Terrified of the tension on my strings

[Kellie]

So I bought some high tension D'Addario Strings and it's going to be putting over 200 pounds of force on the neck. Should I be concerned?

[Jeff Mando]

To paraphrase an over-used slogan, "what doesn't kill you makes you stronger, especially your left hand......"

[rcc56]

So I bought some high tension D'Addario Strings and it's going to be putting over 200 pounds of force on the neck. Should I be concerned?

That depends on what kind of mandolin you are putting them on. If you are putting them on a modern, well made factory instrument, the instrument will probably handle it. If you are putting them on a pre-war instrument of just about any make, the risk of damaging the instrument is high.

[Kellie]

It's a modern loar 300 dollars I think

[Roger Adams]

Why did you decide on the high tension strings? Just curious.

[Kellie]

Tbh I probably didn't realize they were high tension lol

[rcc56]

Your hands might thank you if you go back to mediums or lights, unless you just want to be really loud. The "The Loar" can probably handle heavies, but I have seen a couple of them with slipped neck joints.

[Ivan Kelsall]

Re.heavier gauge strings being 'loud(er)' - they're only louder if you pick them harder,which being heavy in,the first place, you need to do. Apart from that,having tried a few sets of J75's & a set of DR MD12s in the past,i found that the heavier G & D strings sound a bit 'muddy'. My solution,go back to medium gauge strings,pick hard on those & you get all the volume you need + 'clarity',
Ivan

[rcc56]

I don't know why everybody wants to be loud anyway. The best tone comes from an instrument when it is not forced too hard.
I prefer older instruments, lighter strings, and a lighter touch. Easier on both hands and more pleasant to the ear.

And too heavy a string can actually kill the tone of a lot of instruments.

[Hendrik Ahrend]

Kellie, I'm sure this is a misunderstanding. D'Addario's tension chart shows that you'll never have more than ca. 100 lb string tension:http://www.daddario.com/DADProductDe..._Medium__11_40

The figures they give are per pair, rather than single string; the chart says, "total set tension".

Also, the force bending the neck is getting lower with lower string action above the finger board. So if your action was zero, the neck would not be pulled upwards at all, just compressed - which is theory. What the force of the strings does to the body of the mandolin, is another story.

[Bertram Henze]

Kellie, it seems you're terrified all the time lately

Relax, take two Diazepam and try if you like those heavier strings, playability-wise, sound-wise. If not, buy lighter ones. It's all part of homing in to the perfect personal mandolin.

[multidon]

Henry, I believe you are incorrect in your interpretation of the string tension chart. I am sure that the tension figures are for each individual string, not courses. I also think it is a natural mistake to make, because the “Family” string tension chart D’Addario supplies is misleading. If you click on the “Family Chart” link, notice that the EJ70 set lists tensions for both strings in each course, and shows a total set tension of 159 pounds. Now, this is their light set. How can the medium set have a total string tension half of the light set? Now, compare those individual string tension figures to the individual figures in the other sets. They are comparable. So it seems to me that, in putting together that chart, D’Addario forgot to double the courses, with the lone exception of the EJ70 set. Thus, all other figures in the Total Tendion column need to be doubled in order to be correct.

[Hendrik Ahrend]

Don, you're right. I stand corrected.

[Kellie]

So my mandolin should be able to handle it?

[thecelloronin]

Kellie, if you're so worried, why not return the heavies and get some mediums? See how the instrument responds, and move up the gauges from there as you feel more confident in your instrument's structural integrity. If you can't return them, then even still a new pack of strings should be an easy investment when considering the cost of repairs to your mandolin.

[J.Albert]

Kellie, you're a relatively new player, right?

In that case, why would you want "high tension" strings at all?

I would think most new players would prefer -- and learn more easily -- on light gauge strings that don't put a lot of pressure on their frettin' fingers.

My advice -- DON'T use the heavy-gauge strings.
If the package isn't opened, return them and get lights instead.

[indexless]

Zombies scare the crap out of ne.......so many scary things.....get the lights and sleep well

[allenhopkins]

I don't know why everybody wants to be loud anyway...

See "banjo."

[Jill McAuley]

Kellie, I won some strings in the Cafe's recent D'Addario giveaway - they're medium gauge monels - PM me your address and I'll send you a set if you want, I've got more than enough strings to keep me going!

Cheers,
Jill

[Ivan Kelsall]

Needing to be able to play 'loud' seems to crop up mainly in ''jamming'' situations. On stage,playing with a band,it's usual these days to have a mic. for each instrument (band member),so 'volume' can be controlled via the sound desk. Even if bands adopt the trad. 'single' mic. scenario,the instrument can still be amplified (to a degree) via. the mic.

Regarding ''the best tone coming from an instrument that's not being forced too hard'' (rcc560) - i tend to agree - however,i doubt if a mandolin could be played so hard in normal situations,that the sound would be totally trashed. Having been a member of countless audiences watching Bluegrass musicians on stage,''tone & volume'' never entered my thoughts - i just enjoyed the music !,
Ivan

[multidon]

J73 “lights” have a total tension of around 154 pounds, J74 “mediums” about 180 pounds, and J75 “heavies” about 196. I don’t know what kind of D’Addatio string set for mandolin has over 200 pounds. Maybe one of their types that aren’t phosphor bronze? Anyway, any modern instrument, properly constructed, with an adjustable truss rod, should be able to take whatever is out there marketed as mandolin strings. The key is to adjust the truss rod properly to create counter tension to balance the upward pull of the strings. A professional set up would be key here.

“Properly constructed” is a key phrase of course. There have been threads here in with discussions about “The Loar” instruments. Some have stripped the finish and taken them apart. I remember on thread where the owner, with the top off, discovered a poorly fitted dovetail joint where the body meets the neck. Knowing that is an issue with this particular brand, I would stick with lights on a “The Loar”. If the neck joint ever fails on that, the repair would probably exceed the value of the instrument. Better safe than sorry.

Don’t let that make you feel bad. The same type of defect has been found on higher end instruments, including Gibson! Really, the only way to be absolutely sure that you have a proper neck joint is to get a custom build from a builder who will send you in progress photos.

[sblock]

+1 to what multidon wrote. There is no need to be "terrified" by 150 to 200 lbs of tension in 8 mandolins strings (around 20 lbs in each string). That's just silly! These instruments are built to handle that pressure. Even old bowlbacks with light strings have well over 100 lbs of pressure at all times. You rarely hear about mandolins exploding, do you?

What can happen is that the neck joint can give way, which occasionally happens on some cheap or poorly made instruments. Or that the neck and fingerboard can bend or warp. But these failures should not be a source of fear.

You failed to specify which D'Addario string set you considered to be "high tension," nor did you specify the type of mandolin you put these strings on! That information is highly relevant here. To my knowledge, D'Addario does not make a set of mandolin strings that modern F5/A5 mandolins cannot handle. If they did, these would be causing damage and immediately lead to loss of reputation and sales -- instead, D'Addario strings are highly reputed and among the top sellers!

[Kellie]

+1 to what multidon wrote. There is no need to be "terrified" by 150 to 200 lbs of tension in 8 mandolins strings (around 20 lbs in each string). That's just silly! These instruments are built to handle that pressure. Even old bowlbacks with light strings have well over 100 lbs of pressure at all times. You rarely hear about mandolins exploding, do you?

What can happen is that the neck joint can give way, which occasionally happens on some cheap or poorly made instruments. Or that the neck and fingerboard can bend or warp. But these failures should not be a source of fear.

You failed to specify which D'Addario string set you considered to be "high tension," nor did you specify the type of mandolin you put these strings on! That information is highly relevant here. To my knowledge, D'Addario does not make a set of mandolin strings that modern F5/A5 mandolins cannot handle. If they did, these would be causing damage and immediately lead to loss of reputation and sales -- instead, D'Addario strings are highly reputed and among the top sellers!

Ah yes I apologize I forgot to say that the are J75 Phosphor Bronze Heavy Tension strings

- - - Updated - - -

Update: They fit just fine. I don't know why I'm so afraid of strings.

[Mike Arakelian]

I don’t think you have anything to worry about if you want to play the 75’s. Your mandolin should be able to handle them fine. I pretty much use J74’s, but tried the 75’s on my Flatiron out of curiosity. I changed back to the 74’s the very next day. Some people like the heavier strings, but I didn’t like the sound. Just me. If you’re new to the mandolin, I think you’ll find the lighter strings easier on your fingers.

[thecelloronin]

Ah yes I apologize I forgot to say that the are J75 Phosphor Bronze Heavy Tension strings

- - - Updated - - -

Update: They fit just fine. I don't know why I'm so afraid of strings.

As a teacher of many years, I actually get the fear people have of strings. When you tighten them up, you really do get a strong "visualization" of the mounting tension as you hear the pitch wind up. You reach a point where the string isn't so easy to turn anymore (at least on violins and cellos with their wooden pegs), and the pitch getting higher, higher, higher. You wonder if it's gonna pop or break something, only tenuously accepting that everything is ok once finally reaching A440.