Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 27

Thread: Early Blues Mandolin

  1. #1
    Registered User misterstormalong's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    South-East England
    Posts
    91

    Default Early Blues Mandolin

    Could anyone point me to a technical description (online/books) of how the mandolin was actually used in early Blues?

    Yes, I could just listen to recordings, but I'd appreciate an introductory shortcut.
    Hora Concert Irish Bouzouki
    Eastman MD504 Mandolin
    Crane Duet Concertina
    Gretsch Jim Dandy parlour guitar
    Gold Tone AC-4 Tenor Banjo
    http://justanechoonthewind.blogspot.com/

  2. #2
    Martin Stillion mrmando's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    13,086

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    Two words: Rich DelGrosso.
    Emando.com: More than you wanted to know about electric mandolins.

    Notorious: My Celtic CD--listen & buy!

    Lyon & Healy • Wood • Thormahlen • Andersen • Bacorn • Yanuziello • Fender • National • Gibson • Franke • Fuchs • Aceto • Three Hungry Pit Bulls

  3. #3
    Registered User Scotter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    San Diego, CA
    Posts
    166

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by mrmando View Post
    Two words: Rich DelGrosso.
    Two words: Yank Rachell

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by misterstormalong View Post
    Could anyone point me to a technical description (online/books) of how the mandolin was actually used in early Blues?

    Yes, I could just listen to recordings, but I'd appreciate an introductory shortcut.
    Steve James has a couple of video instructionals on blues mandolin styles over at Homespun.
    Play that which you feel is groovy, get down with your bad self, and shake your money maker if it makes sense for you to do so.

  4. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Scotter For This Useful Post:


  5. #4
    Registered User Ranald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Ottawa, Canada
    Posts
    1,715

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    The above resources (James & delGrosso are very good), though Joe Carr's School of Mandolin Blues is a good resource for beginners, with more emphasis on rhythm and scales -- the basics -- than the others.
    Robert Johnson's mother, describing blues musicians:
    "I never did have no trouble with him until he got big enough to be round with bigger boys and off from home. Then he used to follow all these harp blowers, mandoleen (sic) and guitar players."
    Lomax, Alan, The Land where The Blues Began, NY: Pantheon, 1993, p.14.

  6. The following members say thank you to Ranald for this post:


  7. #5
    Registered User misterstormalong's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    South-East England
    Posts
    91

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    Thanks for the responses. The Steve James material looks very helpful and I've ordered the Joe Carr book despite the strangely mixed reviews.

    I'm collecting instructional material, but I'm particularly looking for descriptive data like this https://www.earlyblues.com/Essay%20-...20Shoulder.htm

    Since yesterday I found this YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/user/67rene/videos with live recordings of Yank Rachell. Having video (rather than just audio) makes everything much clearer and has provided exactly what I'm looking for.
    Hora Concert Irish Bouzouki
    Eastman MD504 Mandolin
    Crane Duet Concertina
    Gretsch Jim Dandy parlour guitar
    Gold Tone AC-4 Tenor Banjo
    http://justanechoonthewind.blogspot.com/

  8. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to misterstormalong For This Useful Post:


  9. #6
    Registered User Bob Buckingham's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Greer, SC
    Posts
    897

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    The Steve James is good stuff, the Rich DelGrosso is better, but the best stuff is what you will hear on the old recordings. Johnny Young is a personal favorite to add to the list. Lots of the best old recordings may be available for download don't know is still in print. If you know blues scales it is not that hard to figure out what these guys are doing, most of the time.

  10. #7
    Registered User Ranald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Ottawa, Canada
    Posts
    1,715

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    If it's actual history, rather than technique you're after, I have to quote "mrmando" (post #2 above): "Two words: Rich DelGrosso" -- not that you won't learn plenty of technique from him as well. Also read Blues Mandolin Man: The Life and Music of Yank Rachell by Richard Congress. I hope I didn't steer you in the wrong direction with the Carr book. You will learn plenty from it though. For videos of blues mandolin playing, see my 48 entires under "Jazz, Swing, Blues..." entitled "Blues, Stomps, & Rags." See also postings by others in the Blues Mando social group: https://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/group.php?groupid=99
    Robert Johnson's mother, describing blues musicians:
    "I never did have no trouble with him until he got big enough to be round with bigger boys and off from home. Then he used to follow all these harp blowers, mandoleen (sic) and guitar players."
    Lomax, Alan, The Land where The Blues Began, NY: Pantheon, 1993, p.14.

  11. The following members say thank you to Ranald for this post:


  12. #8
    Registered User misterstormalong's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    South-East England
    Posts
    91

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    I was after 'historical technique' rather than technique or history per se, but it's all of course of interest.

    Your "Blues, Stomps, & Rags" series is inspirational.

  13. The following members say thank you to misterstormalong for this post:

    Ranald 

  14. #9
    Registered User Joey Anchors's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Austin, TX
    Posts
    1,008

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by misterstormalong View Post
    I was after 'historical technique' rather than technique or history per se, but it's all of course of interest.

    Your "Blues, Stomps, & Rags" series is inspirational.
    What type/style of blues are you aiming for? Country blues, city blues..?
    Waterloo WL-M

    Blues Mando Social Group - member

  15. #10
    Registered User misterstormalong's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    South-East England
    Posts
    91

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    I'm looking at the options.

    I play mandolin in an Oldtime/crossover stringband but occasionally have to do something solo. I was looking at Blues guitar but I think it would take too long to develop.

    Blues mandolin was a more obvious choice as it would be based on what I can do already and feed back into it. On the other hand, it seems to benefit from guitar accompaniment, so maybe it's not quite solo enough...

  16. The following members say thank you to misterstormalong for this post:


  17. #11
    Registered User Ranald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Ottawa, Canada
    Posts
    1,715

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by misterstormalong View Post
    Blues mandolin was a more obvious choice as it would be based on what I can do already and feed back into it. On the other hand, it seems to benefit from guitar accompaniment, so maybe it's not quite solo enough...
    On the other hand:



    If link doesn't work, search YouTube for "Minglewood Blues/ Ken Whiteley (feat. Julia Naverson".

    (Still, I get your point, Ken does have a washtub bass accompanist, I think it would be hard to do a whole show on blues mandolin without a fellow musician, though you could pull off a ten-minute set at an open mike.)
    Robert Johnson's mother, describing blues musicians:
    "I never did have no trouble with him until he got big enough to be round with bigger boys and off from home. Then he used to follow all these harp blowers, mandoleen (sic) and guitar players."
    Lomax, Alan, The Land where The Blues Began, NY: Pantheon, 1993, p.14.

  18. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Ranald For This Useful Post:


  19. #12
    Registered User Simon DS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Peace and Love
    Posts
    2,403

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by Ranald View Post
    On the other hand:

    If link doesn't work, search YouTube for "Minglewood Blues/ Ken Whiteley (feat. Julia Naverson".

    (Still, I get your point, Ken does have a washtub bass accompanist, I think it would be hard to do a whole show on blues mandolin without a fellow musician, though you could pull off a ten-minute set at an open mike.)
    -now that performance is just plain inspiring!
    Last edited by Simon DS; Jul-21-2019 at 10:39am.

  20. The following members say thank you to Simon DS for this post:


  21. #13
    Registered User misterstormalong's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    South-East England
    Posts
    91

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    People tell me the mandolin is too thin and/or harsh on its own unless in the hands of a virtuoso. Ken Whitely’s performance is certainly interesting, energetic and very full.

    Although I’ve only recently thought about attempting some Blues mandolin myself, I’ve long admired Ry Cooder’s ‘Goin' To Brownsville’.
    Hora Concert Irish Bouzouki
    Eastman MD504 Mandolin
    Crane Duet Concertina
    Gretsch Jim Dandy parlour guitar
    Gold Tone AC-4 Tenor Banjo
    http://justanechoonthewind.blogspot.com/

  22. The following members say thank you to misterstormalong for this post:

    Ranald 

  23. #14
    Registered User mandolinstew's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Warwick,New York
    Posts
    636

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    How did Ry play mandoleen without a pick?

  24. #15
    Registered User mandolinstew's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Warwick,New York
    Posts
    636

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by mandolinstew View Post
    How did Ry play mandoleen without a pick?
    Just watched Ry on YouTube Going to Brownsville.He is using a pick.

  25. #16
    Oval holes are cool David Lewis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    1,461

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    I recommend lessons by Mike Compton - he is an encyclopaedia of all American styles. I can play decent blues thanks to him. (Rich Del Grosso and Joe Carr are also great.) But Mike's lessons can be sourced through here.
    JBovier ELS; Epiphone MM-50 VN; Epiphone MM-40L; Gretsch New Yorker G9310; Washburn M1SDLB;

    Fender Nashville Deluxe Telecaster; Squier Modified Vintage Cabronita Telecaster; Gretsch 5420T; Fender Tim Armstrong Hellcat: Washburn Banjo B9; Ibanez RB 5string; Ibanez RB 4 string bass

    Pedalboard for ELS: Morley Cry baby Miniwah - Tuner - EHX Soul Food Overdrive - EHX Memory Toy analog Delay
    Fender Blues Jr Tweed; Fender Greta;

  26. #17
    Registered User misterstormalong's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    South-East England
    Posts
    91

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    Guy Tortora plays mando without a pick but he is a very strong guitar player. https://youtu.be/Xw9lZCimlOA

  27. #18
    Registered User misterstormalong's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    South-East England
    Posts
    91

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by David Lewis View Post
    I recommend lessons by Mike Compton - he is an encyclopaedia of all American styles. I can play decent blues thanks to him. (Rich Del Grosso and Joe Carr are also great.) But Mike's lessons can be sourced through here.
    Thanks for the suggestion. I've started on the Steve James DVD and some other bits and pieces.

  28. The following members say thank you to misterstormalong for this post:


  29. #19
    Fatally Flawed Bill Kammerzell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Annapolis, MD
    Posts
    1,663

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    I just took a Blues Mandolin course from Steve James at 2019 Swannanoa, Mandolin and Banjo week. He was very good and a real encyclopedia of the early blues mandolin players. Another guy I can think of, is Johnny Young. He played a lot of stuff with Otis Spann, Big Walter Horton, Little Walter Jacobs, etc. I've got a CD by him where he does a lot of Mandolin stuff. Of course as mentioned there is Yank Rachell and his Harmony Batwing. I also have a book/CD by Rich Del Grosso.
    Ray Dearstone #009 D1A (1999)
    Skip Kelley #063 Offset Two Point (2017)
    Arches #9 A Style (2005)
    Bourgeois M5A (2022)
    Hohner and Seydel Harmonicas (various keys)

    "Heck, Jimmy Martin don't even believe in Santy Claus!"

  30. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Bill Kammerzell For This Useful Post:


  31. #20
    Registered User Scotter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    San Diego, CA
    Posts
    166

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by willkamm View Post
    Another guy I can think of, is Johnny Young.
    Howard Armstrong too!
    Play that which you feel is groovy, get down with your bad self, and shake your money maker if it makes sense for you to do so.

  32. #21
    Oval holes are cool David Lewis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    1,461

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    For most Australians of a certain age, Johnny Young conjures up 'Young Talent Time', which was a show which featured child performers - some of whom went on to significant careers here and overseas (Dannii Minogue, Kylie's sister, springs to mind). Australian talent shows - about as far from the blues as you can get.

    But Young the mandolinist is superb blues.
    JBovier ELS; Epiphone MM-50 VN; Epiphone MM-40L; Gretsch New Yorker G9310; Washburn M1SDLB;

    Fender Nashville Deluxe Telecaster; Squier Modified Vintage Cabronita Telecaster; Gretsch 5420T; Fender Tim Armstrong Hellcat: Washburn Banjo B9; Ibanez RB 5string; Ibanez RB 4 string bass

    Pedalboard for ELS: Morley Cry baby Miniwah - Tuner - EHX Soul Food Overdrive - EHX Memory Toy analog Delay
    Fender Blues Jr Tweed; Fender Greta;

  33. #22
    Registered User Ranald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Ottawa, Canada
    Posts
    1,715

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by willkamm View Post
    I just took a Blues Mandolin course from Steve James at 2019 Swannanoa, Mandolin and Banjo week. He was very good and a real encyclopedia of the early blues mandolin players. Another guy I can think of, is Johnny Young. He played a lot of stuff with Otis Spann, Big Walter Horton, Little Walter Jacobs, etc. I've got a CD by him where he does a lot of Mandolin stuff. Of course as mentioned there is Yank Rachell and his Harmony Batwing. I also have a book/CD by Rich Del Grosso.
    Which CD is that, willkamm?
    Robert Johnson's mother, describing blues musicians:
    "I never did have no trouble with him until he got big enough to be round with bigger boys and off from home. Then he used to follow all these harp blowers, mandoleen (sic) and guitar players."
    Lomax, Alan, The Land where The Blues Began, NY: Pantheon, 1993, p.14.

  34. #23
    Registered User Ranald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Ottawa, Canada
    Posts
    1,715

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by Ranald View Post
    Which CD is that, willkamm?
    I mean which Steve James CD?
    Robert Johnson's mother, describing blues musicians:
    "I never did have no trouble with him until he got big enough to be round with bigger boys and off from home. Then he used to follow all these harp blowers, mandoleen (sic) and guitar players."
    Lomax, Alan, The Land where The Blues Began, NY: Pantheon, 1993, p.14.

  35. #24
    Fatally Flawed Bill Kammerzell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Annapolis, MD
    Posts
    1,663

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by Ranald View Post
    I mean which Steve James CD?
    Not by Steve James. The CD is by Johnny Young. Called Johnny Young and friends.
    Ray Dearstone #009 D1A (1999)
    Skip Kelley #063 Offset Two Point (2017)
    Arches #9 A Style (2005)
    Bourgeois M5A (2022)
    Hohner and Seydel Harmonicas (various keys)

    "Heck, Jimmy Martin don't even believe in Santy Claus!"

  36. #25
    Registered User stevo58's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Good old Germany
    Posts
    86

    Default Re: Early Blues Mandolin

    Well, I'm a new player, and thanks to this thread, I picked up some of the stuff mentioned here. I am working through the Steve James videos, and it's just what the doctor ordered. When he presents a tune I don't know, I go out and find the original, listen, work out the differences; and that leads me somewhere else ... blues suits me better than other forms, I'm having fun with it, I'm having fun with my new instrument, and I hope to actually inflict myself on stage on live humans soon. Thanks guys.

    Steven
    Silverangel Econo A #438 (“Swazi”)
    Schnoor Silver Bell Style 5 Tenor
    Schnoor 5-string open back
    Martin OM-21
    1950 Epiphone Devon
    Emmons GS-10
    More electrics than you can shake a stick at. I have to sell this stuff.

  37. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to stevo58 For This Useful Post:


Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •