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Thread: Anyone ever been kicked out of a jam?

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    I recently bought the Mel Bay's Mandolin Jamming Guidebook and CD. There is a section on manners, and I was wondering if any of you have ever behaved improperly enough to be shown the door...or gang plank. I have only been to about 4 jams since I joined my local Bluegrass Society last March, and I hope to still be welcomed back to the next one I hear about. (Unless there is a reason nobody is calling me.)
    You are only young once, but you can be immature forever.

  2. #2

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    Been looked at funny with that "thet boy aint raht" look by some self appointed occifers of the bluegrass police for major infractions such as but not limited to:

    1. Playing a non bluegrass song (A Hank Williams number)
    2. Showing up with an Ovation mandolin
    3. Playing non gospel music after midnight on Saturday night (Turned in to Sunday)
    4. Playing a Beatles song when I thought no one was looking
    5. Drinking beer after midnight on Saturday (see above)
    6. Playing a blues song when I thought no one was looking
    7. Then theres the issue of my wife's Toyota (Assembled in Tennessee)

    Good thing about the bluegrass police is that:

    1. I can outrun them all
    2. I will probably out live them all
    3. They do not issue actual tickets or make arrests
    4. I only get around them 3 or 4 times a year.

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    ..haha..that pretty much nails it Steve...but...you have to play in tune and time also..

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    Registered User sunburst's Avatar
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    The only time I've ever seen anyone thrown out (asked to leave, actually) of a bluegrass jam, it was a drummer...

    Usually, first one, then another picker makes an excuse to leave 'til the jam disbands, and often re-forms elsewhere after the offender is otherwise occupied.

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    Registered User Doug Edwards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by (sunburst @ June 22 2005, 17:37)
    Usually, first one, then another picker makes an excuse to leave 'til the jam disbands, and often re-forms elsewhere after the offender is otherwise occupied.

    That explains what happened, I just thought it was gettin' late. #




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    Modulator ;) PhilGE's Avatar
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    With all due respect, a hammered dulcimer player showed up at an old-time jam a while back. He admitted he was rather new and had played out only once, then sat right next to me and proceeded to try and play along with tunes he didn't know and he didn't have a mute (not the 9 lb kind). Meanwhile, a wonderful old fiddler showed up and the dulcimer player's wall of sound kept me from clearly hearing what the fiddler's playing. I politely asked him to back off a bit so I could hear the others. He did for a while, then left before I could explain what was happening. I saw the train wreck way ahead of the scene, but couldn't really do much to stop it from happening. I'm hoping he goes to other jams or finds ways to play with others. The main problem was not so much that he wasn't prepared to play, but that he didn't take the time to assess the setting and how his playing might affect others trying to hear each other. Trying to ask or answer questions about etiquette during a jam is a baaad idea. To clarify: I know of some dynamic hammered dulcimer players with whom I'd pay to jam. Not all hammered dulcimers were meant for firewood...

    I've never been asked to leave, but I've recognized how backing off was a good idea at times when among much better players.

    -Phil

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    Still Picking and Sawing Jack Roberts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by (sunburst @ June 22 2005, 15:37)
    Usually, first one, then another picker makes an excuse to leave 'til the jam disbands, and often re-forms elsewhere after the offender is otherwise occupied.
    Hmm... I know I am guilty of walking out of jams when I thought they were going awry. I'm not getting any younger, and I don't want to waste my time on some types of music. The songs I've been known to leave after are:

    Ghost riders in the sky
    Walk right in, sit right down, baby let it all hang out
    Rocky mountian high
    Ha, ha! keep time: how sour sweet music is,
    When time is broke and no proportion kept!
    --William Shakespeare

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    Registered User bjc's Avatar
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    One way to avoid being kicked out is to show up with some GOOD malt...save the Miller Lite for the Inlaws...
    PeacE
    Brian

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    Quote Originally Posted by (steve in tampa @ June 22 2005, 18:20)
    2. Showing up with an Ovation mandolin
    Ah, so that's why, then!

    Seriously, if the BG scene is anything like the Irish scene in the US, it could probably use more people being thrown out. As it is, it's almost impossible for a clueless person to be thrown out of an Irish session, because they don't get the clues!

    The fact that you're asking the question and doing your part to learn session etiquette, shows that you're a keeper. Keep jamming!
    Mandolins:
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    Registered User 8ch(pl)'s Avatar
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    Ghost Riders in the sky.... we have a guy in our folk group who absolutely cannot sing, he admits it himself. He still shows up and it is painful. When he tries to hold a not he loses pich and drops about 1/2 to a full tone. Dreadful. If he does a song that is more stacatto it isn't too bad. He did a slow drawling version of Ghost Riders which is a faily fast number.....Dreadful

    He is very thin skinned and is easily insulted if someone suggests that he shouldn't try to sing. He is a nice fellow and very good on harmonica.

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    Registered User PaulD's Avatar
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    I do know of one local Irish session that was rescheduled to conflict with a regular BG jam to discourage a certain "personality" from attending! Other than that, the jams I've attended around here are pretty forgiving.

    MandoDebbie; you're doing the right thing to read up on the "etiquette" beforehand so you'll at least have an idea what not to do. Phil has some good comments in that vein. I found an article on an online Celtic site (maybe Ceolas.org?) that I read before I started attending jams heavily... it made me more comfortable because I tend towards introversion.

    I haven't gotten tossed out of a jam yet, or had the circle close up in front of me (I've heard of people doing that!). I even get invited back to some regular jams, so I guess I'm doing something right. And I haven't gotten tossed off this forum, but this is a forgiving group!
    "... beauty is not found in the excessive but what is lean and spare and subtle" - Terry Tempest Williams

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    What would be the proper bluegrass jam etiquette thing to do when:

    1. A fellow very loudly strums (not chops) his mandolin but does not know the chords to the songs, so that every other chord he plays is the wrong one.

    2. Two energetic harmonica players show up, stand right behind you, and proceed to play through everyone else's break.

    3. A real good Tony Rice-style guitar player takes a break, but the other half dozen or so guitar players keep strumming their guitars real loud, so loud that no one can hear the neat guitar break.

    4. Someone starts playing the tambourine.

    JUst asking.

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    Registered User fredfrank's Avatar
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    Most of the time, instead of kicking somebody out of the jam, a few of the better players pass around to each other that they're going to re-form a jam elsewhere on the grounds.

    If I am in a jam where somebody is being less than courteous, I simply leave. Less chance of hurt feelings, and most of the people who are likewise put off by that person do the same.

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    I have never been kicked out of a jam but the biggest problems I see at jams are people who don't take in consideration what kind of jam it is.

    Like I wouldn't go to a Celtic or Irish Sessiun' and play acoustic rock songs. And if you are new and go join a Bluegrass jam where the fellas have been playing together for years and you go in playing "Needle and the Damage Done by Neil Young"

    Most things are just kinda common sense or common courtesy.

    Now what I DON'T like is the so called self appointed "Bluegrass Police" who will look down on you because you are not playing a Martin or Gibson.

    Actually in all the years I have been playing I have never seen anyone "KICKED" out of a jam. Usually most musicians are nice people and if someone is being obnoxious they just leave and soon the obnoxious one finds him/her self playing alone.


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    I was at a bluegrass jam once and this folky came in. Real nice fella, but he brought his wife and kids who didn't play, (I love kids but...) they were running around the whole time and what not. Then when it was his turn to pick a tune, he busts into this mean version of "Puff the Magic Dragon" and dedicated it to his disobediant kids. To quote Glen, it was "dreadful", I thought I was gonna fall out of my chair.
    Philip Halcomb

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    Registered User sunburst's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by (Mandomania @ June 22 2005, 22:58)
    What would be the proper bluegrass jam etiquette thing to do when:

    Well, I don't claim to be an expert on proper bluegrass
    jam etiquette, so that isn't what this is, but, I'd
    probably:

    1. A fellow very loudly strums (not chops) his mandolin but does not know the chords to the songs, so that every other chord he plays is the wrong one.

    Try to concentrate and help everybody else stay in tune
    and in time.

    2. Two energetic harmonica players show up, stand right behind you, and proceed to play through everyone else's break.

    Try to move away from them and try to concentrate and
    help everybody else stay in tune and in time.

    3. A real good Tony Rice-style guitar player takes a break, but the other half dozen or so guitar players keep strumming their guitars real loud, so loud that no one can hear the neat guitar break.

    Be thankful and wonder why a guitar player of that
    calibre is jamming with inconsiderates that won't back
    off and listen.

    4. Someone starts playing the tambourine.

    See the answer to 1. above.

    JUst asking.
    Mind you, this is only good for so long, and if things didn't improve, I'd likely be one of the ones to make an excuse and put it in the case.

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    Registered User Eric F.'s Avatar
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    So, are you guys suggesting I should NOT have shown up with my Sousaphone?

  18. #18

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    I've never been kicked out, but I've had to chew an arm off 4 or 5 times. Just last Thursday as a matter of fact.
    Clyde Clevenger
    Salem, Oregon
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    Just my opinion, but it's right.

  19. #19

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    Okay, maybe I am the Bluegrass Police. If a jam is advertized as a Bluegrass Jam, then it should be. I've kicked a few people out of my jams, but never for skill level, or even bad playing or singing. Rudness, "All Me All The Time" any instrument. I always announce, several times, that if you can't hear the singer/lead player YOU are playing too loud. I always try to educate before I boot them. One year at Wintergrass we had a group of Texas Style Fiddlers try to take over our jam, we had a very good room, Band Services. They were rude, mean-spirited A--holes. I splained it to them, they were almost ready to fight, but there were only five of them, and they were fiddle players. I'm not on their Christmas list.
    Clyde Clevenger
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    Just my opinion, but it's right.

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    This weekend I attended the Nevada Old Time Fiddle contest in Wells, NV. My daughter entered in the contest for the OT Fiddle Nevada championship, junior division. (She won 1st place).

    There are a jam session the night before and this wierd lady from California brought up her three kids. The oldest daughter (about 11 yrs old) played the mandolin, the middle son (9 yrs old) played the tenor guitar and the youngest daughter (7 yrs old) played the fiddle. Well, instead of joining in the jam, they must of thought it was "open mike" night and proceeded to play and sing "Faded Love." This lasted atleast 5-10 minutes. When they finally finished, the mother asked it they could 'play another." However, they were politely told one song per customer. They sat down and didn't join the regular jam session.

    Now there were a couple of other people who came up the mike to play duets or start off the lead, but the whole jam group was able to join in.

    Since this was a OT fiddle jam , I can understand why this trio was asked to leave. Is this the type of stuff allowed at a Bluegrass jam? I thought a jam session is where everyone plays a song that is picked by each person in the circle as it is passed around the group. Not coming up to the mike to perform in front of the audience. Seems this in not proper jam ediquette.

    Any comments?
    Glenn Nelson
    Las Vegas, NV

    "Every day brings a chance for you to draw in a breath, kick off your shoes and play your mandolin."

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    Quote Originally Posted by (gnelson651 @ June 23 2005, 07:03)
    Any comments?
    Yeah. Congratulations on your daughter winning the contest. That's awesome.
    J. Mark Lane
    Stanley #10 F5
    Pomeroy #72 F4
    Brian Dean #30 Bowlback

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    Well, not kicked out - but I did make every one groan real load. I had to (really, really had to) take a phone call. I tried to ignore the call, but when I saw the number I KNEW I had to answer.

    ... did I mention it was my turn, my tune and people were following me ? Geez.

    Its OK, I go back.

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    What actually happens is the jam leaves you. If you look up and everybody has gone somewhere else, maybe somebody has made a big bluegrass faux paux. RaveOn

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    Never been kicked out - actually haven't been to that many jams. What do you think about repeatedly passing on breaks? I can keep pretty good rythym but improvising on songs I don't know isn't something I feel comfortable doing in public. Do you think this would be grounds for expulsion?

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    Passing on breaks is fine. Eventually, you should work up the nerve to take them. I always take a break, even on a fiddle tune I don't know. I can usually pull it off, but these are jams, not praticed performances. Some jams can be painfull with just too much banging away on instruments. A good jam can be a blast. If you can hear a guitar break in a jam with a bunch of mandos, fiddles, and maybe even one of them banjo things, people are doing something right. I must admit that I get a bit bent if someone calls out a beatles or john denver song at a bg jam (Hank is not just tolerated, he's required as far as I'm concerned, can you say "Blue and Lonesome?"), but I remind myself that we're there to make music. If people are making music, why complain?

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