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Thread: Intonation

  1. #1

    Default Intonation

    I have noticed a slight intonation issue with my mandolin. May be a set-up thing but I thought perhaps you folks would have some ideas. With the mandolin in tune, the G string at the 7th fret is slightly sharp, compared to the unison open D string. When I fret the D string at the 5th fret, the octive tone seems to be right on the money with the open G string. All other string-to-string comparisons with both the 7th fret/unison pair, and the 5th fret/octive pair seem spot on. Comparing 12th fret notes to harmonics, it seems the bridge placement is good.

    Any ideas what the problem may be? I'm wondering if the string slots on my bridge could be wearing or something.

    Rich

  2. #2
    Registered User William Smith's Avatar
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    Default Re: Intonation

    Well mandolins in a sense can be off, it doesn't take much! On the string/fret that's giving you problems check your nut and saddle slot for that string, if everything else is fine your fret placement on the board isn't the problem, I'd say saddle slot or a high spot on the next fret? Check that stuff but if its only a small note difference I wouldn't worry too much, is your saddle leaning forward any? What kind/brand model do you play? I've spent hours on trying to get one of my many mandolins just right-it can drive one really crazy getting them just right!

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Intonation

    I don't know that it matters that much, but I've switched from 12th fret harmonics to a fretted 12th fret note, on the principal that it will more closely reflect actual playing situations.
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    formerly Philphool Phil Goodson's Avatar
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    Default Re: Intonation

    Quote Originally Posted by onassis View Post
    I don't know that it matters that much, but I've switched from 12th fret harmonics to a fretted 12th fret note, on the principal that it will more closely reflect actual playing situations.
    I'm not sure what you mean by that. The 12th string harmonic will ALWAYS be an octave above the open string, regardless of how the mandolin is set up. (Although it won't be found at exactly the same spot if the bridge is out of position.)
    It's the fretted 12 fret note that must be compared to either the open string or the 12th fret harmonic to determine intonation. (Of course there are other nuances of intonation that can be observed by comparing other fretted notes.)
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    Registered User Tom Wright's Avatar
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    Default Re: Intonation

    To be sure, buy the inexpensive strobe-tuner app and check the fingerboard at each fret. I have found two issues can affect the low-fret intonation — high nut, and/ or too long a fingerboard between nut and first fret.

    If the strings are sitting pretty high above the frets the steep deflection needed to fret will mean strings play sharp even if they are good further up the neck.

    Another issue is the distance to the first fret is sometimes too long by a few thousandths.

    If the strobe tuner shows strings in tune in the higher frets but sharp in the first few, look to see if the error is higher on some strings than others. For example, if the D is sitting high, tuning it such that it plays in tune with the lower G string when fretted at fret 5 and G is sharp at fret 7, it is because the D is sharp at fret 5. So you tune the G up a bit to be in tune. Now it is sharp at fret 7.

    Or, if the first fret is too far, the problem is caused by both strings playing a little sharp in the low frets.

    If the distance is too far, all strings will be sharp in the low frets, by roughly equal amounts, declining or staying the same as you move up. If the nut is too high, the error may be more dependent on which string, and the error declines a little more quickly as you move up the neck (assuming good pitch at fret 12).

    With luck it is only strings sitting too high, but I have had to shorten the fingerboard on my instruments.
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  6. #6
    Rush Burkhardt Rush Burkhardt's Avatar
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    Default Re: Intonation

    It is said that mandolin players spend 50% of their time tuning and 50% of their time playing out of tune! Part of the lessons of experience include becoming "a little" calloused to the quirks! That said, Rob Meldrum's mandolin setup book, free for the asking, is invaluable!
    Rush
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  8. #7

    Default Re: Intonation

    It may be a long shot----but have you tried replacing your strings? I have found 2 issues regarding weird intonation (ie, not systematic or otherwise related to set-up).

    1.- Older strings just start to intonate funny. For me, this happens before they deaden enough to make me want to replace them.

    2.- I have very occasionally bought new strings that just plain had a faulty string-- this has only happened to me for wound strings, but it has happened enough that I can identify it. The first couple times it happened, I thought I was going nuts... I just couldn't get the thing to sound right! Finally, a friend clued me in that this could happen-- I changed out the strings and was back to my normal, completely mediocre, playing

  9. #8

    Default Re: Intonation

    I often find that on the NUT, the slots are not deep enough and the same usually applies to the bridge top. You juts have to get that right without taking the slots down too deep. If the D is correct on intonation then the frets are right so problem is 100% either nut r bridge or both, assuming your bridge top is compensated.

    Good luck

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