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Thread: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

  1. #101
    Joe B mandopops's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    I played Mandolin for 15-20 yrs before I “warmed up” to the F5 & got one. I didn’t like the way they played or sounded. Then it grew on me. I still prefer the ovals.
    An example is comparing 2 Bach CDs, the Caterina/Marshall & Thile’s. This is not about who or which is better. I find myself listening to the Caterina/Marshal a lot more. One thing is hearing the interplay of the 2 instruments (love that Mando-Cello). The other is hearing Caterina’s bowl Mandolin for the Bach. It sounds wonderful. On Thile’s, hearing the F5 solo for that long period of time, I don’t enjoy as much.
    Off the Italian topic somewhat, I know.
    Joe B

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  3. #102
    Full Grown and Cussin' brunello97's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Quote Originally Posted by mandopops View Post
    I played Mandolin for 15-20 yrs before I “warmed up” to the F5 & got one. I didn’t like the way they played or sounded. Then it grew on me. I still prefer the ovals.
    That's what I know, Pops. Maybe it is the oval hole (and the way their tops are stiffened) vs. the F hole top and bracing--and the resultant tone differences--more than the scale length that's at issue in this discussion?

    Going from a 13" scale bowl or flatback to a my ~13-7/8" Gibson is always an adjustment--in my left hand. Going from an round hole A to an F is more of an adjustment in my ear.

    I prefer the oval hole sound (there's generalized statement for you) but I admit I like the way the F style mandolin neck meets the body and having that extra room for my pretty big hands.

    I'm still looking for that elusive mandolin that has the sound between that of an F and an oval hole. The Pavas and Ellis-es I have played have been in that territory. Once I get over this non-stop fisarmonica jag I've been on, it will be time to get one.

    Mick
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  5. #103
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Hi Mick and Mandopops: For me it is either/or. I have my Gibson for the vintage tone, plus the Brentrup A4C for modernized oval tone and my Flatiron A5-2 for that f-hole tone. The few oval hole hybrids I have played (x-braced + longer neck) don't do it for me. At least the ones I have played left me cold.
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  6. #104
    Full Grown and Cussin' brunello97's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Garber View Post
    Hi Mick and Mandopops: For me it is either/or.
    Yep. Ci sono ancora Le Cose in Comune.

    Mick.
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  8. #105
    Sheri Mignano Crawford Mandophile's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    The mandolins are still heard at Caffe Trieste, once a month on Saturday mornings. I try to post the schedule on MandoCafe's calendar. In addition, I've proposed a workshop for CMSA during the San Diego convention this year. Rudy Cipolla (1900-2000) is a San Francisco Original--steeped in the mandolin tradition as taught to him by his father in a barbershop and later in Portland, OR. Rudy went on to 'major in' vaudeville in San Francisco and became a full-fledged composer when he turned 60 years old. He had worked as an arranger for NBC on the radio. See attached announcement and my call for musicians to participate. Rudy may be gone but he'll never be forgotten! A true mentor to Mike Marshall and David Grisman and so many others! Be a part of the Rudy tradition.
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  10. #106
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Sadly I missed any music at Caffe Trieste when I was in San Francisco a couple of years ago. It was August and they take a break then I was told.
    Jim

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  12. #107
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    I used to buy comic books and candy from Rudy in San Francisco when I was a kid. His store was called Rudy's Book Nook. He was always behind the counter with his black oval hole Gibson, with staff paper spread all over the place in the midst of composing and arranging. He was always so engrossed in his music, it was all I could do to get his attention to give him money for the things I wanted to buy.

    Sheri, thanks again for championing the preservation of Italian mandolin music!

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  14. #108
    Sheri Mignano Crawford Mandophile's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Bill's story matches everyone's experience. If you stopped into the Book Nook, he trusted visitors! Of course, had you brought him a bottle of mint Fernet Branca, he would have put down his marker to talk.
    Good News! as soon as I get enough of the transcriptions converted into PDFs, I'll post a Drop Box link devoted exclusively to Rudy's music. In preparation for the CMSA convention and also to make sure everyone who knew Rudy gets a chance to play his music again.

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  16. #109
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Quote Originally Posted by JRG View Post
    Italian music is not forgotten here in Asheville, Mike Guggino and Barrett Smith play here and in Brevard once a month as their Steep Canyon Rangers tour schedule allows. Fantastic stuff !!!
    Bump this older thread

    ...and now this recording: https://www.transylvaniatimes.com/st...bum/49618.html

    from their web site: https://mikegugginoandbarrettsmith.com/about

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by Jim Garber; Jun-08-2021 at 7:05am.
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  18. #110
    Sheri Mignano Crawford Mandophile's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    I've already heard some tracks! They have resuscitated the Italian dance tradition. This is a turning point for renewed interest in learning these ballo liscio dances and for more mandolin players to learn how to read notation, not tab!
    Sheri Mignano Crawford

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  20. #111
    Registered User danielpatrick's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    This album is amazing! Mike, Barrett and I actually got to meet in person and record an in person Mandolins and Beer episode, airing this week!

    - - - Updated - - -

    They definitely sing your praises Sheri!

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  22. #112
    Innocent Bystander JeffD's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Quote Originally Posted by Ge23ev View Post
    Hey guys
    Does anybody else feel like the Italian side and heritage of the mandolin is being forgotten and overshadowed by say bluegrass and Irish music ??
    Not really. Bluegrass is really a minority music in the context of the world. Bluegrass may not even be the biggest minority music. Even in the parts of the US where it is "big", it is not that big. (To most folks, anything with a banjo is automatically bluegrass, and couldn't identify the mandolin if you gave them three chances.)

    I think we exist in a kind of bubble, being immersed in our bluegrass/americana musical culture, and tend to have an exaggerated view of the generalization of our corner of the world. Most people do not play an instrument. Of the small minority who do, most do not play the mandolin. Of the small minority of a minority of those that do, most do not play bluegrass. Except in pockets of the US.

    While Bluegrass has its following worldwide, I would believe that most mandolins and mandolinnish instruments world wide are not playing bluegrass. They are playing classical, and they are playing local folk traditions. And places where Italian folk traditions predominate, the mandolin is probably properly represented.
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  24. #113
    Administrator Mandolin Cafe's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    We're running a feature on the Mike Guggino and Barrett Smith CD in a few days so let me be the first to state the obvious: "boy, Italian music is sure getting a lot of press these days."

    Kidding. Sort of. Had to get this new Duo Mantar album announced today, and it's really a very remarkable project as well. There's a ton of great music that being released all the time, and right now there's a lot of really amazing new material to be listening to.

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  26. #114
    Registered User Simon DS's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    I play mainly Irish because it’s accessible.
    I would like to play lots of other genres but they aren’t as accessible.
    Last edited by Simon DS; Jun-08-2021 at 1:11pm.

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  28. #115
    Registered User Sherry Cadenhead's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Garber View Post
    Bump this older thread

    ...and now this recording: https://www.transylvaniatimes.com/st...bum/49618.html

    from their web site: https://mikegugginoandbarrettsmith.com/about

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Jim, clicking on the link doesn't take me to the recording. What am I doing wrong?

  29. #116
    Full Grown and Cussin' brunello97's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandophile View Post
    .....They have resuscitated the Italian dance tradition. This is a turning point for renewed interest in learning these ballo liscio dances....
    Do they dance, too?
    When folks start dancing again then I'll really feel the resuscitation....

    Mick
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  31. #117
    Registered User lowtone2's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Here's some preview of the album, after about 40 minutes of...other stuff. I think the reason we don't hear much of the italian mandolin is that it takes a stone cold virtuoso to play it. Guggino is in that category.


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  33. #118
    Registered User Simon DS's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Beautifully played!
    Thanks for posting this, and MC.
    At 39:36, any kind soul know the names of these tunes?

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  37. #120
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Great episode of Mandolins and Beer Podcast with Mike Guggino and Barrett Smith regarding their new album Mia Dolce Farfalla. Special props to Sheri Mignano Crawford whose epic work documenting so much Italian music history is discussed in the episode. This new album is the front page feature starting tomorrow morning.

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  39. #121
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    More Italian music not being forgotten: Acoustic Disc just rereleased the David Grisman, Beppe Gambetta, Carlo Aonzo recording Traversata here as a download.

    David Grisman, Beppe Gambetta, Carlo Aonzo
Traversata

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  41. #122
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Funny that this thread just popped up again. I recently found a bowlback at an estate sale made by Geo. Bauer Co. Philadelphia circa 1900. (Thanks Jim Garber for help with ID). It needed new strings and a tail piece. No sooner did I order those than I managed to injure my hip and I'm not able to get to my work shop to make the repairs.
    Hopefully by the end of this week. What to do to pass the time?
    I have been surfing YT and listening to Italian mandolin music. What an ear opener! I came into mandolin by the bluegrass route. For many years nothing but BG, then more recently I have branched off into Celtic music also. My fiddle playing led me in that direction. And now the bowlback brings me to Italian.
    I will agree with the notion that this site doesn't have a lot of Italian content, but it represents the input of its members and contributors. And as such I look forward to many more stimulating discussions.
    I would encourage you to give a listen to, perhaps, Antonio Calsolaro playing Tarantela Napolentana (did I hear a little Jerusalem Ridge there?) or Gianni Sozzi playing Funiculi Funicula (you'll recognize the melody immediately). Might not be to everyone's taste, but made me realize this is historically a part of the evolution of our mandolin obsession that deserves at least a little more attention. Ciao! for now![ATTACH=CONFIG]195560 Click image for larger version. 

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    Ratliff R5 2007, Capek A5 2003, Washburn M5S-SB Jethro Burns 1982, Mid-Mo M-2, Epiphone MM 30 Bk mandolins, Harmony Batwing 1970's, George Bauer bowlback early 1900's Philadelphia.


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  42. #123
    Administrator Mandolin Cafe's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Gnann View Post
    I have been surfing YT and listening to Italian mandolin music. What an ear opener! I came into mandolin by the bluegrass route. For many years nothing but BG, then more recently I have branched off into Celtic music also. My fiddle playing led me in that direction. And now the bowlback brings me to Italian.
    I will agree with the notion that this site doesn't have a lot of Italian content, but it represents the input of its members and contributors. And as such I look forward to many more stimulating discussions.
    Well, there is this discussion which has over 200K views, running for over 7 years that's quite a bit of Italian related content. For some reason the author put it in a different category, or did so by mistake--I don't know. We typically don't move threads unless requested. Some of my comments are kind of tongue in cheek. There's actually quit a lot of discussion and content around the subject but it doesn't all land in this category. But at the end of the day this is a site largely about mandolins, not exactly something you find on every city block like a guitar. Then pare it down to classical, electric mandolin, mandola and the like and you're looking at 1% of a very small number.

    Oh, and this discussion, itself in the General category. I'm tellin' ya, SOOOO much talk about Italian mandolin! LOL

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  44. #124
    Full Grown and Cussin' brunello97's Avatar
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Thanks for linking this over to Sheri's thread, Scott.

    Her amazing working collecting and collating Italian and Italian - American music from the classic mandolin era is a self-less and priceless treasure trove of music, biographical and cultural information.

    Sheri is truly working tirelessly to keep this music alive through playing the music...not simply recordings.

    Mick
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  46. #125
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    Default Re: Italian Mandolin music being forgotten ???

    Thanks Scott for the re-direct. And Sherri great work. Now that's Italian!
    Ratliff R5 2007, Capek A5 2003, Washburn M5S-SB Jethro Burns 1982, Mid-Mo M-2, Epiphone MM 30 Bk mandolins, Harmony Batwing 1970's, George Bauer bowlback early 1900's Philadelphia.


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