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Thread: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

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    Default Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    I have been playing mando for about 10 months and am very interested in learning a little Tenor Banjo as well. Any suggestions for a decent tenor banjo to start out with in the $200 to $300 range?

    As a side (and possible dumb) question, if the tenor is tuned GDAE, everything I've learned on the mando should transfer over to the tenor right? Just with a different sound to it?

    Thanks so much for any help!

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    Yes, everything you've learned on Mando transfers over, though depending on your hand/finger size you may have some challenging stretches due to the different scale lengths. I found it moved over nicely. Tenors may be tuned GDAE or higher in CGDA (like a mandola). The same chord shapes apply to either, just have to do some transposition. It's a fun instrument to play, with a small amount of effort to make the transition.

    Watch the classifieds here, a deal will come up. I started on an older Vega tenor I bought here, and also bought a new Deering Goodtime 19 fret tenor. Solid instrument for a reasonable price.

    To be perfectly honest, I'm considering selling both of them as they rarely get played anymore. I've not gotten around yet to putting them up in the classifieds, but PM me if you have interest.
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  3. #3

    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoogus View Post
    I have been playing mando for about 10 months and am very interested in learning a little Tenor Banjo as well. Any suggestions for a decent tenor banjo to start out with in the $200 to $300 range?

    As a side (and possible dumb) question, if the tenor is tuned GDAE, everything I've learned on the mando should transfer over to the tenor right? Just with a different sound to it?

    Thanks so much for any help!
    I bought a gold tone ac4 from a cafe member a while back and am having a lot of fun with it. It sounds pretty good and you can get one new for a couple hundred dollars. The stretches can be a challenge!

  4. #4

    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    I've come at it the other way. After a few years of five string clawhammer banjo, I decided to dabble with Irish tenor banjo (GDAE) this past fall and got seriously hooked. I bought a used 17 fret Deering Goodtime which fell just within your desired budget. And then of course I had to try the mandolin which is another great adventure. What I'm finding is that, with the shorter 17 fret banjo scale at least, I can use exactly the same fingering. It's just a matter of going from feeling scrunched up on the mandolin to spread out and hopping around a little more on the banjo. I don't have large hands, by the way. When I go back and forth between the two, I think the banjo is easier to fret cleanly after I get my fingers re-calibrated. Vintage tenors are easy to find at reasonable prices as well, if you don't mind a little tinkering. Give it a try!

  5. #5

    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    Definitely specifically go for a 17-fret tenor. Open-back might be a good starting point too if you’re not too concerned yet about having lots of volume. These two form factors will bring you closest to the mandolin experience in terms of fingering stretches and weight/comfort.

    The trouble with $2-300 tenors, in my experience, is that they tend to be old and frequently used-and abused. Things you don’t want to deal with are old friction tuners, badly worn fingerboard, uncomfortable bar frets, and possibly a very old head that is about ready to rip. (Guitar-style tuners, often found on cheaper banjos, are much preferable to old “period-correct friction tuners”, which will drive you nuts and lead you quickly towards a $100-plus-labour upgrade to planetary (geared) tuners.)

    In playing, if you have a short-scale 17-fret tenor, the biggest difference is in the right-hand technique. It is actually a very different feel and pick motion to get a smooth tremolo going on an unyielding, double-string mandolin course versus a flaccid-feeling single banjo string. I find a lighter pick better on the banjo (and I’m not a heavy-mando-pick user—I like an .88 for mando and a .73 for tenor banjo or guitar).

    GDAE is GDAE though. You will find lots of commonalities between the instruments. You sure you want to divide your efforts though, while you’re still early in your mandolin journey? It doesn’t sound like you’ve even had the the typically brief mandola fling that most of us (non-BG diehards, anyhoo) go through.

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    Registered Muser dang's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Cameron View Post
    Definitely specifically go for a 17-fret tenor.
    I agree with the rest of what you said but personally found a 17-fret tenor banjo tuned in GDAE to have floopy strings. YMMV
    I should be pickin' rather than postin'

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    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    Quote Originally Posted by dang View Post
    I agree with the rest of what you said but personally found a 17-fret tenor banjo tuned in GDAE to have floopy strings. YMMV
    I ended up putting heavy gauge strings,on .014", .024"W, .034"W, .046"W and that has cured the flop for me.

    Since this is in the vintage section, I use an old 1923 Vega F style, which seem to go cheaply. I did upgrade the tuners, but you may find one where this has already been done.
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    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    Yes, if going for a 17 fret tenor you'd definitely want heavier string gauges and a lighter pick (the lightest I'd go on a 17 fret tenor would be 13/20w/30w/40w) I use .60mm gauge Dunlop Max Grip picks for tenor banjo, whether it's a 17 fret or a 19 fret. There is definitely a different feel to playing a 17 fret tenor vs. a 19 fret and my preference is for the 19 fret. The stretch is not that difficult to get used to - small kids starting out back home usually play 19 fret tenor banjos without issue.
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    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    Divided effort. That is the question for me too. I am an ok guitar player but I have a lot to learn. I'm over 65. I am never going to be a professional musician. Ain't gonna happen. I played some mando about 5-10 years ago and I learned a bit. But, I gave it up in favor, at that time, of keeping the time I have to do music focused on guitar. Still, I do think the mando playing helped me musically in a variety of ways. Now I am thinking that it really is all about having fun, and I do find it entertaining to learn to play instruments, any instrument really. So, I am thinking about picking up something else to mess around with. Maybe an octave mandolin. I could use that to play both some melody and some rhythm in a small celtic/contra dance music type jam I enjoy playing mostly rhythm guitar in now. It brings a different sound to the mix. Its all fun and I do feel fortunate that I have some friends to play with that tolerate me. I would say that the most important thing really is playing with other people, and learning that dynamic. More than playing other instruments, playing with other people really moves you forward musically and it is pure joy after a while.
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    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    The suggestions to anybody looking for a beginner/inexpensive banjo is Deering Goodtime, Gold Tone, Recording King, especially the first 2, they have best QC. I had an RK Dirty 30's tenor and returned it, it had a lot of problems with neck angle and head height.

    Buying banjos if you're not knowledgeable is tricky, there's rim rod and dowel stick banjos and they both seem to have a lot of problems but some of those problems are cheaply/easily fixable, like shimming neck joint to get it to 3 degrees or making the lag bolt holes in rim longer but you can't do that easily if you have a skirted tonering. I made a list of banjo buying problems https://www.reddit.com/r/banjo/comme...anjos/e1jaohg/
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    Smile Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    I picked up a short scale tenor Gold Tone, discounted, locally,
    New, for $200, No Case..
    IDK if you can find the same price..
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    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    Quote Originally Posted by derbex View Post
    I ended up putting heavy gauge strings,on .014", .024"W, .034"W, .046"W and that has cured the flop for me.

    Since this is in the vintage section, I use an old 1923 Vega F style, which seem to go cheaply. I did upgrade the tuners, but you may find one where this has already been done.
    Well, disclosure: I dont have a 17xfret, I have two 19-frets. I just found the 17s I’ve tried to be more comfortable players, but didn’t want to purchase them for other reasons. (I am not convinced of the Deering construction of single-piece neck/fingerboard, no truss rod although they are probably fine with the relatively low string tension; I just couldnkt get convinced to the tune of $800Cdn.) Then I got seduced by an old Ludwig which met my other qualifications.

    My favourite modern tenor from my recent search was the Gretsch Laydie Belle, a 17 which was going for just over a grand Cdn (so almost 1200 by the time our beloved govt gets a piece), too expensive for me and availability seemed doubtful by the end of the summer. I’d watch for a used one of those though. Great feel though, lots of volume for an open#back.

  16. #13

    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    Tenors are typically tuned CGDA and there shouldn't be any floppy issues on a 17 fret with the proper gauges I don't think.

    GDAE is usually mando or plectrum tenor tuning with mando being 13-ish inch scale and plectrum around 25" scale.

    A 17 fret is around 21" so it falls between the two in terms of scale and string gauge.
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    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    One of the best pieces of advise I got when buying my first tenor banjo was to upgrade the head. You can make a huge improvement just by spending another $25-35 on a Fibreskyn head right off the bat.
    Ted Eschliman

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    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    Great feedback on here everyone, thank you!

    So I got a tenor. It is a Goldstone CC-IT.

    I have limited time to play each day, maybe 30 minutes, and don't want my mando playing to erode. I am pretty structured in my practice time, a few minutes each on scales/techniques, new tunes, working on tunes I know. I find this helps me to have an efficient practice session. So I am trying to decide how to divide time between the tenor banjo and the mando.

    Any suggestions with about 30 minutes each day to work on?

    I also feel that I probably need to connect with someone for some in person lessons as opposed to just online stuff.

    Thanks!

  20. #16

    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    I follow Tiny Moore's mando exercises for mandolin and tenor. It helps with transposing and getting the layout of the fretboard.

    I practice an hour each morning cycling through mandolin, tenor, classical guitar and jazz guitar (each on a different day). Not sure if I'm getting better, but it does keep my calluses hard and it keeps my fingers flexible.
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    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Eschliman View Post
    One of the best pieces of advise I got when buying my first tenor banjo was to upgrade the head. You can make a huge improvement just by spending another $25-35 on a Fibreskyn head right off the bat.
    Ted, you're so right - to me the Fibreskyn heads make a huge difference. Not being a banjo player myself, I was really put off balance when trying to play the tenors with the regular heads - they were just too loud and bright for me. The Fibreskyn has a much more mellow sound that I could really get comfortable with. It also made a big difference in being able to distinguish all the notes when strumming chords.

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    Default Re: Tenor Banjo suggestion for beginner Mando player

    Congrats on the gold tone. In banjoland they and Goodtimes are the safe buy recommendation for somebody that doesn't know a lot about the instrument.

    First thing is to check the setup: nuts on lag bolts tight, neck to pot connection doesn't have any gaps, head evenly tensioned, tailpiece not wobbly. Look at reflections of strings off the frets to look for high frets, hump over neck joint, relief etc.

    There's a lot to it and it's possible to drastically change the tone/voluem/sustain depending on tailpiece, bridge, head etc,

    ________________

    here's good resources

    Bill Evans (2) Banjo for Dummies books

    google "banjo setup" from builders Stelling, Prucha, Nechville

    https://blog.deeringbanjos.com/how-s...y-banjo-set-up

    https://creekdontrise.com/tabs_instr...ring_banjo.htm

    OR you can PM me questions, I spend a lto of time on vintage banjo rescue
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