Fiddle players and mandolin.

[Mark Miller]

I also fear the fiddle. Both because I love it and because I am a mediocre musician who takes a long time to learn anything. I can't imagine what horrifying nether-dimensional Lovecraftian creature would be summoned if I tried.

[Jack Roberts]

A few years back I was impressed by a local violin player who did an excellent job playing mandolin. I decided to trade an unused mandolin for a beat up old fiddle. I now play them both, but I only play the mandolin in public. Learning violin takes a whole lifetime as there are so many things to learn and techniques to perfect. But it is not the destination, but the journey that matters.

[T.D.Nydn]

No problem getting volume on a fiddle though!..

[Mandobart]

...Learning violin takes a whole lifetime as there are so many things to learn and techniques to perfect. But it is not the destination, but the journey that matters.

Learning everything we learn takes a lifetime if we never stop learning. Just remember there are preschool and elementary school children learning violin all around the world. Everything we learn takes a lifetime, but it realistically only takes a few years to learn violin well enough to play in public.

[JeffD]

Learning everything we learn takes a lifetime if we never stop learning. Just remember there are preschool and elementary school children learning violin all around the world. Everything we learn takes a lifetime, but it realistically only takes a few years to learn violin well enough to play in public.

I think fiddle in particular is difficult in public because the general population has been fed on the best of the best of the best violins in the world, and have unreasonable expectations. Not true, for example, with guitar, where everyone has or knows a kid with an acoustic and has heard the guitar played at all levels.

And nobody (mostly) has heard the mandolin.

[GDCB]

as a violist, i got the short end of two sticks trying to find a mandola I could afford and trying to learn an even more obscure and hated instrument.
it's a good thing I settled on a mandolin

[catmandu2]

I think fiddle in particular is difficult in public because the general population has been fed on the best of the best of the best violins in the world, and have unreasonable expectations. Not true, for example, with guitar, where everyone has or knows a kid with an acoustic and has heard the guitar played at all levels.

Fwiw, just the opposite for me: even having 2-3 decades into guitar study, I was much more inhibited in gtr performance than I ever was with fiddle; I think it has to do with the repertoire - I would often be tense with the Bach and classical repertoire, whereas fiddling is fiddling and I'm just not tense with it (or mndln or banjo) - even though I've only half the experience with it -

Among the reasons - I was typically concerned or dissatisfied with the guitar's projection in performance; fiddle doesn't have that problem.

[CES]

Randi, I totally agree. I wish I'd gotten into guitar or mando when I was a kid, and really wish my mom had made me take piano lessons. But, money was tight, and I was so sports obsessed I'm sure it was a battle not worth fighting...

[HonketyHank]

My first fiddle is stashed somewhere here in my cave. It is also my only fiddle. I am not even sure where it is. Thank goodness. Bought it. Tried it. Put it back in its case. Stashed it.

I learned something profound from the experience -- proper appreciation of a good fiddle player.

[Jim Garber]

I picked up mandolin and fiddle at about the same time. Prior to that I played guitar but mandolin made it easier to know the left hand notes with the picking and was a perfect intermediary between guitar and fiddle. I have pretty much been playing both for over 40 years.

[Bonniej]

I'm loving these conversations. You guys are hilarious. But seriously, I do think I want to try the fiddle. 🎻I'm not very good at mandolin or guitar but why let that hold me back. It takes a lot of confidence to continue playing as badly as I do. 😏

[F-2 Dave]

Go for it Bonnie. I'm not a great fiddle player, but I'm decent. I can hear what I'd like for it to sound like in my head. Most of the time it doesn't sound like that in reality, but once in a while, when it does, it's pretty sweet.

[Bonniej]

Thanks for the encouragement Dave. I am going to give it a try. The music store where I play jams and take my Mando lesson has over 300 fiddles for sale. I may have some questions for you when I get ready - will prob have to wait till mid summer or fall.
Bonnie

[A 4]

I played violin for a year in 4th grade, and then two years ago picked it up again, maybe some 40 years later. We got a freebie from a friend cleaning out his mom's house, and then I got my 4th grade fiddle back, since it has been bouncing around the family ever since.

Fiddle is super fun, and I love it and am terrible. What I recently figured out is that when I move from mandolin to fiddle, I think I lose every element of musicality:
Intonation is wonky
Tone is a crapshoot
Timing is irregular
Tempo tends to get faster and faster
Tension in both left and right hands is higher
Little control over dynamics
Coordination between left and right hands disappears
Concentrating too hard to hear other players
Lack of subtlety
My dog moans and howls when I play

Have I left any out? I probably lost those, too. So it is horrible and I am having a great time. I could just play drones all day. I am trying to work those elements back in - I am thinking of a couple of violin lessons to get some work on the basics.

[Tobin]

Learning violin takes a whole lifetime as there are so many things to learn and techniques to perfect.

Learning the violin may indeed take a lifetime, but fortunately, learning the fiddle only takes a couple of years.

I guess it really depends on what genre you want to play, and what style or sound you're after. I've been hacking away at the fiddle for close to two years now. Not full time, of course, since I still split my limited music time between banjo, fiddle, and other instruments. But I think I'm finally somewhat comfortable in controlling my intonation well enough for it to sound like music instead of a cat being tortured. I love playing the types of fiddle tunes that rely heavily on drones and double-stops. I almost never play on a single string.

Now that I'm fairly comfortable playing the fiddle, I'm turning my attention toward the finer aspects of bowing: directional choices (tons of shuffle patterns), as well as nuances like pulsing. That will probably take another 2-3 years to get where I want it. But I really just want to be able to play Old-Time fiddle tunes in the rustic manner of Old-Time music. Thankfully, I'm not at all interested in sounding like a classical violinist. That would indeed take a lifetime, of which I've already squandered more than half.

[farmerjones]

I'm loving these conversations. You guys are hilarious. But seriously, I do think I want to try the fiddle. ��I'm not very good at mandolin or guitar but why let that hold me back. It takes a lot of confidence to continue playing as badly as I do. ��

Oh, you gotta try it! Because one never knows. You could have the "knack."
I play fiddle because I'm bulldog stubborn. I had the time and I just didn't know when to give up. The issue with frets: Frets are like lines in a coloring book. I always liked blank sheets of paper instead. Best of Luck

[CHASAX]

Picked up a fiddle early last year. Love it. I get excited simply practicing.
Now facing my 5th shoulder surgery. My bowing arm is a wreck. A huge man ran be down on a ski slope in 1996.
Bowing is sometimes very painful. Wish I had started when I was six, not sixty something.

Got my mandolin back out.

They are very different instruments to me. Mandolins are prettier.

[JeffD]

Something else. Having played mandolin and been in the music self made music community for so many years, I knew how a fiddle should sound. So when I decided to take it up, it was very hard to have patience with myself, because I knew very specifically how bad I sounded.

I started mandolin well before I knew what I was supposed to sound like, and so I just enjoyed whatever progress I made.

[dhergert]

When I was in 3rd and 4th grade I played violin with the school orchestra. I really enjoyed it and I guess I was pretty good at it. I got promoted to 1st chair by the first half of the first year. During the 2nd year the director was having me do solos.

Then, at the beginning of the 5th grade, somehow the director discovered I wasn't reading music, that in fact I couldn't read music, and that I was memorizing everything I was playing by ear. At that point, he told me if I wanted to continue playing I had to learn to read music. Shortly after that I dropped the violin.

I've had a lot of musical experiences since then, including playing recorder, harmonica, saw, bass, flute, piccolo, banjo, mandolin, Dobro. Including being in a number of bands.

Currently we have a great fiddle player in our main band, who also plays classical violin and piano, along with a little guitar and Dobro, and recently some mandolin... And I love the sound of her playing fiddle and violin...

But for myself, I haven't had any temptation at all to play violin again, or fiddle. No interest in the instrument in the least. I'm not sure why.

[catmandu2]

Something else. Having played mandolin and been in the music self made music community for so many years, I knew how a fiddle should sound. So when I decided to take it up, it was very hard to have patience with myself, because I knew very specifically how bad I sounded.

I started mandolin well before I knew what I was supposed to sound like, and so I just enjoyed whatever progress I made.

Well ya there's no question fiddle/vn technique is a bit more complicated/requires some technical proficiency before sonority will ensue. I recently had a similar discourse - in conversing over melodeons, which are an instrument that do much of that work itself. Bowed strings, winds, et al (even fretted strings, compared with accordians) - all require a significant amount of technical achievement (e.g., learning to fret a note, etc) before a good sound will emerge.

[DougC]

...I should have been more dedicated to music! That sums it up for me. And the 'kids' had more violin lessons at an early age, meaning that they know a lot more than I did at that age or even my current age. Ha, ha. Now I am dedicated to music and I have little patience for musical 'slackers'. No excuses guys. I used to be one and I know what I'm talking about!

[UsuallyPickin]

A bow is not a pick is one of my mantras as I play my fiddle ....... and anyone that ever paid for a violin bow probably won't blanche at the price of a Blue Chip pick. Just sayin .... R/

[foldedpath]

When I was in 3rd and 4th grade I played violin with the school orchestra. I really enjoyed it and I guess I was pretty good at it. I got promoted to 1st chair by the first half of the first year. During the 2nd year the director was having me do solos.

Then, at the beginning of the 5th grade, somehow the director discovered I wasn't reading music, that in fact I couldn't read music, and that I was memorizing everything I was playing by ear. At that point, he told me if I wanted to continue playing I had to learn to read music. Shortly after that I dropped the violin.

Okay, if we're talking fiddle fails... I had a year-long episode that didn't work out. I was force-fed piano for 6 years as a child, but by the time I entered Junior High School, all I wanted to do was play drums. My hero at the time was Joe Morello from the Dave Brubeck Quartet (a clue to how old I am... yeesh!), but that was soon followed by Ginger Baker a few years later.

Anyway, I enrolled in the school orchestra because as a proto-hippy I had zero interest in marching band. The orchestra director sat me next to a piano while he played intervals, and asked me to identify them. He then said I had "too good an ear to play drums," and all the percussion positions were taken anyway. However, there was an opening in the... viola section.

Ewww. But at least it was a school activity playing music instead of sports, so I went with it. My parents rented me a viola, hired a private teacher on the side, and I spent a year playing viola in the Junior High orchestra. I got to the point where I was required to do a solo performance of a piece for my "home room" at school, which was mortifying, but I got through it somehow. A solid year on viola. All the while wanting to play drums instead.

After that year, and a change of school for other reasons, I finally whined and cajoled my parents enough to get my first drums. I had been playing a cousin's red Slingerlands on the side, but I finally scored a nice silver metalflake set of Ludwigs... eventually expanded with floor tom, chrome snare and a bunch of Paiste cymbals. It wasn't long before I was playing in local garage Rock bands. Mostly in my parents' garage so I didn't have to schlep the drums. I played drums in several local bands for 6 years, and only quit because I went out of state to school, and started to get jobs traveling as a commercial photographer. Kit drums just didn't fit a lifestyle without a steady home base. I eventually moved to guitar as a more portable instrument and ended up playing that for 30-odd years, before discovering mandolin about 10 years ago.

A teensy tiny bit of the viola experience remains. I can pick up a bow and make noises that don't sound entirely like stepping on the cat with my S.O.'s fiddle. But with one good fiddler in the house already, I've never felt a strong desire to play "second fiddle." I enjoy backing my S.O. and her fiddle on guitar, or playing unison melody on mandolin. Lately I've added a bit of Irish flute to get into a similar volume and sustain ballpark as fiddle, So I'm happy with what I'm playing now. Besides, this area where I live now is crawling with fiddlers. Playing mandolin and flute is something different, and I've always liked being different.

I miss that set of Ludwig drums though.... wish I had kept them.

[sblock]

Perhaps I should get a fiddle just to further my life goal to suck at as many instruments as possible. So far: mandolin, acoustic guitar, electric guitar, electric bass, ukulele, lap steel, dobro, pedal steel, harmonica, so why not violin?

So why don't you want to suck at banjo?

[Mandobar]

I started taking fiddle lessons in the Fall. I have to say, it's been an education. I can understand how some folks would bail right away, but I think I've gotten to the point where I feel like I am a decent enough player to go into the local shop here and play some fiddles. Still got a ways to go, but it's a process.

While the left hand is willing, the right hand has a long way to go wielding that stick.