Quartetti Classici

[vkioulaphides]

If I may plagiarize my own post from the Orchestra Seating thread:

As of last week, I have completed and shipped to the untiring Mr. T my first quartet for plucked instruments: a Quartetto Classico subtitled " Le Clavecin", as the sonority it emulates is that of the entire ensemble coalescing into one, grand harpsichord— with the obligatory, neoclassical homage to Messrs. Couperin and Scarlatti, my two idols of the plucky keyboard.

I had such a jolly time writing this, I am tempted to write a whole set of them! I would, however, like to know more about this most attractive medium/genre: What are its origins? (I suspect names like Embergher, Ranieri, etc. will crop up.) What works are in the "standard repertoire" for it? What more recent works do you know for this instrumentation? Are you aware of any recordings available?

I would like, if possible, to steer clear of the "plucked Haydn" commonplace; while I certainly have no objection to performing the music of such a great master as Haydn on such lovely instruments as the mandolin and its family, my focus of interest is original compositions for quartetto classico.

[margora]

Victor, please do write a set of pieces for quartetto classico! And when you are finished with that please write more pieces for mandolin and guitar! And maybe a sonata for solo mandolin OR (alto) mandola!
BTW, I had the pleasure last summer of playing the first mandolin part from a movement of one of Hadyn's string quartets at AMGUSS. Tremendous fun.

[Alex Timmerman]

Hello Victor,

Your Quartetto Classico has arrived today and all the four mouvements look absolutely great. What a nice surprice!

I think that it's about 3/4 of a century ago that music, originally written for this combination - two mandolins, a mandoliola and a mandoloncello - was composed.
I hope we (The Embergher Quartet) can come together this week and play it through.

You'll be informed!


Many thanks and greetings,

Alex

Photo ©: A Classical Mandolin Quartet with Orchestra model N.1 instruments of the Mandolin Family made by Luigi Embergher.

[Alex Timmerman]

Although it could well have been possible that Sivio Ranieri made Radio recordings with his Mandolin Quartet, I haven't heared any (old) Quartetto Classico recordings at all.
I'm pretty sure there aren't an awful lot of original works for this quartet combination as Embergher, Burdisso, Ranieri and others seemed to have been more concerned with the idea to create a quartet with which it was possible to perform the entire string-quartet repertoire.
But I'll see what I have more in my music and files for this particular combination of instruments.

An image of the Burdisso Classical Mandolin Quartet is found here.#
A third quartet that can be mentioned here was lead by the great Belgian mandolin virtuoso Frans De Groodt and named the "Antwerps Plectrum Kwartet" .


Best,

Alex

Internet floating photo: Ranieri's Classical Mandolin Quartet. (See also photo in: "Geschiedenis van de mandoline" by Robert Janssen, last page).

[vkioulaphides]

As you all know, I am hardly a purist and would never object to the noble intention of playing some of the gems from the (bowed) string quartet repertoire on plucked instruments. But...

In playing such repertoire, the crux of the issue seems to shift from "how to pick to the best effect" to "how to best approximate the bowed effect"— a circuitous approach to excellence in performance. Sometimes the result may be satisfactory (and I certainly do not doubt that Ranieri played up a storm!); sometimes, not quite.

Part of the motivation behind my quartet "Le Clavecin" was to write a piece totally idiomatic to plucked instruments, one fitting their peculiarities like a glove. I hope it is no offense to modesty to simply say that my quartet would be as awkward to play on bowed instruments as Beethoven's "Razumovsky" Quartets would be on mandolins. I make, of course, no other, qualitative comparison.

Which, it turn, brings me to my second of two, major concerns:

The (bowed) string quartet stands on a curious, "triple nexus": it is a medium, a genre, and a form. Past the continuum of Haydn-Mozart-Beethoven it has been, to say the very least, a problematic creative landscape for most, a cause of many headaches, even for the greatest post-Beethoven composers. I need not go into a tedious lecture on that here, though; suffice it to say that the quartet has been plagued by a dreadful cloud of (unnecessary, I think) gravitas hovering over it.

That need not be! The quartet stills bears Haydn's indelible, unmistakeable stamp of conversational exchange, good cheer, musical humor, and so much more! Yet, for reasons far too complicated to belabor here, it has been made into some kind of academic rite-of-passage. Bah! say I...

The goal of my quartet has been twofold: A. idiomatic use of picked instruments, and B. a cheerful piece of music for players and listeners alike to simply enjoy. I have no higher ambitions, make no other pretenses, and, most importantly, hope Alex and his colleagues agree.

Cheers to all!

[Jim Garber]

A Classical Mandolin Quartet with Orchestra model N.1 instruments of the Mandolin Family made by Luigi Embergher.

Just curious, Alex. Are the Embergher orchestra instruments preferable for a quartet as opposed to the soloist models? Is it a question of producing a nice blending of sound?

Jim

[Martin Jonas]

Speaking of mandolin ensemble arrangements, I had the great pleasure of playing (or trying to play) three of Alison Stephens' ensemble arrangements during last weekend's BMG Summer School in Burton on the Wirral. These included a quartetto romantico arrangement of a lovely Manos Hadjidakis theme (doubling up each part, as we weren't really good enough to see the arrangement through otherwise). I guess I was doubly lucky that I was playing the (octave) mandola part in it: firstly in that it was the only part that I was actually able to play from the sheet reasonably well and secondly in that Alison let me play it on her Pecoraro mandola.

That was my first chance of playing in an ensemble, and I think I want to do more of it! I need to work on my timing and counting, though; playing on my own hasn't given me enough incentive to improve it and it did rather show. As there were two members of a local ensemble, the Wirral Mandoliers, on the course as well and they have invited me to join, I might get more of an opportunity in future.

Martin
(sorry for the topic drift -- no mandocello around to make it a quartetto classico).

[Daymando]

So we have the quartetto classico ("two mandolins, mandoliola/alto mandola, and mandoloncello/mando-cello", per Eugene) and the quartetto romantico ("two mandolins, mandola a sol/octave mandolin, and guitar", ibid); what is the (quasi?) official designation of a quintet which combines these two quartet members' key elements, namely M1, M2, MA, MC & Gtr.?

Such is the composition of the Miami Valley Mandolin Quintet; either tag seems applicable.

(I call them Quintetto Fabuloso for lack of a better label - probably to the cringe of the purists among us.) #

-Allen.

[Jim Garber]

what is the (quasi?) official designation of a quintet which combines these two quartet members' key elements, namely M1, M2, MA, MC & Gtr.?

Such is the composition of the Miami Valley Mandolin Quintet; either tag seems applicable.

Allen:
I would think that the MC and the gtr would get in each other's way. Then again, if they are fine musicians, they can probably work it out. What is their repertoire or do they adapt quartet repertoire to the quintet?

Jim

[vkioulaphides]

Well, nomenclature aside, I would imagine that the actual sonority of such an ensemble would be like a "mini mandolin/guitar orchestra"— nothing wrong with that, of course. Schubert's Octet, Beethoven's Septet, Hummel's, Dvorak's, et al. serenades, notturni, cassations and all such groups combining instruments of different families tend to sound like orchestras in miniature, for lack of a better term. I would love to hear the group you describe, Allen! Is there a way?

But the quintessential priorities of the quartet qua quartet —hmm... that sounds like a duck-call — run against the chordal abilities of the guitar or, for that matter, anything but four, individual voices. That troubled Brahms, who strove to "fill in" the texture with rich double-stops; he seems to have been more at home in his Sextet textures (again, an unwitting alliteration). Franck maxed out in this direction, with his profuse, abundant, torrential use of double-stopping; again, contrary to the individuality of true, independent voices.

But I do not wish to sound negative; there is much great music by many, great composers. My point of departure (and, frankly, ignorance) is a literature, in current existence or dormant in minds as deranged as mine, expressly for the quartetto classico instrumentation.

[Daymando]

I would think that the MC and the gtr would get in each other's way. Then #again, if they are fine musicians, they can probably work it out. What is their repertoire or do they adapt quartet repertoire to the quintet?

Ah, that's the beauty of effective orchestration. # #

Since we have no "legitimate" (read: specifically-composed-for) quintet music for this configuration (as yet), I've arranged our initial library to suit our needs: Ragtime/Old-Tyme, Baroque, Classical, Romantic, etc. Depending on the piece, the MC assumes either the role of baritone or bass, with Gtr presenting either baritone, bass or rhythm; occassionally the blending of the two provides for some very beautifully-lush undergrowth above which the Ms/MA flourish. For example, Scott Joplin's "Pineapple Rag" has the MC on bass w/Gtr on baritone; Mozart's "Serenade in G" has Gtr doubling as basso continuo; Alexander Maloof's "Egyptian Glide" and Leroy Anderson's "Blue Tango" has Gtr in a rhythm mode.

I'm not sure, as yet, just how we'll handle Mozart's String Quartet in Bb (aka "The Hunt"; K 458), which we'd been considering while our Guitarist was out on broken-wrist leave. Probably will just leave it at MQ a4 and let our Gtr do a little soft-shoe shuffle. #

-Ar.

[Daymando]

Well, nomenclature aside, I would imagine that the actual #sonority of such an ensemble would be like a "mini mandolin/guitar orchestra"— (...). I would love to hear the group you describe, Allen! Is there a way?

We haven't any recordings to date, Victor, though it's on the mind as a possibility in the not-too-terribly-distant future.

However, MVMQ will be performing at the First-Annual Midwest Mandolin Festival on Saturday, 11 June 2005, at 4 PM. We'd be very honored to have you attend! (The festival itself runs 11-6ish; see the Mandolin Society of Central Indiana website for more information about MMF 2005.)

-Ar.

[vkioulaphides]

Oh, some day, some day, when the rat-race abates... Thanks for the open invitation; if/when there is a soundbyte or two you can post on the net, please do so!

If I may make a suggestion for exploratory readings by your group: you may consider some of Boccherini's chamber music with guitar and (originally bowed) strings; in fact, I would imagine that these works would actually sound BETTER than originally conceived, if the instruments joining the guitar are plucked! Just a thought...

Cheers,

Victor

[vkioulaphides]

While my mind is on this track... you may also want to try the string quartets of Cherubini and Arriaga; while, of course, they do not have a guitar part, their harmonic rhythm is so clear and so regular that providing them with a simple, chordal guitar part would be no problem. As for the (mando)cello part, it would hardly get in the way, as it is fairly rudimentary in the original. Obviously, I would not overload the bass-line by constantly doubling MC and guitar; perhaps chords unfolding in figuration above the bass-line, as laid down by the MC. Another idea...

[Bob A]

Oh. yes, Boccherini, and that wonderful quintet recapping the night sounds of Madrid. Instead of playing the violins and cellos to sound like a chitarre, how more appropriate to go for the real plucked thing? I really do love that piece, even if the cello gets the best part.

To venture even further up a feeder creek, and address mandola tonality, I was struck by the fact that, when playing alongside a cello, my Gibson mandolin and mandola seemed to fit so much better than a bowlback, precisely because of the bassier, more fundamental tonality of those "lumberyards, painted like prostitutes".

And speaking of creeks, the Gibsons are much more paddle-like; an appropriate note on which to depart.

[Jonathan]

Allen - A perfect piece for your quintet would be the Quartet from Verdi's "Rigoletto" which I'm almost finished arranging for the BMQ. It is sung by two sopranos, tenor and baritone with a fairly simple orchestral accompaniment that lends itself very well to guitar. In the quartet version I'm having to leave out some of the baritone lines (especially when doubled in the accompaniment) or incorporate them via double-stopping, but with a mandocello available - no problemo! Maybe I can send you a slightly modified version for quintet when I'm done.

In general I get the most satisfaction arranging orchestral music from full score for my quartet. I love the challenge of including as much of the orchestral texture as possible while writing idiomatic parts that lay well on the instruments. A fifth voice would expand the possibilities tremendously. So get hold of some orchestra scores and have at it!

Jonathan J.

[vkioulaphides]

[QUOTE]"...I get the most satisfaction arranging orchestral music from full score for my quartet."

...and Jonathan's masterful arrangement of Strauss' Künstlerleben, as heard on the BMQ's recording, bears witness to his ability to also deliver satisfaction!

Yes, orchestra-to-quintet might well be the best conduit; I must, however, also agree with Bob: Boccherini's quintet would be p-e-r-f-e-c-t on an ALL-plucked ensemble.

[vkioulaphides]

In fact, Alex is ahead of us in this: his arrangements of Boccherini must be, I trust, top-quality; I don't know, however, whether he is willing/able to share. He must have added a contrabass line for the chitarrone but, other than that, the Consort's instrumentation and yours, Allen, are basically the same.

[Daymando]

Allen - A perfect piece for your quintet would be the Quartet from Verdi's "Rigoletto" which I'm almost finished arranging for the BMQ. It is sung by two sopranos, tenor and baritone with a fairly simple orchestral accompaniment that lends itself very well to guitar. #In the quartet version I'm having to leave out some of the baritone lines (especially when doubled in the accompaniment) or incorporate them via double-stopping, but with a mandocello available - no problemo! #Maybe I can send you a slightly modified version for quintet when I'm done.

That would be swell, Jonathan! One of my compositional weaknesses is in the realm of the guitar (though it strengthens with each new work); to be able to study your setting would, no doubt, give good insight to me - and Verdi's always enjoyable.

In general I get the most satisfaction arranging orchestral music from full score for my quartet. I love the challenge of including as much of the orchestral texture as possible while writing idiomatic parts that lay well on the instruments. A fifth voice would expand the possibilities tremendously. #So get hold of some orchestra scores and have at it!

Jonathan J.

Time, being the great equalizer, is the key there. # #I've a boatload of orchestra scores in my library and a stack on my worktable to consider. I've been toying with the idea of a reduction setting of the fourth movement of my third symphony for either MQ or MO, but I can't wrap my head around any other sonority than the principal A-flat -- the Muses are being stubborn in translating into plectrum-friendlier tonalities. #

-Ar.

[Daymando]

Oh, some day, some day, when the rat-race abates... Thanks for the open invitation; if/when there is a soundbyte or two you can post on the net, please do so!

I'll make a point of it, Victor. Thanks for the encouragement!

If I may make a suggestion for exploratory readings by your group: you may consider some of Boccherini's chamber music with guitar and (originally bowed) strings; in fact, I would imagine that these works would actually sound BETTER than originally conceived, if the instruments joining the guitar are plucked! Just a thought...

Cheers,
Victor

Boccherini's been a particular favorite of mine, though I need to re-introduce myself to his corpus -- beyond the unforgettable Minuet chestnut, I've done little with his literature since undergraduate work nearly a score ago (pardon the pun ); were I ever to actually develop my viola skills into such a state where they're tolerable to anyone other than the completely deaf, he'd be my principal performance composer of the late 1700s. Fortunately, though, my mandola skills are considerably stronger, though convincing my mandolist to trade me positions is a tough task (for obvious reasons). #

If you've some recommendations from Luigi's pen, I'd be pleased to know of them.

-Ar.

[Daymando]

In fact, Alex is ahead of us in this: his arrangements of Boccherini must be, I trust, top-quality; I don't know, however, whether he is willing/able to share. He must have added a contrabass line for the chitarrone but, other than that, the Consort's instrumentation and yours, Allen, are basically the same.

An interesting collection! I set Brahms' HR #3 just last week for DMO, and we have HR #5 already in hand. Britten's "Playful Pizz" is on my list of up-comings, as is Bach's Brandenburg 5 (though not included on Alex's list). We've enjoyed learning Johan Kok's "Don Armando" and "Rataplan", and I want to explore more of his literature. #

OH! I see Rossini!

Alex, would a copy of your arrangement of Barber of Seville overture be possible to acquire? That's another piece on my "set this" list, though I'm always an advocate of avoiding reinventing the wheel if others have already mastered what I may have in mind to do myself - setting this Rossini piece is one such "wheel".

-Ar.

[Alex Timmerman]

Hello all,

It wasn´t possible for me to post here because I was very busy with my music teaching activities the past two weeks. Student concerts and student exams, the normal school work etc. etc. made that there was simply no time to respond. I did however read the posts every evening and enjoyed them very much!

And as for the Boccherini, I do share your enthousiasm completely; fantastic music and absolutely wonderful to play!
Fortunately Frido, 1st guitarist and webmaster of Het CONSORT, helped me with finding the (live) recordings of the Boccherini compositions we played at our concerts a cople of years ago, and put them ´online´ for you. # #

Here you can hear Het CONSORT perform Boccherini´s Fandango arranged for Guitar and Mandolin Chamber Orchestra.
(at concerts we perform of course the whole 4 mouvement ´Fandango´ quintet).

I hope you like it!


Best,

Alex.

PS. The recording of Boccherini´s "Fandango" is copyrighted © by Het CONSORT / Alex Timmerman.

[Alex Timmerman]

A Classical Mandolin Quartet with Orchestra model N.1 instruments of the Mandolin Family made by Luigi Embergher.

Just curious, Alex. Are the Embergher orchestra instruments preferable for a quartet as opposed to the soloist models? Is it a question of producing a nice blending of sound?

Jim

Hello Jim,

Replying to your question I would say: No not necessarily preferable. All 5-bis soloist instruments, like seen on the photo of the Burdisso quartet, are generally regarded as the best Embergher instruments for professional players and also as simply wonderful for the eyes and ears.
But so would - for the same reasons - be a compleate quartet with for instance N. 3 Orchestra Embergher models.

For me however, any arrangement of Embergher types and/or models would be great as long as the sound quality of each instrument can cope with the others in the quartet. #

And than again, this morning we studied mandolin quartets using three different Embergher models and a Calace mandoloncello and it sounded just great. More on that I will post here tomorrow.


Best,

Alex

[Alex Timmerman]

Hello Ar./Daymando,

I´ll be happy to send you a copy of the Barber of Seville Overture set for Mandolin Orchestra. Just mail your post address and it will come to you by (normal) post.

Perhaps you can also ad a list of your arrangements. I am very interested.


Best,

Alex

[vkioulaphides]

Meanwhile, back at the ranch... ... my Quartetto Classico Nº 2 is already "fermenting": this morning I sketched the four movements.

The unifying, "thematic" principle of this set will be the various sonorities characteristic of this type of ensemble. The "theme" of Nº 1 was the blend of the four plucked instruments into one harpsichord-like sonority.

For Nº 2... well, for that, my friends, you will have to wait. Besides, I doubt that I will be able to complete this, even in manuscript, prior to our vacation. Let us see...