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Thread: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

  1. #1

    Default Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    Hello,

    I am wandering down the path of adding some slight effects to my mandolin when amplified just for fun and to learn what this stuff is all about. I picked up a Fishman Loudbox Artist acoustic amp, which has a few settings on it but was thinking about getting an Overdrive pedal. After doing more research I am starting to understand that an overdrive pedal seems like it is really meant to overdrive an electric guitar amp, which is different from a Acoustic amp or PA. So I am wondering what kind of effects pedals people are using without having to go down the road of getting an electric guitar amp. Thanks for any advice.

  2. #2
    Quietly Making Noise Dave Greenspoon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    Most acoustic amps with a tweeter will NOT be happy with an overdrivd pedal. My Loudbox manual specifically says to avoid them.
    Axes: Rigel A Natural #1774 w/mods, Andrew Jerman Irwin-style 5 string electric "Stealie", Eastman 515, Shiro F-5, Crafter M85E, Dillion 335 style, Grandmom's solid-mahogany teens bent-top, Baglamas 002
    Boards: Acoustic Electric
    Amps: Fishman Loudbox 100; Rivera Clubster Royale Recording Head; Laney Cub 10 & Cab, Peavey Studio Pro

  3. #3

    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    Or run a low pass at around 4-6khz, since that's effectively what an electric guitar speaker does.
    Precisely duplicating the frequency rolloff would be better achieved with a cab modelling pedal than with eq.
    Electric guitar amp and speaker response curves are nowhere near flat, very different from our acoustic world where flat is good.

    Even so, not sure I would use a fishman with the results since they say no.

    A powered PA would probably be a better fit, like DXR, DBR, QSC.
    Last edited by kurth83; Jun-04-2019 at 12:31pm.
    Trinity College TM325 Octave Mandolin (converted to 4-string tenor guitar).
    Eastman MD-605SB, MD-604SB, MD-305, all with Grover 309 tuners.
    Eastwood 4 string electric mandostang, 2x Airline e-mandola (4-string) one strung as an e-OM.
    DSP's: Helix HX Stomp, various Zooms.
    Amps: QSC-K10, DBR-10, THR-10, Sony XB-20.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    If you are mainly using an acoustic sound and not wanting to sound like a guitar, I would stick with time delay and/or modulation effects. Things like reverb, delay, chorus, phase shifting, etc. can be a lot of fun and still let the acoustic sound shine through if that is what you are after.

  5. #5
    Quietly Making Noise Dave Greenspoon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    I really like the plate reverb on the Fishman Loudbox 100 LBX400. That said, the Fishman AFX chorus and delay pedals are awesome. Delay has a tap input, and the AFX line are all stereo, and 9vDC battery capable. Reverb is a good source for them.
    Axes: Rigel A Natural #1774 w/mods, Andrew Jerman Irwin-style 5 string electric "Stealie", Eastman 515, Shiro F-5, Crafter M85E, Dillion 335 style, Grandmom's solid-mahogany teens bent-top, Baglamas 002
    Boards: Acoustic Electric
    Amps: Fishman Loudbox 100; Rivera Clubster Royale Recording Head; Laney Cub 10 & Cab, Peavey Studio Pro

  6. #6

    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    I thought about this some more, I've been down this road, but am not at the end of it yet, thought I could offer a few more pointers.

    I started with a few pedals, then I got a cheap multi-pedal (Zoom). Got a lot of fun for cheap out of the zooms, and it had all the effects to play with for very little money. I would suggest they are the best starter pedals period. You can try virtually any effect, amp, and cab sim all in a $150 pedal. And the EQ sections are great, as is chorus. Reverb left a little something to be desired for me and the preamp was hissy, and the sound quality was just ok. But the huge library of effects tryable for almost nothing is well worth the price of admission. I did gig with it on bass for several years (I have MS50G, MS-60B, and a G3). Battery powered is a bonus too.

    I never did the pedal-board thing because I like multipedals, but somehow I own quite a few pedals now, mostly pres, comps, EQs, and multis.

    At some point I got more serious, bought a 4-string electric, and a Helix soon afterwards. Helix is THE top-of-the-line multipedal. Whole websites are devoted to it's patches, it's a world I didn't know existed before. It's acoustic effects are first rate too, reverb, delay, chorus, EQ, compressor... And it has the finest library of effects, amp, and cab sims you can buy AFAIK.

    So, choose your path, lots of fun there if you want it.
    Trinity College TM325 Octave Mandolin (converted to 4-string tenor guitar).
    Eastman MD-605SB, MD-604SB, MD-305, all with Grover 309 tuners.
    Eastwood 4 string electric mandostang, 2x Airline e-mandola (4-string) one strung as an e-OM.
    DSP's: Helix HX Stomp, various Zooms.
    Amps: QSC-K10, DBR-10, THR-10, Sony XB-20.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    Quote Originally Posted by kurth83 View Post
    I started with a few pedals, then I got a cheap multi-pedal (Zoom). Got a lot of fun for cheap out of the zooms, and it had all the effects to play with for very little money. I would suggest they are the best starter pedals period. You can try virtually any effect, amp, and cab sim all in a $150 pedal.
    I second the suggestion of the ZOOM multieffect pedals. The ZOOM G1on and G1xon (same thing as G1on but with expression pedal) are around $70 used on eBay. I also own the B1on and B1xon (for bass) as they have better synth effects, but they don't have the same octave shifter choices.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    I have been down the digital multi-effects pedal road before many times, and they can be quite fun and a great learning experience. Some people swear by them. But I have found a dedicated, hand-picked pedal board with mainly analog effects sounds WAY better than most, if not all, digital multi effects. There is just something about digital that can result in a plasticky sound, sometimes latency, and a less dynamic sound overall. YMMV

  9. #9
    Lord of All Badgers Lord of the Badgers's Avatar
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    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    I have a couple of useful pedal effects. Not all for the instrument itself.
    I like my Pluspedal which is an intelligent freeze effect with a piano pedal as a trigger. If you put a modulated reverb pedal in the effects loop of the Pluspedal and then hit a mando chord to set up a drone it's pretty damn cool. I need to actually write a song around that idea actually, come to think.
    I also have an EHX POG2 and MEL9. A harmoniser and mellotron pedal respectively. If used carefully with subtlety they can really lift sections of a tune.
    Finally I said not all my pedals are instruments purely. The TC Acoustic Play is a blast - again - careful with the tech Eugene (Floyd quote... Lol) but the vocal doubling or harmonies coupled with some great acoustic instrument effects really add a lot but don't overdo it or you look a total plum. Seriously though - that pedal is pretty clever and does allow for an awesome live vocal sound. Good compressor / de-esser type stuff going on...

    But as the others say - distortion is a no no on acoustic amps.
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  10. #10
    Lord of All Badgers Lord of the Badgers's Avatar
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    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    Really do fancy a Meris Enzo at some point...that thing is crazy
    My name is Rob, and I am Lord of All Badgers

    Paul Shippey custom "Tone" Octave Mandolin, Paul Shippey "Axe" Bouzouki,
    Phil Davidson A5 "Badgerlin" mandolin, Phil Davidson F5 mandolin,
    Mcilroy Tenor Guitar, Phil Davidson Tenor Mandola
    My band's website

  11. #11
    Americana in France? Daniel Nestlerode's Avatar
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    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    Staying acoustic, a bit of compression and a boost are always helpful.
    Look into effects made by Origin Effects (NFI), they have great pre-amp circuits.

    Give a Boss GE-7 EQ pedal a try. It has a boost function and could probably carve out some of the frequencies kurth83 mentioned.

    Loopers are good for solo practicing!

    Hope that helps!
    Daniel

  12. #12

    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    Quote Originally Posted by Josh Levine View Post
    Hello,

    I am wandering down the path of adding some slight effects to my mandolin when amplified just for fun and to learn what this stuff is all about. I picked up a Fishman Loudbox Artist acoustic amp, which has a few settings on it but was thinking about getting an Overdrive pedal. After doing more research I am starting to understand that an overdrive pedal seems like it is really meant to overdrive an electric guitar amp, which is different from a Acoustic amp or PA. So I am wondering what kind of effects pedals people are using without having to go down the road of getting an electric guitar amp. Thanks for any advice.
    Hello Josh,

    I will refer you to thread I started a short while ago discussing the use of effects on an acoustic mandolin.

    https://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/t...stic-Mandolins

    However, I am not using an acoustic amp, but rather amps typically designed for electric guitars. I guess most effects will work fine except for dirt effects (distortion, fuzz, overdrive). I am not sure how acoustic amps handle volume swells, but it wouldn't hurt to try.

  13. #13
    man about town Markus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel Nestlerode View Post
    Loopers are good for solo practicing!
    Love mine.

    While some of the online practice tools and youtube have started to take more of my time, I have found a looper [and metronome] to be essential for practice.

    As I also play guitar and have an octaver pedal [bass lines!] the looper is wonderful for practice of all kinds, as well as useful when writing tunes. I often record a simple metronome plus guitar strum to make my various scale/arpeggio/dexterity drills feel more musical [and be a little less tedious for my family to listen to].

    I have the RC-30 which is not without faults but I really appreciate the ability to store 99 loops for later use. As I only use the looper for practice, that feature is essential for me.
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  14. #14

    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    I love loopers, use them for sound checks.

    WRT EQ, multis all have very nice EQ in them, generally better than dedicated EQ pedals and preamps. In my MS-60B, I used a high and low pass, a compressor, boost, and a noise gate for the bass. That shaped my tone perfectly, all in a single-width pedal that cost less than dedicated pedals for the same function would have cost. It also had a tuner so that one pedal was all I needed. I have yet to find a multi that has feedback suppression in it however, those seem to be only in vocal effects processors.

    I also performed on mandolin on the Zoom. The effects I used were boost, compressor, and EQ. The EQ that really helps a mando pickup is a 200HZ high-pass, takes all the thumpiness out of the pickup (a common problem for body pickups). The compressor (gentle compression at 2x), smoothed out my dynamics so I sat better in the mix. The point of the compressor was so I could mix strumming with single note passages and have them sit at about the same volume in the mix. In a busy mix, you will get mixed for your loudest stuff (typically strums), and anything you play softer (like single note passages) tends to get lost. Using a small (2-3db) boost for solo passages can also help there.
    Trinity College TM325 Octave Mandolin (converted to 4-string tenor guitar).
    Eastman MD-605SB, MD-604SB, MD-305, all with Grover 309 tuners.
    Eastwood 4 string electric mandostang, 2x Airline e-mandola (4-string) one strung as an e-OM.
    DSP's: Helix HX Stomp, various Zooms.
    Amps: QSC-K10, DBR-10, THR-10, Sony XB-20.

  15. #15
    I really look like that soliver's Avatar
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    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    I've been toying with the idea of getting a reverb Pedal. I play through my church's PA using a Fire-eye Red-eye DI... any recommendations?

    Not intending to hijack this thread, this just seems like a relevant place to ask a similar question as the OP.
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  16. #16
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    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    Quote Originally Posted by soliver View Post
    I've been toying with the idea of getting a reverb Pedal. I play through my church's PA using a Fire-eye Red-eye DI... any recommendations?

    Not intending to hijack this thread, this just seems like a relevant place to ask a similar question as the OP.
    I would simply have the sound man/woman add reverb to your channel.
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  17. #17

    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    FWIW, I did a lunchtime gig for about a year at a local food court. The food court provided a PA and mics. After trying various amps and guitars, I found I could use my hollowbody electric plugged into the PA plus a few effects and it gave me a variety of sounds, it sounded fine, and it made for less stuff to carry from the parking, which was quite a distance by foot. I found a tube screamer through the PA gave the guitar somewhat of an amp sound, plus I used delay, chorus, and a little phase shifter on certain songs.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    The best reverb I have used so far, in a pedal format, and still use to this day, is the Neunaber Wet (mono). It is a very clean and beautiful-sounding reverb that does not mess with your core tone, and has useful knob settings especially for live work. It is in the MXR phase 90 format so is small and has only three knobs, very easy to tweak and set.

  19. #19
    Quietly Making Noise Dave Greenspoon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    Soliver, I love the Digitech Polara Reverb if I am not using the plate settings on the Loudbox. It uses Lexicon algorithms, is stereo if that matters, and sounds fantastic!

  20. #20

    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    I listened to the polara, yes, it sounded great, crystal clear, no digital artifacts (you can hear cheap ones loop). The artwork on it is icky though, would prefer a plain color. :-)
    Trinity College TM325 Octave Mandolin (converted to 4-string tenor guitar).
    Eastman MD-605SB, MD-604SB, MD-305, all with Grover 309 tuners.
    Eastwood 4 string electric mandostang, 2x Airline e-mandola (4-string) one strung as an e-OM.
    DSP's: Helix HX Stomp, various Zooms.
    Amps: QSC-K10, DBR-10, THR-10, Sony XB-20.

  21. #21

    Default Re: Effects for use on acoustic amp or PA with K and K pickup

    Quote Originally Posted by Josh Levine View Post
    Hello,

    I am wandering down the path of adding some slight effects to my mandolin when amplified just for fun and to learn what this stuff is all about. I picked up a Fishman Loudbox Artist acoustic amp, which has a few settings on it but was thinking about getting an Overdrive pedal. After doing more research I am starting to understand that an overdrive pedal seems like it is really meant to overdrive an electric guitar amp, which is different from a Acoustic amp or PA. So I am wondering what kind of effects pedals people are using without having to go down the road of getting an electric guitar amp. Thanks for any advice.
    Hello,

    With acoustic amps, reverb and delay pedals work beautifully. However, even modulators like phasers and flangers might work and result in wonderful sounds. I would just make sure to use a good preamp pedal (I use the LR Baggs Venue DI and love it) and a compressor pedal to get the most out of your effects.

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