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Thread: Mic for onboard use

  1. #1
    Registered User Billy Packard's Avatar
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    Default Mic for onboard use

    When I first got my Gilchrist A3 back in 1993 I had a condenser mic installed that was inside the mandolin mounted at the end of the endpin plug. It worked really well for years and years before it didn't. I can't remember the name...it was something like "The Guitar Mic" or...? I want to go back to something like that because I just can't stand the transducer mode any longer. I prefer a good mic on a stand but when that won't work I need to be able to plug in.

    Billy
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    What are you intending to plug it into?

  3. #3
    Registered User Billy Packard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    My normal pa is the Bose L1 #2 with the ToneMatch T4S. This setup is very friendly to stand mics but occasionally I'll use the Bose S1 Pro and/or an Acoustic Image Chorus 2 which are much easier with an onboard device.
    Billy Packard
    Gilchrist A3, 1993
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    Both of those have phantom power available so you should be able to plug a condenser mic straight in. I’d be looking at something from DPA although a Schertler stick on would be an option. It will then depend upon how much you want to spend.

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  6. #5

    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    I saw a duo yesterday that used a Bose L1 and I was totally impressed with the sound. And the fact that they didn't need monitors also sold me on the $1,200 price tag.

    That said, I agree wtih Ray(T) about the use of a Schertler DYN-M P48 with the Bose on-board phantom 48V. I use a Schertler on my mandolin and like the fact that I can remove it for our mostly acoustic gigs. I think that the Schertler through the Bose would have an awesome sound. Someday, when I strike it rich, I might be able to find out.

    Prior to using the stick-on mic, I used a "pencil" condenser mic that is advertised for drummers. It sounded good with the 48V p-power, but of course, kept me rooted to one spot which doesn't work for us toe-tappers and turn-to-the-siders.

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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    Take a look at the Your Heaven Audio system. I had a chance to try it out recently and am pretty impressed. Its a good option if you want a microphone quality sound but with decent feedback avoidance. I did not get a chance to use it live since I had it when there were no shows to be played, though I expect it would work well on a quiet to moderately loud stage.

    https://www.yourheaven.net/product/c...stem-mandolin/

  9. #7
    Curious Observer MB-Octo's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    Wondering if the internal mentioned was one of Ken Donell’s MiniFlex mics? Still available … https://www.miniflexmic.com/
    Monte

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    Registered User foldedpath's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    I've used the DPA 4099 system clip-on mics for years and it's worked very well. I have several for use on my mandolin, my OM, a guitar partner's acoustic guitar and another partner's fiddle. Great mics, good feedback rejection and small enough not to be too noticeable when performing.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    Billy - bear in mind that DPA don’t only produce the 4099 they also have mics that you could, in theory, mount on an endpin although you’d probbaly need to weild a soldering iron to do so.

    One advantage of the 4099 is that you can either mount it on the instrument or use it in a mic stand with one of their optional stand adapters. My only concern with the 4099 is the rather thin and delicate looking lead attached to it.

  12. #10
    Mandolin user MontanaMatt's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    I know many of the members tire of this referral, but Baggs radius through a Tonedexter is the ultimate plugged in mandolin solution. I just played a brew festival, on a loud pa with lots of stage volume, had zero worries of trouble, no feedback, great tone….ez-pz.
    It is a mic modeling system, so it takes time upfront to get the programming right, but once that’s done, plug and go at every show.
    Check out my signature line “too many microphones “, I love condenser mics, and have many nice ones, I even use one on stage for our central low instrument mic(used for step-in solo boost/presence). I could play through only mics if I wanted too, and have the rig(X32) and skills to engineer it in any setting. I love the tone and presence of the pickup and Tonedexter.
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  13. #11
    Registered User foldedpath's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    Quote Originally Posted by Ray(T) View Post
    My only concern with the 4099 is the rather thin and delicate looking lead attached to it.
    The original design had the cord molded into the mic body. The current design has a detachable cord, so you could carry a spare if you were worried about it. I think the reason the cords are so thin is that they're often used by fiddlers, horn players and others with wireless bodypack transmitters, where you want it as inconspicuous as possible.

    Most of my 4099 mics are the older type, and I've abused them occasionally with no issues. Things like stepping on the cord and yanking the mic off the mandolin where it hits the floor. That was before I trained myself not to do that.

  14. #12
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    Mine’s also the older type. It says something if they’ve made the lead detachable! I wind up the lead, clip the XLR to my belt and run a decent lead from there to my amp.

    The lead on my Schertler is braided and a bit more substantial.

  15. #13
    Registered User Billy Packard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    MB-Octo You got it! It was a MiniFlex and it worked fine.

    Incredibly bad news though...MiniFlex and Ken Donnell had their headquarters in Greenville CA. Greenville burned to the ground in the Dixie fire which still rages on. I don't know if Ken is ok or not, the ph. # (530)284-1689 routes to a recording saying circuits aren't working. I sure hope he got out in time. Does anyone know?

    Thanks for comments. I had a 4099 but found it too awkward. The MiniFlex was nicely tucked inside the mandolin and produced a very authentic sound. I have K&K's in two fine Martin guitars and they sound very realistic but not in the mandolins. I have a Radius in one mandolin with the para acoustic DI that's ok but doesn't come close to the Shure KM137 I've been using.


    Billy

    ps If anyone has/knows where I could get a MiniFlex please pm me.
    Billy Packard
    Gilchrist A3, 1993
    Stiver Fern, 1990
    Weber Fern, 2007
    Gibson F4 Hybrid #1, D. Harvey 2009
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  17. #14

    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    Does your MiniFlex have a battery? Looking on the site some of them used a battery. Could be as simple as replacing the battery. Time for a dental mirror and a flashlight.
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    I have K&K pickups in my mandolin and they sound great. I use a FireEye preamp. I also didn't install the pickups the normal way. I don't trust the tape, but it is a warmer sound, so I glued tape to the pickup, glued tape to the tape, then glued the second piece of tape to the top. I have had compliments from other mandolin players on the sound. I also think it sound good and very much like my mandolin.
    THE WORLD IS A BETTER PLACE JUST FOR YOUR SMILE!

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  20. #16
    Registered User Billy Packard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    Don- The MiniFlex I had did use a small hearing aid battery. It was integrated into the appliance. I changed it when things got wonky sounding.
    ... thing is...I don't remember where I put it. But it did stop functioning. But maybe it can be tweaked back to life?!

    Pops - I GET that K&K is cool. The guy at K&K described the method you suggest. To me and even more importantly my sweetheart Alexis's ears (https://www.alexisalrichcomposer.com) the mic is in a different sonic category. The mic has air around the sound, the transducer is a mechanical reproduction.

    Maybe I'll try the K&K again in the Gil - the luthier admits his error and is willing to replace it (He glued it directly inside the mandolin top w/out ANY pad. I'll let you know if my opinion is altered.

    Please see if anyone can find out what's up with Ken Donnell.


    Billy
    Billy Packard
    Gilchrist A3, 1993
    Stiver Fern, 1990
    Weber Fern, 2007
    Gibson F4 Hybrid #1, D. Harvey 2009
    Gibson 1923 A2
    Numerous wonderful guitars

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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    You are right, you won't get any air with a transducer, but then I don't hear the air acoustically either. No transducer will match a microphone, but I do get a good sound, only solid good sound without the air. By the way K&K agreeing with me, is because it came from me. Good luck on a new install, it does make a difference.
    THE WORLD IS A BETTER PLACE JUST FOR YOUR SMILE!

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  23. #18
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    I returned to mic-on-a-stand last year, before that I tried and liked various solutions. Clip-on mics that really captured the sound of the instrument were the DPA 4061 and the John Bartlett mando mic. Among the gooseneck solutions I preferred the AT 350 over the DPA 4099 for more solid mount. Pickups I liked were Dazzo and K&K, Dazzo more natural sounding.
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  24. #19

    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    I use a featherlight , meyers on my fiddle with good sucess and they are not that expensive , if you have the bucks go for the more expensive ones not sure if they are cost efective for most situations , given whay pa and system you are running them through.

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  26. #20
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    Ended up playing two gigs on Saturday. On the second everyone was playing into their own amp and no monitors, so I played into a Fishman. I didn't have as bright a sound from the Fishman, I assume no high's, only the 8" speaker. Actually had to turn my highs up in the Fishman. Not exactly sure what it sounded like in the PA as we were under the speakers hanging from the ceiling. I feel most pickups sound bright thru the PA because of the horns. When I built my monitors I used 8" speakers and 1" soft dome tweeters with a cross over. Nice warm sound, and better than store bought with a horn (horn= long throw device) which is not needed in a monitor.

    Opps put this in the wrong place, was thinking of another thread. Sorry.
    Last edited by pops1; Aug-30-2021 at 11:32am.
    THE WORLD IS A BETTER PLACE JUST FOR YOUR SMILE!

  27. #21

    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    I have used an Audio Technica Pro 35 gooseneck condenser mic when the gig calls for that kind of sound, since the mid-1990s. I’ve used this mic on mandolin, tenor guitar, tenor banjo, and 6-string guitar, and been happy with the results. On mandolin, I clipped it onto the tailpiece. It does require phantom power, but I never ran into a situation where I couldn’t use it.

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  29. #22
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    I am using the Myers Feather Pickup and really like the sound. It has a lot of options for installation and is very easy to put on and take off.

    https://www.myerspickups.com/pickups/the-feather-series
    https://www.myerspickups.com/see-in-...ndolin+Pickups

    Alan
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  31. #23
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    Billy,
    I have been using the Myers condenser mics. a small company in sunny Ca. He makes alot of different versions for many instruments. The type I use has a carpenter jack with 2 mini very flexible condenser mic on the very tip end of the wire. He / Gregg just told me a month ago that he now offers a volume control knob on the side instead of the top of the small battery box / that is on the carpenter jack. He has been making all on mine like this for years, this way I leave the rig / carpenter jack on my instruments all the time and being able to close my mandolin case. He will make to your spec the length of the wire that has the condenser mic in the end. One side might need to be longer then the other for various instruments. Some folks might like one mic, I like two. The battery is a coin type and will last almost a yr. @ many a 3 or 4 hr gigs. So this doesn't require other phantom power. Greggs # is 714 900 0176 tell him his fav or rite red neck from Ala told you about his product. He has a nice web site to ponder and listen to some demo's.

  32. #24
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    Billy,
    I have been using the Myers condenser mics. a small company in sunny Ca. He makes alot of different versions for many instruments. The type I use has a carpenter jack with 2 mini very flexible condenser mic on the very tip end of the wire. He / Gregg just told me a month ago that he now offers a volume control knob on the side instead of the top of the small battery box / that is on the carpenter jack. He has been making all on mine like this for years, this way I leave the rig / carpenter jack on my instruments all the time and being able to close my mandolin case. He will make to your spec the length of the wire that has the condenser mic in the end. One side might need to be longer then the other for various instruments. Some folks might like one mic, I like two. The battery is a coin type and will last almost a yr. @ many a 3 or 4 hr gigs. So this doesn't require other phantom power. Greggs # is 714 900 0176 tell him his fav or rite red neck from Ala told you about his product. He has a nice web site to ponder and listen to some demo's. Welp I guess I didn't read far enough down, someone else posted about his Myerspickups. I will add that I use a wireless instrument (xvive) system and there insn't any interference from the transmitter plugged into the myers pick up.
    Last edited by sailbydayplaybynight; Sep-03-2021 at 11:12am.

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  34. #25
    Registered User Billy Packard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mic for onboard use

    I just tried Meyers ph# and left a msg. I'm interested in chatting with Greg. I really like the idea of a mic inside the mandolin, like the MiniFlex. I never had problems with feedback which is a problem for me with mics on a stand. So far I'm reluctant to get a clip on. I'm a total "set it and ferget it" kinda guy.

    In the meantime Ken Donnell with MiniFlex mics seems to be N/A. The phones aren't working and the email is sent back. Anyone heard about his condition?

    Billy
    Billy Packard
    Gilchrist A3, 1993
    Stiver Fern, 1990
    Weber Fern, 2007
    Gibson F4 Hybrid #1, D. Harvey 2009
    Gibson 1923 A2
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