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Thread: Waterloo Mandolin Released

  1. #51

    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    I received mine today from TME. Totally what I expected from Waterloo and Collings. If you are expecting something akin to their MT2 oval holes, this is not for you, but if you are looking for that old time flat top Kalamazoo vibe without all the issues some of those vintage specimens suffer from, these are for you. I play a lot of old time and Irish music, and I find the Waterloo a joy to play. Interestingly enough, it’s easier to play triplets and embellishments on this. I also imagine it will be fine for choro, and gypsy jazz too.

    More in a few days. But so far, it’s an A+
    Good Advice: Play before you pay, and know your product and your market.

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  3. #52
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    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    Mandobar, what was the actual price you paid?

    I'm hoping my local dealer will get one that I can try out.
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  4. #53
    Purveyor of Sunshine sgarrity's Avatar
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    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    With the recent price increase by Collings/Waterloo everything is sold at MSRP now, so $1,750 for the mandolin. If a buyer does finagle a discount or use a trade-in, Im sure the dealer wouldn't want that info posted publicly. A lot of dealers do offer free shipping though.

    Any other in-hand reviews? I can't believe they don't have any other videos up yet.

  5. #54
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    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    Quote Originally Posted by sgarrity View Post
    If a buyer does finagle a discount or use a trade-in, Im sure the dealer wouldn't want that info posted publicly. A lot of dealers do offer free shipping though.
    Fuller’s Guitar and Acoustic Music Works both do:

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  6. #55

    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    There’s no margin left for dealers after the recent changes to “deal”, especially with free shipping. $1750 is THE price.

    Instruments are costing dealers more now, so unless their stock is from before June 1st, their profits are dependent on selling at the current pricing.

    It’s a lot of mandolin for the price, and having played a variety of flattops, I’d have to say they’ve really produced a fine instrument. As for videos, TME has one left. Maybe we will see a video soon. Fit and finish is A+++
    Good Advice: Play before you pay, and know your product and your market.

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  8. #56
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    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    The tone in the video is awesome! Way more rich and fuller than I expected.

  9. #57
    Registered User William Smith's Avatar
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    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    Just look at evilbay right now for the vintage equivalent, need I say more besides aged wood with the tone for way less than half thier price and resale value/collectability in the future!

  10. #58

    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    About five or six years ago, there was a guy down in Florida selling vintage Kalamazoo guitars for over $3k, which I thought was insane. I just took a quick look on Reverb, and there’s a few at $2k which have been there for a while, but most are well below that amount. The market seems to have fizzled on them.
    There are a few Kalamazoo mandolins on Reverb, and I think two on eBay (one is pretty rough looking). I think they’d be great if you could do the repairs yourself, but paying someone several hundred dollars to get one in playing shape doesn’t make sense, as it might be tough to get your $$ back on resale. They are niche instruments and like a lot of things never quite gained status as collectibles. The collectibles market can be quite fickle.

    My point is, don’t count on anything increasing in value. We’ve seen the market bottom out on plenty of instruments. Remember the D’Angelico market in the early 2000’s. You could buy a Model A arch top guitar for $8k. I had a friend who lost his shirt on his collection during a rather acrimonious divorce.
    Last edited by Mandobar; Aug-03-2019 at 8:35pm.
    Good Advice: Play before you pay, and know your product and your market.

  11. #59

    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    I guess I missed it. Where is the video link, please?

    Thanks!

    AB


    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Foss View Post
    The tone in the video is awesome! Way more rich and fuller than I expected.

  12. #60

    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    First post has a link that takes you to the Waterloo mandolin webpage. Scroll down to the bottom for the video of Kim Warner playing one.
    Good Advice: Play before you pay, and know your product and your market.

  13. #61
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    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    Quote Originally Posted by ABmando View Post
    I guess I missed it. Where is the video link, please?
    From the website:

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  14. #62
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    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    Quote Originally Posted by William Smith View Post
    Just look at evilbay right now for the vintage equivalent, need I say more besides aged wood with the tone for way less than half thier price and resale value/collectability in the future!
    To answer your question, you needn't say more.

    Cracked bodies and headstocks, busted/non-functioning tuners, missing or destroyed cases, impossible action, major intonation issues, warped necks, defaced tops, missing or broken tailpieces. Utterly ridiculous prices. But that's just the start.

    What inspiring advice.

    Current Kalamazoo listings on eBay. Best rush over there right away and pick up a priceless bargain. Ready to play as is if you prefer.

    Only $509.99. Possible free set of "aged" strings?
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    $499.00, pricey, but comes with major issues and questionable repairs.
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    $300. Definitely the choice of the lot. How 'bout that case?
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    $500. 13" side crack that approaches neck. Missing nut and tailpiece cover. 5" crack in back, sunken top. Tuners not functioning.
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    $1,007.96. Comes with a massive amateur installed screw in the base of the neck sure to inspire confidence.
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    For only $599...
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  15. #63

    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    Versus this

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    Ready to play with mojo of its own.
    Good Advice: Play before you pay, and know your product and your market.

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  17. #64
    Registered User Roger Adams's Avatar
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    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    Looks and sounds great in the video! Given the Collings build quality, and a HSC, I would say the WL is an excellent value. I will be lookin for an opportunity to play one.
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  18. #65
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    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    Hey mandobar, can you post a video or some soundclips?
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  20. #66
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    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    A Kalamazoo flat-top came into my shop a few years back. Although it was in pretty good shape and hadn't been butchered by a shade-tree fix-it man, it had a couple of cracks, a loose brace, and needed a set of frets and a set-up to make it play well. That's around $450 to $500 worth of work. And a new set of tuners wouldn't have hurt anything, though the customer preferred to wrestle with the old, loose, cantankerous ones instead.

    Let's see-- if you could find that mandolin for perhaps $800 in its unrepaired state, add the $450 in necessary repairs and another $100 to purchase and install a decent set of tuners, the cost of the instrument would now be $1350.

    All of a sudden, the brand new mandolin by a quality maker, set up, ready to go, needing nothing, starts to look a lot more attractive at $1750. And I understand that Collings is quite good at honoring their warranties.

    And the Waterloo comes with a good hard case.

    But Mike, you might be depriving me of some work.

    But more likely, you'll be depriving me of the distress or the wrath of the poor, unsuspecting customer when I give them a repair estimate. That's ok, I'd rather eat dirt than see the look on those customers' faces.

    And then they might take the mandolin down the street to the shade-tree guy, and then there will be one more butchered old mandolin floating around that won't be worth fixing.

    For those who are agonizing over Collings' prices, wait a couple of years. There will be some used ones on the market. Or you can buy a Northfield Calhoun.
    Last edited by rcc56; Aug-04-2019 at 1:44pm.

  21. #67

    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    I could build one on my own but it may take 10 years and not as good. Collings manufacturing is superb. Why not support them! (And I have no financial interest in Collings whatsoever - just as a consumer - it is great that they are in business.)

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandobar View Post
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    Ready to play with mojo of its own.

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  23. #68
    Registered User bruce.b's Avatar
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    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    For me it’s an easy decision, I’d buy the Waterloo. I’d love to hear more videos of it. The other flat top I’d love to hear is the Sawchyn Hobo. I can’t find anything online. The Sawchyn Beavertail is a great sounding and playing flat top. the Hobo is described as having a darker, deeper, warmer, and slightly lo-fi tone.

    http://www.folkwaymusic.com/new-inst...hyn-hobo-0418/

  24. #69
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    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    I just looked at Reverb and spotted two old KM-11 flat-tops for $550 and $631.99 [I don't know why anyone would choose $632 minus a penny for a price . . .??]. The ~ $632 looks like it was barely played. But it's in Switzerland . . .

    With some luck, you might be able to put one of these into playable condition for less than $1000 total, including the cost of the instrument, shipping, and the price of a good case. You might get real lucky, and just put on a fresh set of strings and go. It's a gamble, though.

    These two do look to be in much better shape than most I see. But that's not a recommendation-- I have not seen either mandolin, nor do I have any financial interest . . .
    and the problem is, you never know what they're going to need until you get them in your hands.

    I do really like the look of the Swiss mandolin, but I've taken the pledge . . .

  25. #70
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    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    With modern materials, the quality of wood you can get nowadays, and modern methods there is no reason why you can't build a much better sounding mandolin than a vintage Kalamazoo. I have made and sold around 30. They are sort of similar, but not a copy.
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  27. #71

    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    As I mentioned before, I think the Waterloo mandolin looks very nice.

    One thing I learned is, you can't make a "new" buyer into a "vintage" buyer or vice versa. Separate markets with separate fans. When I worked in a vintage guitar shop in a busy downtown area years ago, we had our customers, but it was never really busy. Of course, we did mail order, as did most of the vintage shops, advertising in Vintage Guitar magazine. (I'm referring to those glorious days before eBay and the internet.......)

    This was also at a time when two brands were just getting started -- Taylor and PRS. In a clever move, both brands decided to market themselves to the vintage audience and advertise accordingly. In addition to vintage guitars, our shop decided to carry Taylor and PRS...........well, the shop suddenly became busy with new customers interested in those brands, including a lot of stockbrokers, lawyers, accountants, etc. who worked downtown and had previously walked past our shop daily, having no interest in vintage guitars.

    Anyway, it became clear to me that we were dealing with two separate sets of buyers with almost no crossover, for whatever reason....

  28. #72
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    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandobar View Post
    Ready to play with mojo of its own.
    How does the neck profile compare to a typical Collings MT?
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  29. #73

    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    Itís nothing like the Collings. Remember, itís a recreation of the Kalamazoo. Very rounded and heftier.

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  31. #74
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    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandobar View Post
    It’s nothing like the Collings. Remember, it’s a recreation of the Kalamazoo. Very rounded and heftier.
    I remember. I was just hoping, as with the radiused fretboard and adjustable truss rod, that they chose modern playability over historical accuracy.
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  32. #75

    Default Re: Waterloo Mandolin Released

    They may dial it back, as they did with the guitar models, but right now I’d say it’s a shade heftier than their MTO necks, which is a wide round profile. If you are looking for something more like an MT neck, this isn’t it. However, like some other folks, I believe the neck girth does add to the tonal qualities of the instrument.

    I could see Rich DelGrosso playing one of these, or Darrell Scott.
    Good Advice: Play before you pay, and know your product and your market.

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