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Thread: Tonedexter firmware question...

  1. #1
    Registered Muser dang's Avatar
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    Default Tonedexter firmware question...

    Doing some research, the Tonedexter says it has different firmware for higher pitched instruments:

    ToneDexter Firmware Versions
    ToneDexter comes with (GEN) firmware (software that runs and resides in ToneDexter) optimized for Guitar, Dobro, Viola, Cel- lo, Bouzouki, Mandola, Mandocello, Baritone Guitar. Separate versions of software are available for (HGH) higher pitched in- struments like Violin, Mandolin, Banjo and Ukulele, and (BAS), a version optimized for Upright Bass.

    Anyone update their device before making wave maps?

    Anyone know what the differences are? EQ settings?

    Just wondering...
    Dan
    I should be pickin' rather than postin'

  2. #2
    Registered User Doug Brock's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tonedexter firmware question...

    I ran across this article yesterday (This second page of the article dealt with touring use by some well-known musicians, so I saved it).
    https://www.prosoundweb.com/channels...nt-preampdi/2/


    Last section answers your question:
    "Firmware & Other Details"

    "The latest firmware upgrades for the ToneDexter preamp/DI offer three different versions: for guitar and similarly pitched instruments; acoustic and upright basses; and treble instruments such as mandolin, violin, or ukulele. The versions provide different frequency ranges for the notch filter and equalizer, and a longer sampling for the bass WaveMap. For example, the bass notch filter ranges between 37 and 165 Hz.

    "The same unit can be updated with any of these versions, but will only hold one at a time. So a sound company could keep ToneDexter systems in their touring inventory, customize them before the tour for the basic instrument type, and then train them to the particular instruments during pre-production or before the gig while on the road.

    "All in all, from my experience with the ToneDexter acoustic instrument preamp/DI and from the touring professionals who have used it in concert, the system is a potential game-changer for the live reproduction of acoustic stringed instruments. The sound can be customized to the specific qualities of the instrument and pickup system, yielding the characteristics of a miked acoustic with the flexibility and greater SPL before feedback of a pickup."
    Doug Brock
    Silverangel Econo A (in work at Ken's shop); Eastman MD315, MD505
    Pisgah Wonder, Martin HD28, Martin D18GE, CA Guitars Bluegrass Performer

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  4. #3
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    Default Re: Tonedexter firmware question...

    I bought mine mainly for mandolin, so I uploaded the treble firmware before recording any wave maps. Since then, I have also recorded some guitar maps and used it without changing firmware and it worked fine. I know you can keep each firmware version and wave maps on separate sd cards if you wanted to switch between them, although that would be pretty annoying to do in a live performance situation if you were switching between mandolin and guitar.

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  6. #4
    Mandolin user MontanaMatt's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tonedexter firmware question...

    My understanding is that the firmware only affects things during the image capture...once stored the firmware is not affecting images in the future. So you can switch between instruments, with their specific image, regardless of current firmware.
    2007 Weber Custom Elite "old wood"
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  7. #5
    Registered User Doug Brock's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tonedexter firmware question...

    Quote Originally Posted by MontanaMatt View Post
    My understanding is that the firmware only affects things during the image capture...once stored the firmware is not affecting images in the future. So you can switch between instruments, with their specific image, regardless of current firmware.
    According to the article I linked to above, the firmware also affects the frequency ranges for the notch filter and equalizer.
    Doug Brock
    Silverangel Econo A (in work at Ken's shop); Eastman MD315, MD505
    Pisgah Wonder, Martin HD28, Martin D18GE, CA Guitars Bluegrass Performer

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  9. #6

    Default Re: Tonedexter firmware question...

    Starting with v1.3 firmware supports use of guitar and mandolin eq settings without needing to reload the firmware:

    High (HGH) version code now designed for multi-instrumentalists. High bank slots 12-22 use EQ and notch params tailored for mandolin, violin, banjo, etc: low shelf starts at 250Hz, high shelf at 2KHz, notch range is 124 (B2) to 466 (A#4). Low bank slots 1-11 function the same a general (GEN) code: low shelf starts at 125Hz, high shelf at 2KHz, notch range is 73 (D2) to 392 (G4).

    https://audiosprockets.com/support/firmware/

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  11. #7
    Registered User Doug Brock's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tonedexter firmware question...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Martin View Post
    Starting with v1.3 firmware supports use of guitar and mandolin eq settings without needing to reload the firmware:

    High (HGH) version code now designed for multi-instrumentalists. High bank slots 12-22 use EQ and notch params tailored for mandolin, violin, banjo, etc: low shelf starts at 250Hz, high shelf at 2KHz, notch range is 124 (B2) to 466 (A#4). Low bank slots 1-11 function the same a general (GEN) code: low shelf starts at 125Hz, high shelf at 2KHz, notch range is 73 (D2) to 392 (G4).

    https://audiosprockets.com/support/firmware/
    Nice!
    Doug Brock
    Silverangel Econo A (in work at Ken's shop); Eastman MD315, MD505
    Pisgah Wonder, Martin HD28, Martin D18GE, CA Guitars Bluegrass Performer

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    Default Re: Tonedexter firmware question...

    I have found 250 hz to be the perfect point for mandolin to drop off lows. I have talked to several builders of preamps over many years, to see if they would incorporated this, no one was interested. Mandolin ??????. I am glad to see someone finally figured this out for mandolin.
    THE WORLD IS A BETTER PLACE JUST FOR YOUR SMILE!

  13. #9
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    Default Re: Tonedexter firmware question...

    I use the GEN firmware on guitars, bouzouki, dobro, banjo, Weissenborn and mandolin. Still working on my wave maps always trying to improve. The best I've come up so far are for F 5 -style mandolin, pretty close to my Neumann KM84 mic.
    mandolin: Collings MF5
    pickup: K&K
    microphone used for training: Neumann KM 183 (omni) pointing at right hand, 6" out.

  14. #10
    Registered Muser dang's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tonedexter firmware question...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Martin View Post
    Starting with v1.3 firmware supports use of guitar and mandolin eq settings without needing to reload the firmware:

    High (HGH) version code now designed for multi-instrumentalists. High bank slots 12-22 use EQ and notch params tailored for mandolin, violin, banjo, etc: low shelf starts at 250Hz, high shelf at 2KHz, notch range is 124 (B2) to 466 (A#4). Low bank slots 1-11 function the same a general (GEN) code: low shelf starts at 125Hz, high shelf at 2KHz, notch range is 73 (D2) to 392 (G4).

    https://audiosprockets.com/support/firmware/
    Doesn’t that specifically refer to the HGH setting?
    I should be pickin' rather than postin'

  15. #11

    Default Re: Tonedexter firmware question...

    Quote Originally Posted by dang View Post
    Doesn’t that specifically refer to the HGH setting?
    Yes, AFAIK. I think you would set up your guitar WaveMaps using the GEN firmware, then your mandolin WaveMaps using the HGH.

    I guess this also means you really have only 11 slots for the HGH maps. The manual doesn’t make this distinction and I only found that info yesterday. So far I've only used slots 1-11, so I need to try out 12-22 and hear what the differences are. I'm not clear if this affects things when you are training.

  16. #12
    Registered Muser dang's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tonedexter firmware question...

    “Firmware Loading Instructions via SD Card
    Old or new versions or alternate versions like BAS and HGH may be loaded at your discretion. Any existing WaveMaps will be pre- served. Due to format differences, BAS firmware WaveMaps are not visible to GEN and HGH firmware, and vice versa. Each set of 22 WaveMaps exists in a distinct and separate part of memory.”

    https://audiosprockets.com/wp-conten...uide_v14_0.pdf

    I guess the wavemaps you make in HGH can only be seen when in that firmware

    And (as said above) apparently the HGH is really only wavemaps 12-22 and wavemaps 1-11 act just like GEN

    Not sure I would really need more then 11 wavemaps anyway...

    And since wavemap 22 is for “studio use” (feedback suppression is off) it’s only really 10 wavemaps of HGH

    It does make sense for the multi instrumentalist, and I guess I would have to train an octave mandolin and tenor guitar in the 1-11 wavemap spots

    Super cool device, but lots of details to figure out
    I should be pickin' rather than postin'

  17. #13

    Default Re: Tonedexter firmware question...

    I can see why this is a bit confusing.

    The GEN or HGH firmware will alter the EQ ranges accordingly when playing back. WaveMap creation is exactly the same in both cases. BAS is a little different in that it resides in its own separate memory space inside the unit. So bass WaveMaps are special and can only be created or played back when running the BAS firmware version.

    You can change back and forth from one BAS to GEN/HGH using the SD card, and it will not alter any WaveMaps that are already stored.
    James May
    Audio Sprockets
    creator of ToneDexter

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  19. #14

    Default Re: Tonedexter firmware question...

    Hi James, just so I am clear, are the following correct?

    You can record a mandolin using GEN and it will sound the same when you switch over to HGH, and vice versa (if eq is set to flat)?

    You should store HGH instruments (mandolin, fiddle, banjo etc) in slots 11-21 to use HGH-optimized eq.

    ——-

    And since you’re here, thank you for creating the ToneDexter, it has changed my life. I’m more confident in my stage sound and find it easier to play more dynamically, and set-up and sound check time are cut in half. Just a great sounding, easy to use device. Not that you are asking, but here’s a wishlist for TD 2.0:
    Modern display/UI
    Tuner works well but the display could be more intuitive
    Ability to name WaveMap slots (eg “Dark Mandolin” or “Guitar SM 81”)
    Recallable eq settings
    Add a second instrument input
    Ability to change wavemaps via footswitch
    Reverb and delay fx
    USB connection to a PC
    Normalize output levels between wavemaps

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