Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 26 to 50 of 50

Thread: Improv From Scratch

  1. #26
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    Improv From Scratch #19 Quarter notes and rests


    PDF file here:
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Improv From Scratch #19 Quartern Notes Rests.pdf 
Views:	147 
Size:	124.0 KB 
ID:	180921
    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  2. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Pete Martin For This Useful Post:


  3. #27
    Registered User Mike Buesseler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Whitefish,MT
    Posts
    1,719

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    I know this is a dumb question, but I’m going to ask anyway: how come something that sounds like so much fun, and LOOKS so easy when people do it well IS SO DIFFICULT TO LEARN? I play a LOT, but improv seems to be just on the other side of a very thin door. (I can hear it, but I can’t open the damn door!)

  4. #28
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    You just have to dive in and do it. Nobody is a good improvisor in the beginning. The best at it have been doing it a long time and have really studied how great players in the past have done it. You are just beginning the journey, so have fun, but keep doing it!!!!!

    And there are no dumb questions. Yours in perfectly legit Mike.

    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  5. The following members say thank you to Pete Martin for this post:


  6. #29

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    Mike, to Pete's great advice I would add that you need to lose your natural desire to sound good when you start improvising. There are lots of play-along recordings that you can practice with in the privacy of your own home. A great part of the success as an improvisor is to do what Pete says -- dive in and do it. It will not sound so great at the start, but as you do it more and more you will begin to develop finger patterns that will give you good sounding notes to begin with.

    And separate from improvising practice, work on your scales in the most common keys that you're likely to want to improvise in. Then work on the pentatonic versions of those scales (notes 1,2,3,5,6,1) because that gives the least conflicting group of notes for improvising for a lot of folk, bluegrass, pop/rock, Great-American-Songbook tunes.

    Another thing to do to help you feel more comfortable making things up is to simply make things up without trying to fit into an accompaniment. Just noodle on your mandolin in a specific key. Remember Sturgeon's Law that 90% of anything is crap -- when you see performers or hear recordings you have to remember that you're only seeing or hearing the 10% that is good, not the 90% that isn't good that got left in the practice room or on the editing room floor at the recording studio.

  7. The following members say thank you to dhbailey for this post:


  8. #30
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    If anyone has questions regarding material in the videos, I'm happy to answer them to the best of my ability here. Or I can suggest a plan of action for practicing the material and how to apply it in improv in real time. There is a LOT to learn, but it IS learnable.

    I'll add one more thing, a common jazz teachers saying:

    "Good improv is 5% inspiration and 95% perspiration"

    Holy cow is this true!
    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  9. #31
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    Improv From Scratch #20 How to Practice New Improv Ideas


    PDF file here:Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Improv From Scratch #20 How To Practice New Ideas.pdf 
Views:	115 
Size:	74.2 KB 
ID:	182267
    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  10. #32
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    The next videos in the series will be looking at what to play on minor chords.


    No PDF with this one



    PDF:
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Improv From Scratch #22 IIm IIIm VIm Scale Practice.pdf 
Views:	91 
Size:	200.0 KB 
ID:	185960



    PDF:
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Improv From Scratch #23 Minor Chord Scale Outlines.pdf 
Views:	102 
Size:	142.4 KB 
ID:	185961
    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  11. #33
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    Here is video #24, chord tone scale ideas over a IIm chord.



    PDF
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	IFS #24 IIm CTS.pdf 
Views:	93 
Size:	125.2 KB 
ID:	193334
    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  12. #34
    Oval holes are cool David Lewis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    1,461

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Buesseler View Post
    I know this is a dumb question, but I’m going to ask anyway: how come something that sounds like so much fun, and LOOKS so easy when people do it well IS SO DIFFICULT TO LEARN? I play a LOT, but improv seems to be just on the other side of a very thin door. (I can hear it, but I can’t open the damn door!)
    Keep going. At the heart of it is another body part - your ears. Take it slow. Listen to what you’re playing. Ignore music theory initially. Maybe just use one scale. Hum slow, easy passages and try and replicate them. Don’t berate yourself for 'mistskes'. A flat third over a major chord is a 'mistake' in a sense. Yet sounds fantastic. Take your time. Don’t overwhelm yourself snd most importantly have fun.

    You’ll get there. Try, but try easy.
    JBovier ELS; Epiphone MM-50 VN; Epiphone MM-40L; Gretsch New Yorker G9310; Washburn M1SDLB;

    Fender Nashville Deluxe Telecaster; Squier Modified Vintage Cabronita Telecaster; Gretsch 5420T; Fender Tim Armstrong Hellcat: Washburn Banjo B9; Ibanez RB 5string; Ibanez RB 4 string bass

    Pedalboard for ELS: Morley Cry baby Miniwah - Tuner - EHX Soul Food Overdrive - EHX Memory Toy analog Delay
    Fender Blues Jr Tweed; Fender Greta;

  13. #35
    Oval holes are cool David Lewis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    1,461

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    PS @pete Martin . The video is great! Thanks!
    JBovier ELS; Epiphone MM-50 VN; Epiphone MM-40L; Gretsch New Yorker G9310; Washburn M1SDLB;

    Fender Nashville Deluxe Telecaster; Squier Modified Vintage Cabronita Telecaster; Gretsch 5420T; Fender Tim Armstrong Hellcat: Washburn Banjo B9; Ibanez RB 5string; Ibanez RB 4 string bass

    Pedalboard for ELS: Morley Cry baby Miniwah - Tuner - EHX Soul Food Overdrive - EHX Memory Toy analog Delay
    Fender Blues Jr Tweed; Fender Greta;

  14. #36
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Guildford + Falmouth England
    Posts
    916

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    Quote Originally Posted by JonZ View Post
    This is why I am not enthusiastic about the “copy great solos” approach to learning to improvise—especially for beginners—because it puts the focus on achieving a “correct” result. Likewise, the great majority of school time is spent on generating “correct” results. I think the first order of business for improvisers is to abandon “correct” and replace it with “compelling”. Even a train wreck of a solo, if you really commit to it, can be compelling.
    I don't know enough improvising mandolin players work - but if you listen to popular (with the public) guitarists then noticeably innovative ones, you can often tell which ones learned hundreds of other people's licks and put them together when soloing. They're often the most popular ones, maybe because many people value familiarity over innovation. The guitarists I prefer are people like say Roy Buchanan, who seemed to be able to produce stuff nobody else had much thought of. I'll doubtless get a post telling me exactly who Roy lifted his licks from , but you know what I mean...

    One thing about being apprehensive about messing up, whether improvising, generally performimng or otherwise - smile and act confident, and most non players will never know. The players have all messed up at some time, so they don't mind if you do it.

    Thanks for the links Pete!

  15. #37
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    Here is video #25, chord tone scale ideas over a VIm chord.




    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	IFS #25 VIm CTS.pdf 
Views:	76 
Size:	125.1 KB 
ID:	195887
    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  16. #38
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    Here is video #25, chord tone scale ideas over a IIIm chord.





    Video #27 making phrases from chord tone scales




    Video #28 non chord tones on a major chord

    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  17. #39
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    #29 Solo Strategies

    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  18. #40
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    Sam Bush Plays I IV V

    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  19. #41
    Registered User Charlie Bernstein's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    Augusta, Maine, USA
    Posts
    1,810

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    Quote Originally Posted by LongBlackVeil View Post
    I really need to spend more time with this.

    I cant be sure, because ive never gotten there. But i swear the thing that holds me back the most is fear of messing up. . . . its just like an invisible wall that keeps me from letting loose. . . .
    A friend of mine is a real good music teacher. But when he was starting out, he had the exact same problem. Then he took lessons from an old jazz artist who recognized the problem. He stopped my my friend and asked him why he wasn't soloing more, and my friend said he didn't want to make mistakes.

    The old teach made a big circle in the air with his hands and said, "I make my mistakes big like Mars!"

    The obvious point: We're all going to lay down some clams. It's part of improvising. But if you just play through them, you stand to make some good music and have a lot of fun doing it.

    And wouldn't Big Like Mars be a great name for a band?
    Gibson A-Junior snakehead (Keep on pluckin'!)

  20. #42
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Albany NY
    Posts
    2,054

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    Quote Originally Posted by JonZ View Post
    This is why I am not enthusiastic about the “copy great solos” approach to learning to improvise—especially for beginners—because it puts the focus on achieving a “correct” result. Likewise, the great majority of school time is spent on generating “correct” results. I think the first order of business for improvisers is to abandon “correct” and replace it with “compelling”. Even a train wreck of a solo, if you really commit to it, can be compelling.
    I agree, while being able to copy and execute a previously recorded solo by some great player (on any instrument) does imply technical skill, determination, and accomplishment.
    However copying an "improvised solo" is no longer improvising.
    Now a lot of the "masters" talk about doing this in youth, so there is value to the method.
    For my money I'd rather not hear live music "exact" as the album or last weeks concert, I'm more open to possibilities.
    Thanks for offering a guide through this somewhat undaunting field.
    Stormy Morning Orchestra

    My YouTube Channel

    "Mean Old Timer, He's got grey hair, Mean Old Timer he just don't care
    Got no compassion, thinks its a sin
    All he does is sit around an play the Mandolin"

  21. #43
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    Copying solos DOES teach you the language of the music style. It's up to each player how "authentic" to the style they want to sound like, but if you do want to play in a style, almost every great player has learned from past masters.

    I have never regretted learning a solo from a favorite player. I've learned a few hundred.

    No right or wrong here.
    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  22. The following members say thank you to Pete Martin for this post:

    Kenny 

  23. #44
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    My newest video looks at the song Foggy Mountain Top and how one could construct a solo using ideas we have seen throughout this series.





    PDF file:
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Mandolin Improvisation #33 Foggy Mountain Top.pdf 
Views:	60 
Size:	195.3 KB 
ID:	208510
    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  24. #45
    Registered User lowtone2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    lower alabama
    Posts
    892

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    Quote Originally Posted by JonZ View Post
    This is why I am not enthusiastic about the “copy great solos” approach to learning to improvise—especially for beginners—because it puts the focus on achieving a “correct” result. Likewise, the great majority of school time is spent on generating “correct” results. I think the first order of business for improvisers is to abandon “correct” and replace it with “compelling”. Even a train wreck of a solo, if you really commit to it, can be compelling.
    Transcribing great solos, which is really just very intense listening, i think is like learning language. Most people who improvise at a high level, and I'm guessing here because I'm not one of those, are not thinking about which chord tones or patterns or alteration they are playing, just as when we speak we are not thinking about where to place an adjective, etc... But we have to practice the patterns/scales first to get them into our vocabulary.

  25. #46
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    I have to say I am a BIG proponent of learning note for note solos from your favorite player(s). It DOES teach you the vocabulary of the language. It also teaches how this level of players organizes their thoughts and how they solve problems, two VERY needed skills for anyone who wants to improvise well.

    I learned a ton of solos from Sam, Bill, Tiny and a bunch of non mando Jazz players. I've learned something from every one and fell all were excellent time investments.
    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  26. #47
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    The latest video in this series is Monroe Style Phrases



    PDF file
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	IFS 34  Monroe Style Phrases.pdf 
Views:	54 
Size:	139.1 KB 
ID:	209225
    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  27. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Pete Martin For This Useful Post:

    DSDarrgfury 

  28. #48
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    The latest 2 videos.

    Chromatically 3 to 5



    V7 > I Clash Resolve
    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  29. #49
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    This video covers the key of B.

    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

  30. #50
    Registered User Pete Martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,244

    Default Re: Improv From Scratch

    Playing minor scale ideas against major chord progressions for a blusey sound.

    -----------
    Pete Martin
    www.PeteMartin.info
    Jazz and Bluegrass instruction books, videos, articles, transcriptions, improvisation, ergonomics, free recordings, private lessons

    www.WoodAndStringsBand.com
    Jazz trio

    www.AppleValleyWranglers.net
    Western Swing music

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •