Endpin tolerances

[ivancook]

Just received a new mandolin and the tapered endpin came in the case instead of installed. If I push it in while turning, it will get about 1/16” from seating flush but will come out fairly easily if pulled. I’ve searched the forum and find multiple points of view about how much force to use to seat it. Any advice on how tight it should fit?

[Jim Garber]

If it were mine I would put a strip of adhesive tape just enough to keep it solidly in the hole. I would not glue it. I don't know if there are more preferable methods.

[kurth83]

I wuz thinkin my mandos don't have anything like that, I forgot I removed them all to install pickups. :-)

This video shows how to tighten up a loose endpin, and at the end you can see him install the masking-tape-wrapped pin with more force than I would have had the courage to use. :-)

Maybe you just need to push a bit (careful though) harder.

https://store.banjobenclark.com/blog...olin-or-fiddle

[ivancook]

...but is it normal for them to NOT go in all the way?

[sunburst]

If the pin goes in all the way there is a good chance that it will not be tight enough in the hole. Ideally, the taper of the pin and the taper of the hole match perfectly and the taper causes the pin to firmly tighten in the hole just as it fits in all the way. In real life, I think it is best if the pin tightens just before it goes in all the way. Changes in relative humidity can change the fit of the pin, and if it is not quite all the way in, and it becomes loose, it can be tightened by seating it further in.
As for the OP mandolin, to really do it right, the hole would be reamed and/or the pin shaved until the tapers match and the pin fits nearly all the way in. I suspect that the taper does not match well because if it did the pin would not pull out easily once seated.
When the taper of the pin and hole match, not much force is needed to seat the pin and it does not pull out too easily.

[Ranger Bob]

If it were mine I would put a strip of adhesive tape just enough to keep it solidly in the hole. I would not glue it. I don't know if there are more preferable methods.

I’ve done the same using electricians tape. Worked fine and stayed in place.

[j. condino]

Better to have it 1/16" proud in the summer so there is a bit of extra to go in during the winter when the humidity drops and the hole opens up ever so slightly from dryness, than to have a perfect summer fit and so loose it falls out during the winter...

No matter how long I work on and build them, I'll never agree with a tapered fit endpin on a mandolin. Its origins come from the violin world, but those have a tailgut and string tension to keep them in place at all times. Mandolins just have them stuck in the hole so they are much more subject to seasonal variations in fit and pretty much every one of us has experienced the dreaded strap popping off at the worst moment when things get too loose.

On my personal instruments, I never use a tapered endpin. I always use a screw based strap button that uses the bottom screw in the tailpiece anchors. No adjustment and it never falls off or comes loose...

[Fretbear]

No matter how long I work on and build them, I'll never agree with a tapered fit endpin on a mandolin. Its origins come from the violin world, but those have a tailgut and string tension to keep them in place at all times. Mandolins just have them stuck in the hole so they are much more subject to seasonal variations in fit and pretty much every one of us has experienced the dreaded strap popping off at the worst moment when things get too loose.

On my personal instruments, I never use a tapered endpin. I always use a screw based strap button that uses the bottom screw in the tailpiece anchors. No adjustment and it never falls off or comes loose...

+1
Stupid things are just broken pegheads and necks waiting to happen.
See above or just tie a length of rawhide lace to the strap end and then run it into the hole and knot it off inside instead.

[multidon]

+1. Mr. Condino has nailed it! A screw in end button is far superior to a tapered push fit one. Especially if you are going to use it for straps. The push in tapered ones were never designed for straps. One additional thing, though. The screw in type does not make a large enough hole to use for the rare occasions that require it for a repair situation, or to be able to just look in there to find a loose brace or something. As a Weber owner I am a big
fan of their solution, a non-tapered larger hole with a knurled thumb screw acting as the strap button, treading into a rubber compression nut. I have never had any problem with those coming loose. Didn’t the Breedlove use something similar? I can’t remember. I might be wrong about this, but I think the hole is drilled so that you can mount a pickup jack endpin without re-drilling if you wish it. Please correct me if I’m wrong.

[mandroid]

Didnt Weber have an expanding rubber one with a metal button you tightened to expand it?

I've had a rubber bicycle handlebar plug that could do that....


I expect they did not put the tapered pin in so it wouldn't damage the end-block in shipping accidents..

[John Soper]

In mandolins with tapered endpins, I always tie a length of leather cord from the strap under the tailpiece, so that dislodged pins don't result in disaster.

[Tom Haywood]

If your new mandolin is the Ellis shown in your signature, I suggest you call them for their recommendation. I feel certain they have a good reason for fitting the end pin the way they do.

[j. condino]

The last I knew, the parent company Two Old Hippies owns both Weber and Breedlove, so there are some cross pollination of ideas.

[ivancook]

Thanks for all the advice. I reached out to the maker and per their email, "It should not go in flush. Do not push it all the way, just until it is snug." There you have it! I like the idea of it having some flexibility to move with the seasons and changes in humidity.