Gibson Mandolin Banjo - early??

[Dave Fuller]

Hello all,

I am trying to get this old MB into playing condition. It belonged to my dad, 10th bday present in 1949 (used when he got it). It is in its original case. I don't know if it is a serial number but the neck bar through resonator is stamped
"685". Has gold oval guarantee tag on inside resonator.

I found a similar one (same tuning head and shape) online somewhere with "422" stamp claiming it is pre-catalog 1918 instrument. I just don't have the knowledge to know what it true and false here.

Also, it is has a 5/8 bridge and new mandolin strings and it seems very clunky to play. Does anyone have suggestions for alternative strings or where to get a Grover 1/2" MB bridge that might help with playability upgrade.

Thank you for your sleuthing help.

[NickR]

Unfortunately your instrument has new tuners and the old units would probably help to date it. I think the G & S case- from what I can see, does not have a rivet in the middle of the diamond. Cases made before 1922 have a rivet. If the case is original- they were both bought new at the same time- and they probably were, this gives some assistance in dating the instrument. If you have the old tuners, then take a photo of them and post it up.

[Dave Fuller]

Nick here is a pic of original tuners. The out line is visible on the back of tuning head. I know these were original to the unit at least to 1949 per my dad.

[rcc56]

This is indeed one of the earliest Gibson banjos of any kind. The combination of the bound "open book" peghead with fleur-de-lis and inlaid logo, bound neck and heel, and the double bound rim indicates the earliest version of what would soon be catalogued as style 4. Shortly after this instrument was built, the peghead shape was change to a fancy "mocassin" shape, and within another year or two the double binding on the rim and the bound heel would be abandoned.

The production date of your instrument would have been approximately 1918 or 1919. It is most likely that it left the factory with the then common 4 on a plate Waverly tuners with plain ivoroid buttons that were being used on Gibson A model mandolins from the same period.

[Dave Fuller]

Case rivet pic

[NickR]

That style of Waverly tuner unit was used for quite a while- possibly nearly 20 years- in the first, second and into the third decade of the 20th century. I was wondering if the mandolin had Waverly "arrowhead" tuners- which were used for a few years in the early 1920s. On that basis the tuners do not help narrow down the date. Somebody will probably know when "The Gibson" on the headstock was first used and likewise, that fleur de lis as well which may narrow it down a little. Edit: I see you have shown the rivet in the case but as has already been posted- the mandolin is indeed before 1922 and you have been told it is actually 1918 or 1919 in another comment.

[Dave Fuller]

Thank you kindly for your insight. Have you heard of using 2 sets of tenor banjo strings instead of mandolin strings to increase playability? I suspect 1/2" bridge will greatly help.

My dad will be very happy to hear the story of the ole banjolin being such a sweet plum!

Best,

Dave

[Dave Fuller]

Nick, thank you for your insights, they are greatly appreciated. Knowing about the rivet in the diamond is mind-boggling to me.

Best,

Dave