Killer Technique for Mandolin

[Tom M]

I have a copy of the book Killer Technique for Mandolin by Suzanna Barnes. Not exactly what I expected but seems to have some valuable if tedious exercises. Not that I am opposed to doing grunt work I am just being a bit stupid about the instructions. Maybe someone can help me out.

If anyone is familiar with her book can you explain page 4 to me?

Were these instructions in standard music notation I would be fine but I am having a hard time understanding her notations. If someone could decipher those markings for me I would be thankful.

For instance she has various numbers and steps that involve playing a root, a whole step, a whole step and a half step. (I get it: C D E F) Others involve root, half, half, whole (C C# D E)

Where I get lost is she throws in augmented 2nds. What would root, half, augmented 2nd, half look like? (I'm guessing it would be C C# E F)

How about root, augment 2nd, half, whole? (Would it be C D# E F#)?

Any help greatly appreciated.

So

[Mark Gunter]

Maybe my chart can help you decipher augmented/diminished intervals, Tom.

Augment means to raise (or sharp) a major or perfect interval one semitone.
Diminish means to lower (or flat) a minor or perfect interval one semitone.

I have no idea why that author would be mixing terminology like "root, half, augmented 2nd, half"

[Phil Goodson]

Mark,
I'm always confused about "diminished" terminology. Your chart is very helpful. I'm still confused about the Gb.

All of the other "diminished" notes seem to be a diatonic note of the scale that has been lowered from a higher note, but the Gb is the outlier. Is there a logical explanation for this? Or is there a definition of how to "diminish" a note, which covers all cases?

[Mark Gunter]

Phil, yes, the rule covers all cases. "To Diminish means to lower (or flat) a minor or perfect interval one semitone."

In the key of C example I use in the chart, note that Gb has no name in the center section. All the other notes have labels of either major, minor, or perfect. The middle note, in this case Gb, is indeed an outlier; it is neither major, minor nor perfect ... in ETT that note is either a diminished 5th (Gb) or an augmented 4th (F#).

Remember, the 4th and 5th intervals are perfect intervals, neither major nor minor ... "To Diminish means to lower (or flat) a minor or perfect interval one semitone."

Another way to grasp this concept: Since the 5th is a perfect interval (meaning it can be neither major nor minor), there is no way to call that Gb a "minor fifth" - so it is a "diminished 5th"

[Mark Gunter]

Back to Tom M: I don't have that book, but I have a sneaky suspicion that the section you're describing is very similar to Mike Marshall's "Finger Busters", only using a really complicated way to describe the exercises. The Homespun lessons, Mike Marshall's Mandolin Fundamentals For All Players, Vol. 1 & 2 might be easier to understand and implement; at any rate, I recommend those videos highly. Also, his exercise book called Finger Busters.

[Tom M]

Maybe my chart can help you decipher augmented/diminished intervals, Tom.

Augment means to raise (or sharp) a major or perfect interval one semitone.
Diminish means to lower (or flat) a minor or perfect interval one semitone.

I have no idea why that author would be mixing terminology like "root, half, augmented 2nd, half"

Thank you, Mark! Your chart is very helpful. To be fair to the author her illustrations look like the following with a dash representing a whole step, 2 dashes an augmented 2nd, the absence of a dash as a half step etc,

1-23-4
1--2-34
12--34

[Mark Gunter]

Ah. So that scheme would mean that two dashes would indicate an augmented second interval to the next note? That would be 1-1/2 steps ... whole + half step.

I'd find her notation confusing, myself. OTOH, I guess it would be easy enough to adjust to once you think of two dashes meaning 3 half steps ...

And BTW, these exercises are definitely reminiscent of Mike's Finger Busters.

[Mark Gunter]

Sorry about my many posts and edits ... it's below freezing here, and I'm reluctant to go in the shop. Guess I should prolly get off the internet and start practicing the mandolin.

[Phil Goodson]

Thanks Mark. It was the "minor or perfect" part of the rule that I was missing.

It might get confusing when defining a "half-diminished' chord and not able to say 'flat-5'.

[Mark Gunter]

Nothing wrong with saying flat 5 (b5) - a flat 5, or diminished 5th, is what makes that a diminished triad: 1-b3-b5

What people call a "half-dim" chord adds the dominant 7th: 1-b3-b5-b7
and what people call "fully dim" adds the diminished 7th: 1-b3-b5-bb7

Flat 5 is fine, it's a diminished fifth, but minor 5th is non-existent.

[Louise NM]

The usual term for that interval is a tritone, with old nicknames including "the devil's chord" or "the chord of evil." It's use was supposedly prohibited in early music. Jim Hendrix, on the other hand, made liberal use of it.

[Mark Gunter]

The usual term for that interval is a tritone, with old nicknames including "the devil's chord" or "the chord of evil." It's use was supposedly prohibited in early music. Jim Hendrix, on the other hand, made liberal use of it.

Yeah! Tritone = augmented 4th (or dim 5th), midpoint on the chromatic scale in Equal Temperament, the outlier Gb in my chart above.

If I ever re-do that chart (the one above is version two), I need to put "Tritone" there on the second line, and in the third line indicate Gb for diminished fifth and F# for augmented fourth.

[Mark Gunter]

Hopefully, final version and accurate enough. Thanks for the push, Louise NM.

[Louise NM]

Mark, just label it "Satan's interval" with no other info and leave it at that.

[Carl23]

I can see a point in using the augmented second term.

if you start with CDEF (intervals: whole ; whole ; half) then move to CDbEF the Db to E interval can be seen two ways:

Db - E (the augmented second)
or
C# - E (a minor 3rd)

even though the exact pitches (notes) are the same, the implication is different.

CDbEF looks like a scale, and not an arpeggio, so calling DbE a minor 3rd would be confusing.

on the other hand, if you try to make the Db - E a minor 3rd by changing Db to C# it would be like saying C C# E F is part of a scale, which would be really weird. (which is what you did... a logical move in any case )

So the practical question would be, where would you actually use an augmented 2nd?

Harmonic minor scales use them!

Regular minor
C D Eb F G Ab Bb C

harmonic minor raises the Bb to B (augmenting the interval)
C D Eb F G Ab B C

So G Ab B C would be the "C C# D E" you mentioned. this gives it a context relative to an actual scale

the cool thing about using tetra-chords (which sounds like author is doing) is that all tonal "scales" can be seen from this point of view

take any 4 notes of the scale (4 notes in a row) they will fit under all 4 fingers with the "1 finger 2 frets" rule.

so, if you take the C harmonic minor, and start on F you get F G Ab B (augmented 2nd between fingers 3 and 4)
If you start on G you get G Ab B C (augmented 2nd between fingers 2 and 3)
if you start on Ab you get Ab B C D (augmented 2nd between fingers 1 and 2)

If you practice all of the combinations you can start any scale with any finger and already have the shapes in your hand!

yay tetra-chords!

Sorry, I got a bit excited.

C