Looking for tips on refretting

**HogTime** · Feb-19-2017, 8:39pm

Going to refret my F5 I built 4 years ago from a kit. Not because of the minor fret wear, but because I think I'd like larger frets better. My kit came with 25X50 wire. After being a bit agressive on the leveling, I'm finding it hard to get a clean note sometimes. My weak hands don't press down hard enough, I guess.

I have a Collings MT with 43X80 wire that plays easier. So, I'm going with 43X80 EVO. I have small hands, so I'm not worried about less space between frets.

Have a few questions:
1) Frank Ford's site mentions using a soldering iron to heat the fret up before pulling it out. I didn't glue mine in. Do you think that heating would be necessary in my case?
2) My fretboard has 0.024 slots. Is pulling the old frets out likely to make them much bigger? FW43080 wire calls for a 0.023 slot.
3) When I put my initial frets in, I did it before installing the fretboard on the neck. Any precautions on hammering in the frets with the fretboard on the neck? FYI, I have the end of my fretboard scooped.
4) If I buy wire that is radiused, will that cause any major problems in installing it in my flat fretboard?

I know I'll need to install a new nut, but need to anyway because I didn't get good spacing on the first one.

Any other advice on not messing things up?

Thanks,

**Nevin** · Feb-19-2017, 9:06pm

Ok, there others here with more experience but I will take a shot at it to start

1) Depending on the wood in the fret board, heating can help even when the frets are not glued in. The natural oils in the wood can help lubricate the process. If you are careful, pulling the old frets should not greatly widen the slot.

2)I think the difference between 0.023 and 0.024" is negligible but others may disagree.

3) you will want to fully support the neck on sand bags, bags of shot or other shock absorbing surface. If your re-fret extends over the body you may want to consider other methods than hammering such as pressing or gluing. Working over the body is difficult. If the fret board is elevated you may be able to put a support under the fret board. If not, internal supports can be made but it is difficult.

4) Unless the radius is extreme on the wire I would not anticipate a problem.

**AndyPanda** · Feb-19-2017, 9:26pm

This is just my 2 cents worth - and bear in mind that I'm new to mandolin (but I've done refrets on guitars and basses for years). Before you pull out the old frets - as long as you plan to refret anyway, this is the perfect opportunity to experiment without any risk. Worst case is you get to practice your crowning skills on your old frets - best case is you save the cost of a refret.

I use a special 3 corner file that I've ground down the corner to be round and smooth - that allows me to file the sides of the frets without digging into the fretboard (though I still lay down masking tape so I'm not rubbing the wood). I much prefer this method to using a shaped crowning file - but it means you have to use your eyes and skills to shape the crown of the fret.

Now .. normally you would shape the crown rounded like the frets were originally - but I have found on instruments that have been leveled too many times, I can file them with more of a triangle shape. They will wear faster, but I absolutely love the way they feel. And at least one company sells triangle crowned frets for big $$ and touts many advantages to it.

In this crude drawing, on the left is a virgin fret, in the middle is what they look like after you've leveled them if you didn't do a real good crown (maybe just polished them up with fine wet or dry?) --- not saying that's what you did, but many people do

On the right is what I have done on my own instruments that needed a refret (as an experiment) and it felt so good that I ended up not doing a refret at all. The picture is exaggerated - it's more of a rounded top and not a point but it does have steep sides which let you fret with less pressure.

Click image for larger version.

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**Marty Jacobson** · Feb-19-2017, 11:00pm

Also, dialing in the action will make frets which are nearly nonexistent fret with essentially no effort. If the action is more than a whisker (.1mm or .004") at the nut, it will feel hard to play. I.e., a piece of paper should slide between the first fret and the string, but certainly not a business card.

**mirwa** · Feb-20-2017, 2:31am

I have some tutorials linked in my signature, defretting and refretting are some of them

Here is a quicker link directly to them

http://www.mirwa.com.au/HTS_Defret_a_Guitar.html

http://www.mirwa.com.au/HTS_Refret.html

Steve

**HogTime** · Feb-21-2017, 2:02pm

Thanks for the tips! Especially the links to the good info at the mirwa website.

As far as action at 1st fret, I'm within reason. However, my Collings MT is definitely lower I'm going to tweak my setup before I proceed with refretting.

**billhay4** · Feb-21-2017, 2:17pm

I'm going to tweak my setup before I proceed with refretting.

Not sure I understand this. Re-fretting will inevitably change your setup.
Bill

**Folkmusician.com** · Feb-21-2017, 5:22pm

Have a few questions:
1) Frank Ford's site mentions using a soldering iron to heat the fret up before pulling it out. I didn't glue mine in. Do you think that heating would be necessary in my case?

Necessary, maybe not, but likely still beneficial. It will help protect the wood.

2) My fretboard has 0.024 slots. Is pulling the old frets out likely to make them much bigger? FW43080 wire calls for a 0.023 slot.

It may, but you are more concerned with it being one thousandth off to begin with. You really want to go slot by slot and make sure each fret is just right. Adjust the tang as needed.

3) When I put my initial frets in, I did it before installing the fretboard on the neck. Any precautions on hammering in the frets with the fretboard on the neck? FYI, I have the end of my fretboard scooped.

Just be more careful.

4) If I buy wire that is radiused, will that cause any major problems in installing it in my flat fretboard?

You want to over radius your fret wire for a flat fingerboard. Odds are it will uncoil somewhere around the right radius for a installing into a flat board. This is a benefit.

I also like to do an ever so slight overdone at the ends of the frets before installing them.

Any other advice on not messing things up?

Back up to number two. Pay extra attention to each individual fret slot and the fit of the fret. Get this right and you will have a great basis to level and dress. Get it wrong and things will move later, and it will mess with the fingerboard as far as relief and twists down the road.