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Thread: Worm Over Robson F style tuners

  1. #1
    Moderator MikeEdgerton's Avatar
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    Default Worm Over Robson F style tuners

    I just had my annual exchange with Stewmac looking for worm over F style Waverly tuners like the ones Sam Bush has on his mandolin. They again told me they don't make them.

    The good news is that UK tuner manufacturer Robson appears to be making a high quality worm over set now. Their page is here. These have been discussed in the past.

    At one point I was apparently the only person in the world that didn't know about them. Here is every thread on the Cafe that mentions them.

    The price is 367.71 USD using today's exchange rates.

    Can anyone with better eyes than mine tell if these are going to turn the right way?

    I wish they had pictures of the color combinations. I could do without the black screws and worm gears but they look pretty good.
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    "It's comparable to playing a cheese slicer."
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    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them"
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  2. #2
    Registered User sblock's Avatar
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    Default Re: Worm Over Robson F style tuners

    Not sure what you mean by "right way," -- there IS no "right way" -- but if you rotate a tuner button on the bass side counter-clockwise (looking down the shaft at the button), it will rotate the tuner shaft clockwise (looking at the headstock from the FRONT), which will tighten the (G or D) bass-side string. And the opposite holds for the treble-side A and E strings.

  3. #3
    Moderator MikeEdgerton's Avatar
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    Default Re: Worm Over Robson F style tuners

    Quote Originally Posted by sblock View Post
    Not sure what you mean by "right way," -- there IS no "right way" -- but if you rotate a tuner button on the bass side counter-clockwise (looking down the shaft at the button), it will rotate the tuner shaft clockwise (looking at the headstock from the FRONT), which will tighten the (G or D) bass-side string. And vice versa for the A and E strings.
    Actually you're wrong, there is a right way and a wrong way. Just because they turn the wrong way and people accept it doesn't make it right. The late Paul Hostetter's page on the subject is an excellent resource.

    http://www.lutherie.net/mandolin.gear.direction.html

    I just cant tell from the picture if the worms are cut correctly. I'll be able to see it at home on the large monitor tonight.

    I just blew the image up on my work screen and it appears the worm is cut correctly for worm over.
    "It's comparable to playing a cheese slicer."
    --M. Stillion

    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them"
    --J. Garber

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    Default Re: Worm Over Robson F style tuners

    Kind of difficult to tell even on a larger screen but looking at the treble side it appears to me that the worms are cut /////, and that a clockwise turn of the button results in a clockwise turn of the post.

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  6. #5
    Moderator MikeEdgerton's Avatar
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    Default Re: Worm Over Robson F style tuners

    Quote Originally Posted by WaxwellHaus View Post
    Kind of difficult to tell even on a larger screen but looking at the treble side it appears to me that the worms are cut /////, and that a clockwise turn of the button results in a clockwise turn of the post.
    Thanks. That's what I think I'm seeing as well.
    "It's comparable to playing a cheese slicer."
    --M. Stillion

    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them"
    --J. Garber

  7. #6
    Registered User sblock's Avatar
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    Default Re: Worm Over Robson F style tuners

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeEdgerton View Post
    Actually you're wrong, there is a right way and a wrong way. Just because they turn the wrong way and people accept it doesn't make it right. The late Paul Hostetter's page on the subject is an excellent resource.

    http://www.lutherie.net/mandolin.gear.direction.html

    I just cant tell from the picture if the worms are cut correctly. I'll be able to see it at home on the large monitor tonight.

    I just blew the image up on my work screen and it appears the worm is cut correctly for worm over.
    Yes, I am aware of the long (tawdry) history of tuner directions for mandolins, and also worm gear over/gear under. It is certainly appropriate to refer to a "conventional way" and an "unconventional way," based on the conventions (standards) that are adopted at the time by most manufacturers. In addition, it seems pretty intuitive to me that you'd prefer to rotate a bass tuner counterclockwise to tighten the string, and not in the opposite direction. Furthermore, many of us are quite used to that particular convention, based on our prior experience with other stringed instruments, especially guitars. Finally, it's true that Gibson, for various unknown reasons, went against the usual conventions with their F5 tuners for a number of years, sowing confusion in the market that persists to this day!

    I freely concede all that. But none of the foregoing makes one convention "right" and the other "wrong." There is nothing intrinsically right or (wrong) about tuner gear direction! Makers are free to adopt whatever standard they choose. We use 110V/60Hz for most home electricity in the US, and measure distances in inches. Europeans use 220V/50Hz and centimeters. These are conventional standards, nothing more. There is nothing intrinsically "right" or "wrong" about using either standard. The mess arises when some folks use one standard, but others use a different standard. Then, you get incompatibilities.

    I wish we used the metric system here in the U.S. I also wish that all geared tuners followed the same directional convention, too. But I wish this not because one system is "right" and the other is "wrong." I wish that we were all on the same page and didn't have to cope with all these durned incompatibilities!

  8. #7
    Moderator MikeEdgerton's Avatar
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    Default Re: Worm Over Robson F style tuners

    Thanks for freely conceding that.
    "It's comparable to playing a cheese slicer."
    --M. Stillion

    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them"
    --J. Garber

  9. #8
    Moderator MikeEdgerton's Avatar
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    Default Re: Worm Over Robson F style tuners

    On my larger screen at home they are very apparently cut /////. Another option for those seeking worm over tuners for their F style mandolins.
    "It's comparable to playing a cheese slicer."
    --M. Stillion

    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them"
    --J. Garber

  10. #9
    harvester of clams Bill McCall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Worm Over Robson F style tuners

    It speaks to why standards are so widely accepted, there's so many to choose from.
    Not all the clams are at the beach

    Arrow Manouche
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    Default Re: Worm Over Robson F style tuners

    Keith Robson made me a set of A style, worm over, tuners for my Clark GBOM a few years ago and they certainly turn the right way so I’ve no reason to believe that his F style ones will be any different.

  12. #11
    Moderator MikeEdgerton's Avatar
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    Default Re: Worm Over Robson F style tuners

    Grover makes A style worm over tuners that turn the right direction but their F style worm over model doesn't. I'm just happy to see another quality manufacturer doing it right.
    "It's comparable to playing a cheese slicer."
    --M. Stillion

    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them"
    --J. Garber

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