there is what looks to be a scratch, but it is perfectly on the line, so i am thinking compression? fracture? i am not sure as i say though, which is why i ask you. please to help me, thankyou .

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  2. #2
    Registered User jim simpson's Avatar
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    I would guess this is a fairly low priced purchase that you are considering. The plain back wood grain suggests it's a student grade instrument. I'm not sure which bothers me more, the back crack or the strap button on the neck heel. I would avoid this one given the alternatives the market has to offer.
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  3. #3

    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    Seam separation. Run away!
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    Registered User sblock's Avatar
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    Do not buy a mandolin with a back whose seam is separating like that. Also, avoid any F-model mandolin with a superfluous strap button at the base of the neck.

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    Martin Stillion mrmando's Avatar
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    Yeah, it looks cheap and it also looks like the photos were taken in a pawnshop (?). I don't know what other kind of store has a bunch of sneakers on the wall right behind a jewelry display case—and also has cheap mandolins.

    A music store that cared about quality mandolins would take this back into the repair shop and try to fix that seam separation instead of selling it in that condition. Just say no.
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    Adrian Minarovic
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    It looks like a low quality instrument with pressed back (possibly even laminate). The center joint is coming apart (perhaps from heat or low humidity) which is never a good sign.
    If it's well playable as is with no other problems (look around neck joint etc...) and they sell it for $50 and you like it as beater/campfire mando, you can just put two lengths of good masking tape along the crack as close as possible to it and flood the crack with good thin CA glue. Renmove the tape before the glue bead hardens but leave the glue harden for few hours then GENTLY scrape away glue above the crack with fine scraper of razor blade (half covered with tape not to damage finish around the crack) and finally do some finish sanding with fine grits and buff out. But don't do it if you're not familiar with the process. It's simple 5 minute job for a skilled guy but you can damage the surrounding finish easily.
    Adrian

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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    I’m just wondering whether installing the strap button caused the crack?

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    Registered User Simon DS's Avatar
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    Lucky it had that strap fitted.
    Otherwise the back would have been all messed up by the truck tire marks.

    What does it sound like?

  11. #9

    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    Quote Originally Posted by HoGo View Post
    It looks like a low quality instrument with pressed back (possibly even laminate). The center joint is coming apart (perhaps from heat or low humidity) which is never a good sign.
    If it's well playable as is with no other problems (look around neck joint etc...) and they sell it for $50 and you like it as beater/campfire mando, you can just put two lengths of good masking tape along the crack as close as possible to it and flood the crack with good thin CA glue. Renmove the tape before the glue bead hardens but leave the glue harden for few hours then GENTLY scrape away glue above the crack with fine scraper of razor blade (half covered with tape not to damage finish around the crack) and finally do some finish sanding with fine grits and buff out. But don't do it if you're not familiar with the process. It's simple 5 minute job for a skilled guy but you can damage the surrounding finish easily.
    Can the ‘carved’ relief at the scroll be created by press, or would this perhaps just be filler? Same question with laminate.

  12. #10
    Registered User J Mangio's Avatar
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    I have a mandolin with a similar crack, cleated, been that way since I bought it 15+ years ago, plays/sounds fine.
    If the tone and price is right, go for it.
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    Martin Stillion mrmando's Avatar
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    Quote Originally Posted by J Mangio View Post
    I have a mandolin with a similar crack, cleated...
    Sure, but the separation in this case is most likely not cleated, and trying to cleat it by working through the F-holes would be a pain, and quite expensive relative to the value of the instrument. Adrian's CA repair job recommended above is probably a better approach for an instrument of this quality. But still, there are bound to be similar cheap mandolins available to the OP that do not need any repair.
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    Registered User sblock's Avatar
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    A proper repair would likely cost more than the asking price of this mandolin. You are probably better off saving your money and buying a mandolin in better condition.

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    Worlds ok-ist mando playr Zach Wilson's Avatar
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    In the fourth picture I can see what looks to be the outside square housing for a preamp. I've only ever seen those, factory installed, on lesser mandolins.

    Unless the price was real low I'd walk.

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    Registered User Charles E.'s Avatar
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    +1 for avoiding any mandolin with a straphanger installed in the button. No need for that amateur crap. Your money is best spent elsewhere.
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    Moderator MikeEdgerton's Avatar
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    It's apparently one of these.
    "It's comparable to playing a cheese slicer."
    --M. Stillion

    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them"
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  19. #16

    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    it sounds pretty decent, it is hard to tell really though bc the strings on it seem to be almost as old as i am. i saw it first one night while bussing and walking to get a starter for my car, it was horribly out of tune, i tuned up and about a week later i went back and it was almost perfectly in tune still. some of the comments above made me laugh bc at the time of release for this particular instrument, they were charging $1145-1400 for the thing. So once I pointed out all the flaws and asked them how long the instrument had been there and requested some photos, i was able to talk them down from 449 to 300. I am still unsure about the purchase and hope to learn more about the process HoGo is talking about above.

  20. #17
    Registered User Simon DS's Avatar
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    well i suppose 300 is cheap considering it is an active Fishman system. it is an old Legacy Deluxe Michael Kelly model that was made in Korea. when they released these things back in the 90s they were like 1200 bucks. so 300 is about 25% of the original cost, but until I learn more about seam separation, i am content to let it continue to sit in that shop.

    why is a pre-installed electric option a bad thing though? (honestly want to know) i read about artists like tony rice and grisman, other purists, who have been quoted saying they would never sully their instruments by putting any type of pickup or even a contact mic on their instrument. i suppose that makes sense to me for artists of that time, or even into the 90's a bit, but with the type of tech these days, it seems like a good thing to me. I appreciate any experience of knowledge shared.

  22. #19

    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    yup it totally is a mike kelly

  23. #20

    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    i know that reflected price does not necessarily reflect quality, but all things considered, 300 for a once 1200 mandolin would still be worth it, right? (even with the seam separation) i honestly do not know, but would like to know, what happens from this? it does not seem to affect the tone thus far, but it does have some OLD strings on it. they stayed almost in perfect tune from the last time i was in there and tuned it up, about a week. it is an old legacy deluxe electric michael kelly. the company recently sold and as i understand, the original company was not really honoring warranties, so i do not know what the new one would do. any correspondence i have had with them thus far has been email CS and the responder has literally told me "I don't know" and that is it, literally three different times. -=--but yeah, a person down the line in comments said he has a mando with the exact thing that hasn't been an issue, for over 15 years or something close to that time...so really i am wondering what happens with this issue? do they just explode or fall apart in mid-chop or something if not repaired? i could not find any videos so far.

  24. #21

    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    what is cleated and not cleated mean?

  25. #22
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    A cleat is a small sliver of wood glued across a crack to reinforce it.

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    Worlds ok-ist mando playr Zach Wilson's Avatar
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    Quote Originally Posted by ol trashfire joe View Post
    why is a pre-installed electric option a bad thing though? (honestly want to know) i read about artists like tony rice and grisman, other purists, who have been quoted saying they would never sully their instruments by putting any type of pickup or even a contact mic on their instrument. i suppose that makes sense to me for artists of that time, or even into the 90's a bit, but with the type of tech these days, it seems like a good thing to me. I appreciate any experience of knowledge shared.
    You'll have to re-read my comments. I said:

    "I've only ever seen those, factory installed, on lesser mandolins."

    It's not necessarily a bad thing to have a pre-installed preamp pickup. However, if it was me, I'd walk away from a lower end F style that needs work like this one.
    Last edited by Zach Wilson; Jan-18-2022 at 9:54am.

  28. #24
    Confused... or?
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    Quote Originally Posted by ol trashfire joe View Post
    ... why is a pre-installed electric option a bad thing though? ... with the type of tech these days, it seems like a good thing ...
    Because, in effect, that statement -when stated- has always been true and always will be true. The problem with that? "Tech these days" from 20 years ago is WAY obsolete today, and tech from today WILL BE obsolete in 10 or 20 years. In both cases (besides avoiding potential sound improvement), you'll eventually be left with a hole in the side of the instrument that none of the available "tech these days" will be able to properly repair.

    Quote Originally Posted by ol trashfire joe View Post
    ... i suppose that makes sense to me for artists of that time, or even into the 90's a bit...
    It's not so much the artists of ANY time; it's the artists with mandolins valued from, oooh, $5K up to $200K (there have been such) who'd rather not cut that value in half, or risk their inherent sound quality, by cutting holes.

    Life lesson from a 75-year-old (a common freebee here on the Cafe!):
    Everyone, always, starts out thinking that the next "best thing" to come along will be the "best thing forever"; it never is.
    Last edited by EdHanrahan; Jan-18-2022 at 10:11am.
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    Default Re: got a live one here folks, and he is coming in hot

    With respect to 20 year old tech not being up to todays standards, whilst some tech has moved on, as far as I’m aware, a piezo pickup sold today will be largely the same as one sold years ago.

    By way of example, I have a Barcus Berry in one of my guitars and, using a fairly recent pre-amp, it sounds little different to any of those in my other guitars. The main difference is that I fitted the Barcus Berry in about 1975.
    Last edited by Ray(T); Jan-18-2022 at 12:40pm. Reason: Spelling!

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