Neck dimensions?

[V70416]

I'm a slow learner. It took me years to figure out that,for my hands,a narrower and slimmer profile neck works best ie. mandolins like Loar-era snakesheads and the two actual Loar F5s I have ever played.

I have owned a handful of new mandolins; Nugget,Red Diamond,and Kimble. They all seemed to have chunkier/wider necks. Even a couple of
Gilchrists.

The one mandolin I have that has the narrow,thin dimensions(more violin-like?) that I prefer is a 1993 Carlson-signed
Gibson Monroe Model.

Which,if any,modern builders tend toward a more violin-like neck dimension? I have heard that R.L. Givens produced many of his mandolins with the smaller dimensions.

Wishing the fretboard/necks on a couple of my mandos could be reduced a bit.

Hope I posted in the proper area.

[Tobin]

As I recall, the Loar F5 necks had a 1-1/16" nut width. Most modern mandolins have standardized on a 1-1/8" nut, and the trend seems to be drifting wider to 1-3/16" due to the number of guitar players coming over to mandolin and complaining that it's too narrow.

Of course, there's more to it than just nut width. The neck profile itself makes a big difference, from round like a baseball bat to a sharp V-neck shape.

Like you, I prefer a narrower neck and a slim neck profile. I don't mind a bit of a V-shape that matches the angle of the side of my thumb, but I have a hard time playing an overly rounded neck. And too sharp of a V-shape isn't comfortable either. I played a bunch of different models before I found my Ellis F5, which seemed to be the perfect profile for comfort. The nut is 1-1/8" wide. Photo of the neck profile is below.

Can you be a bit more specific in terms of actual dimensions or profiles you're looking for?

[pops1]

Depth is also a consideration, whether it be C shaped or V shaped how deep is it. I prefer a neck that is not deep, I can play either a V or C, but don't want it deep. The Gibson A40 has a great tiny neck that is 1 3/16" wide, but because it is very shallow is very comfortable and I don't notice the extra width. I have another 1 3/16" inch neck that is much deeper and I notice the width much more. My main mandolin is 1 1/8" and shallow C. I have come to feel that the depth of the neck has more to do with the comfort of playing than the width, or at least as much.

[Steve Sorensen]

I love building the 1" to 1-1/16" necks with the delicate rounded V profile -- just seems right.

Steve

[Shelagh Moore]

The Daley A model I used to have had a rather narrow neck.

[Tavy]

Most mandolin necks are pretty consistent in terms of neck depth IMO: about 20mm for mandolins with truss rods (or CF inserts). The deeper ones tend to be on early Gibsons with no truss rod, and are about 25mm or more deep. Nut widths on the other hand are all over the place As for profile, as others have said a rounded-V seems to be best, try and do a C or U shape on a neck as narrow as a mandolin's and it automatically turns into a club!

[pops1]

Most mandolin necks are pretty consistent in terms of neck depth IMO: about 20mm for mandolins with truss rods (or CF inserts). The deeper ones tend to be on early Gibsons with no truss rod, and are about 25mm or more deep. Nut widths on the other hand are all over the place As for profile, as others have said a rounded-V seems to be best, try and do a C or U shape on a neck as narrow as a mandolin's and it automatically turns into a club!

I have at least 3 mandolins with 1 1/8" neck and the depth is different by as much a 1/8" or more. A big difference if feeling when playing a neck that is shallower.

[Stevo75]

Yeah, I agree with pops1 and the OP. I've learned the hard way that it's the depth of the neck that's more important to me than the shape of the neck profile (C or V). I bought a new Silverangel and had to sell it because it hurt my finger joints. I think the depth at the first fret was just around 3/4". My other mandolin is around 13/16 or maybe 7/8 and it makes a really big difference. According to the website, Collings neck is around 0.89" which is just over 7/8". It might not sound like a lot but I can tell immediately. It might not matter for other people though. Everyone is different with the size, shape, and mechanics of their hands.

I'm looking for a new mandolin and I've been told the old Flatirons (pre-Gibson) have a pretty chunky neck. I haven't gotten my hands on one yet.

[pops1]

Stevo75, I am the opposite, One that I like is 3/4" deep and I have one that is less. The shallow necks are harder for me to find. I bought a Girouard and had to send it back as the neck depth hurt my hands. It was deeper by 1/8" and tho I tried to play it, was a nice one, just couldn't.

Just measured a couple with 1 3/16" neck width one is 1 11/16" deep, one 1 13/16 deep. For Tavy one is 17mm the other 20mm.

[Tavy]

Just measured a couple with 1 3/16" neck width one is 1 11/16" deep, one 1 13/16 deep. For Tavy one is 17mm the other 20mm.

Thank you, I was wondering what all those fractions meant

17mm seems incredibly thin though.... are you including fretboard thickness in that measurement?

[pops1]

Yes, that includes the fretboard in the measurement. It's from a 60's Gibson A40. They had very thin necks, I do like them now that I am old and arthritic. Used to love the 1 1/4" wide old Gibson A's. Such is the change of time.

[Tavy]

Yes, that includes the fretboard in the measurement. It's from a 60's Gibson A40.

Wow, the capo police will be out of a job - you won't get one to fit!

[Max Girouard]

Stevo75, I am the opposite, One that I like is 3/4" deep and I have one that is less. The shallow necks are harder for me to find. I bought a Girouard and had to send it back as the neck depth hurt my hands. It was deeper by 1/8" and tho I tried to play it, was a nice one, just couldn't.

Just measured a couple with 1 3/16" neck width one is 1 11/16" deep, one 1 13/16 deep. For Tavy one is 17mm the other 20mm.

That one you played was one of our earlier builds when we were building with a neck depth of almost 1 inch. We since have slimmed down our "standard" neck depth, but still build them deeper if the customer asks. Our current necks measure .8 inches deep (just over 20mm) and are profiled after the early 20's Loar signed mandolins. Most common nut width's requested are 1 1/8th and 1 3/16th, but we have built them from as narrow as 1 inch and up to 1 1/4 at the widest.

[pops1]

Max, you are right it was one of yours, a nice mandolin, but for me, the neck depth was too much.

Tavy, I never use a capo so guess I won't grab the attention of the capo police.

[Jim Garber]

Just measured a couple with 1 3/16" neck width one is 1 11/16" deep, one 1 13/16 deep. For Tavy one is 17mm the other 20mm.

Thank you, I was wondering what all those fractions meant

17mm seems incredibly thin though.... are you including fretboard thickness in that measurement?

I think that pops miscalculated:
1-11/16" = 42.8mm
1-13/16" = 46.1mm

[Mark Gunter]

Has anyone come across a chart that shows a comparison of various instrument's neck profiles in cross section with dimensions? It seems to me that such information would be invaluable. If I had access to a number of different mandolins I might take on such a project. Hopefully someone's already done it.

[Tobin]

Has anyone come across a chart that shows a comparison of various instrument's neck profiles in cross section with dimensions?

Where would one take these measurements? A mandolin neck does not have the same continuous profile all the way up. It's a constant taper in width as well as depth. I could see how these measurements would be useful if taken at every fret, in order to document the taper. But one single measurement might not truly capture a mandolin neck's actual profile.

[Mark Gunter]

Yes, I've thought of that too Tobin, and would suggest a cross section at two places on each neck: maybe at the nut and at the 5th fret. While this information would be very much incomplete, as you've pointed out, having the comparisons could teach a lot about those different mandolins I think.

[pops1]

I think that pops miscalculated:
1-11/16" = 42.8mm
1-13/16" = 46.1mm

Sorry the depth is 11/16 and 13/16 the 1 should have not been there. I measured with a metric rule also instead of calculating.

[Stevo75]

Where would one take these measurements? A mandolin neck does not have the same continuous profile all the way up. It's a constant taper in width as well as depth. I could see how these measurements would be useful if taken at every fret, in order to document the taper. But one single measurement might not truly capture a mandolin neck's actual profile.

I have found that the measurement at the first fret tells me all I need to know as most of my time is spent in first position. But at the Collings website (for example) they will give you first and 12th fret dimensions.

[T.D.Nydn]

Yes, that includes the fretboard in the measurement. It's from a 60's Gibson A40. They had very thin necks, I do like them now that I am old and arthritic. Used to love the 1 1/4" wide old Gibson A's. Such is the change of time.

Also the A50's,,,I had a 60's A50 that had about the thinnest neck you could possibly have on a mandolin,,

[V70416]

Thank you all for the thoughtful replies. Lots to consider.

I am no good at measuring. I see that,as usual,in mandolins there are SO many variables to playability,not the least of which are the operators hands.

Color me firmly in the narrow(er) and thinner camp.

When I was asked what dimensions I wanted on a Derrington MM I was hesitant to state my preference. So,one of the builders(forgot his name...Billy?) said "well,we'll leave a little extra cheek on the neck;if you don't like it we can take some off." So,the cheek was left on. I'm thinking now that I would prefer to have less cheek.
The lesson here is:don't drink before you give your neck dimension preferences.(or,as Lyle L. says,"don't get drunk before you go to get a haircut.")

[Don Grieser]

I'm definitely in the shallow camp. My Heiden and Passernig both measure 3/4" at the first fret. The Passernig has a little less in shoulders (or cheeks). Both are very easy to play. I can't play necks that are deeper than that without causing some serious left hand problems.

Max Girouard built me a mandola that used the Heiden profile--just enlarged it proportionally to fit the mandola nut width. Plays like a dream. He'll use my Heiden neck profile on the oval he's building me.

I've played a couple other Heidens and neither had the same profile as mine. It must have been a custom neck for someone else, but as soon as I played it, it felt like it was made for me.

[pops1]

My Brentrup has spoiled me for most other mandolins, can't get past the sound and pliability. I know what you meat Don, mine was made for someone else, but I feel it was made for me.

[Jim Garber]

My Brentrup has spoiled me for most other mandolins, can't get past the sound and pliability. I know what you meat Don, mine was made for someone else, but I feel it was made for me.

I think Hans made my A4C for himself. I am used to the neck which is slightly deeper than my Gibson A2 snakehead but I am very used to it. If I were to commission a mandolin from scratch I would use my snakehead for the neck dimensions.