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Thread: TOH Weber warranty

  1. #1
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    Default TOH Weber warranty

    As a owner of a 2010 Yellowstone I was upset to see that TOH will not honor the lifetime warranty on any Weber mandolin made prior to January 1st, 2013. That leaves several thousands of mandolins without a valid warranty. That leaves a lot of people with having to pay someone else to do any warranty type of repairs. Just passing this along.


    From their website;

    This warranty applies to all Weber products manufactured after January 1st 2013 and purchased and serviced within the United States of America. All warranties outside of the USA are defined by the authorized dealer or distributor of that particular country or region and may vary in terms and/or length from the above.

  2. #2
    Registered User G7MOF's Avatar
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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Was it a used mandolin as in the UK the warranty only applies to the original purchaser.
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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Here is a link to their warranty page.You read it for yourself.

    https://webermandolins.com/support/warranty

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    Registered User Walt's Avatar
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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Forgive my ignorance here: What is TOH? Is this a separate entity from Weber?

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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Quote Originally Posted by Walt View Post
    Forgive my ignorance here: What is TOH? Is this a separate entity from Weber?

    Two Old Hippies (TOH) purchased Weber mandolins from Bruce Weber in 2012. Bruce Weber is no longer affiliated with TOH in anyway.

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    Fatally Flawed Bill Kammerzell's Avatar
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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Quote Originally Posted by Walt View Post
    Forgive my ignorance here: What is TOH? Is this a separate entity from Weber?
    Two Old Hippies. The company that purchased Weber from Bruce Weber in October of 2012.
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    Registered User Ivan Kelsall's Avatar
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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Thanks for the 'heads up' George. However,i'd never send my own Weber "Fern" to TOH - no way !. I'd only entrust it's health & well being to the 'main man', Bruce Weber, & i'd be willing to pay the cost as well (if need be).

    To be honest,i find it totally incongrous that TOH has retained the Weber name, now that Bruce Weber is no longer part of the act. However,we still ALL know 'who' Weber really is !. Interesting to note that TOH is no longer prepared to fulfill the obligations of the Co. they bought out.

    G7MOF - Yes,the Weber warranty only ever applied to the original owner - however !. Bruce Weber did offer a re-registration at one point,allowing the second etc. owners to renew the warranty. It shows the difference in the thinking between the 2 factions in their view of customer ''after sales commitment'',
    Ivan
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  9. #8
    Moderator MikeEdgerton's Avatar
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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    To be honest,i find it totally incongrous that TOH has retained the Weber name
    Ivan, what do you think TOH paid Bruce all that money for? I'm sure he did well on the sale.
    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them". These are the words of J. Garber.

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  11. #9

    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Ivan +1, I have sent both my Weber’s to Bruce for checkups and small issues. I will always use him as long as he is repairing them.
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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    When you "buy" a brand name and decide to abandon the warranty obligations you assumed when you bought that brand name your true character becomes obvious. FWIW I would not trust a company like that with my Yellowstone (original owner here) regardless. If I need something done I will gladly pay the cost to have Bruce do the work.

  14. #11
    Registered User THart's Avatar
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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Last I heard Bruce Weber was handling warranty work, when did that change?

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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Quote Originally Posted by THart View Post
    Last I heard Bruce Weber was handling warranty work, when did that change?
    Probably when he opened his new business. He might still be doing it and being paid to do it. I think the issue is the fact that TOH has abandoned any warranty issues on instruments manufactured before they bought the company from Bruce.

    I want to be on record as defining this first. Much the same as there are Pre-CBS and Post-CBS Fender guitars there are now Pre-TOH Weber instruments and Post-TOH Weber instruments.
    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them". These are the words of J. Garber.

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  17. #13
    Registered User Walt's Avatar
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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    I think it would be worthwhile calling/emailing to see what the actual warranty situation is. There's a few ways to read that warranty statement. "This warranty applies to all Weber products manufactured after January 1st 2013" may just mean that this specific version of the limited warranty applies to 2013+ instruments, while the old version of the limited warranty applies to older instruments. Or it could mean what everyone here thinks it means. Or the parties to the sale of the company could have divided up who will be performing the warranty work. Someone with TOH could probably resolve the issue for everyone.

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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    This is really a conversation to be had with Bruce. The Instruments made with the Weber Logo by TOH are the only ones they should be responsible for, in my opinion. Sound to Earth no longer exists. You're asking Studabaker for warranty work here. Bruce may hook you up, or not. That's between you two,

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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Ivan, and anyone else not in the USA but who might sometime consider shipping a mandolin to the USA for warranty repair, please make sure to check into the CITES rules before shipping, just to make sure you won't have any problems with that.
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  21. #16

    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Seems simple enough to me. The "new" owners want to warranty only the instruments they made.

    OTOH, it is a calculated risk that many of the instruments have changed hands by now, original owners have died, etc., so the pool of instruments still out there that would qualify for the original warranty would be fairly small -- might have been a nice "goodwill" gesture to keep the existing warranty in place, IMHO.

    In the case of Gibson, for example, how many original owners still have instruments they purchased new in the 20's or 30's? And, of those, how many are requiring repair? Maybe two or three a year, I'm guessing. And, that's Gibson. Weber, would be even fewer as time goes on.....easily written off in the books, I'm thinking....
    Last edited by Jeff Mando; Nov-08-2018 at 11:26am. Reason: pursuit of perfection of thought....as usual!

  22. #17
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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Comparing Gibson to Weber in this case really isn't a valid comparison. Although Gibson ownership changed the company remained. In this case the company "Sound To earth" was purchased by another company and doesn't appear to be an ongoing operating entity unless it's a paper company someplace.

    I agree with Walt's assessment. TOH might still be on the hook for instruments needing warranty work that are owned by their original purchasers. They may have a two layer warranty system going for the.... ready for it? Pre-TOH and Post-TOH Weber instruments. I would assume they purchased not only the assets of the company but also the other obligations of the company. It depends on how that deal was structured I guess.
    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them". These are the words of J. Garber.

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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Send it to Bruce. I sent my Bitterroot to him and he did an awesome job. He did some custom work, (binding the back) replaced the nut to take care of buzzing issues. He also refit the bridge. The Mando came back to me looking great and sounding better than ever.

  24. #19
    Registered User G7MOF's Avatar
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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Quote Originally Posted by George R. Lane View Post
    Here is a link to their warranty page.You read it for yourself.

    https://webermandolins.com/support/warranty
    So I'm correct. The warranty does only apply to the original owner.
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  25. #20
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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    To let everyone know, Bruce Weber stopped doing repair work for TOH last year.

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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Quote Originally Posted by JEStanek View Post
    This is really a conversation to be had with Bruce. The Instruments made with the Weber Logo by TOH are the only ones they should be responsible for, in my opinion. Sound to Earth no longer exists. You're asking Studabaker for warranty work here. Bruce may hook you up, or not. That's between you two,

    Jamie
    Jamie,

    I have to disagree with you. I bought a business 10 years ago and I still have to honor any work that was done by the previous owner. When you purchase a business you take on all the previous owners warranty responsability.

  27. #22
    Moderator MikeEdgerton's Avatar
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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    For historical purposes here is the announcement that TOH was buying Weber from November of 2012. I'll assume the process of moving the factory must have been complete by the first of January 2013. Here is the announcement that Bruce Weber was retiring from March of 2016.
    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them". These are the words of J. Garber.

  28. #23

    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeEdgerton View Post
    Comparing Gibson to Weber in this case really isn't a valid comparison.
    Agreed. My point being EVEN a company the size of Gibson probably only has a few such claims a year once an instrument gets so old, due to the ODDS of instruments no longer in the hands of the original owners. The assumption would be Weber (the company) would probably see even less.

  29. #24
    Moderator MikeEdgerton's Avatar
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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    Quote Originally Posted by George R. Lane View Post
    Jamie,

    I have to disagree with you. I bought a business 10 years ago and I still have to honor any work that was done by the previous owner. When you purchase a business you take on all the previous owners warranty responsability.
    It depends on how the deal is structured. Many times companies are purchased without purchasing the outstanding debt, in this case, the warranties. What you did is what you chose to do. Stanley tools recently purchased the Craftsman name from Sears. Craftsman tools were known for their lifetime warranty. Stanley has chosen to honor some of the lifetime warranty on older tools and said they might make exceptions. If they start getting a few hundred broken wrenches a day I'm guessing they will stop honoring that item. The keyword is that they chose to honor the warranty but they certainly weren't obligated to.
    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them". These are the words of J. Garber.

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  31. #25
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    Default Re: TOH Weber warranty

    I agree with Mike that making the pre vs post TOH distinction is very important, as TOH has a very different business and customer service model than Bruce and Mary could have ever had. TOH has multiple instrument lines/names, has a clothing line, and, iirc, Tom Bedell started the empire with fly lures and other fishing equipment. There is a very corporate structure and attitude there that works for them. Contrast that with a recent classified add posted by Mary urging potential buyers to call Bruce up and talk with him about the instrument for sale. That said, I’m not knowledgeable enough about corporate/contract law to speak intelligently about what TOH legally needs to do vs what we feel they “should” do.

    I will say that my Weber Yellowstone mandocello is a spectacularly made instrument, and a couple of dealers have commented that their quality hasn’t dropped off since Bruce and Jr left TOH. I was honestly not thinking about my cello being a post TOH instrument when I bought it, and remember being a little disappointed that it wasn’t signed by Bruce, but that disappointment dissolved with the first strum...
    Chuck

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