How do I become a luthier?

[gavin]

Hi everyone!

This may seem like a ridiculously general question but I've found myself looking to become a mandolin luthier.

I have several years of experience at finish carpentry work in the past. I have worked as an engineer for the past several years and my primary responsibility was the maintenance of some fairly complex pumping systems. So I feel like I have the mechanical abilities that this could be something I am good at. And above all, I have an absolute love of mandolins. I've always dreamed of making instruments but for some reason I have never pursued it. I'm pretty unhappy with my current career path so this seems like a good time to pursue it!

So I have began looking around on how to actually become a luthier. So far, it seems a little daunting. Short of buying my own shop and just learning by trial and error until I'm good enough to be confident or spending thousands to go to a school, it seems tough to get started.

So as general as it may sound, how do I become a luthier? Any tips? I'm planning to move to the Hood River, OR area in the spring. Anyone that you happen to know that would be a good contact up there?

Any comments are greatly appreciated!
Thanks,
Gavin

[pops1]

There is a guitar building school in Redwing Mn, you could probably build a mandolin as the instructor plays and has built his mandolin. It is a good way to learn a lot of basics that you will need. Plane and chisel sharping are taken to new heights when building or repairing instruments, as well as many other things you will need to know. It would take you years to learn this unless you apprenticed under someone.

[Rick Lindstrom]

Depends on whether you want to pursue luthiery as a profession or avocation. If you just want to do it for fun, start with a simple mandolin kit that has all of the heavy lifting already done, one that requires little in the way of tools or specialized equipment. Build that and follow through until you have a finished, playable instrument. Then decide if you really want to get deeper into it. You may discover that it's not the fun you expected, or you may love it and your passion will do the rest. You'll find a way to become a luthier, and a lot of your basic questions will have answered themselves through the process of putting a kit together.

[Jeff Mando]

It sounds like you have a good background and mechanical ability, which is a good start. Having the vision and desire is another good motivator. Not to discourage, but it may take many years to get a steady income stream from it, especially if you are used to a weekly paycheck. Many luthiers supplement their building by doing repair work. Depending on your location, you may get repair work from local music stores.

[Spruce]

And above all, I have an absolute love of mandolins.

Well, that's a good start...

[Dale Ludewig]

And find a supportive spouse with a good job.

And get ready for a long haul of mistakes and wasted material. And the obligatory 10K hours.

[Jim Hilburn]

I had the same calling but in 1980 after setting up a shop and making a first attempt it became apparent to me that making a living at it wasn't in the cards at that time. So for the next 25 years I worked as an electrician and built as a hobby.
By the turn of the century events led me back into it and I had more success than I ever expected. However it was a bare bones living so you have to really work hard at it and make a product that is desirable.
The old saying "have a wife with a good job" is pretty right on.

[Matt Harris]

What about trying to get an entry level position with a small American manufacturer, like Weber or Collings? That may not jive exactly with your moving plans (Although Hood River, OR is only about 3 hours from Bend, OR). But it seems to me it would be a great way to get your foot in the door, get a steady paycheck, and have access to great learning opportunities in the field.

[Dale Ludewig]

Jim, we posted at the same time with the same history and advice. Not coincidence perhaps.

[CarlM]

Short of buying my own shop and just learning by trial and error until I'm good enough to be confident or spending thousands to go to a school, it seems tough to get started.

You have worked around mechanical trades and carpentry. How much does it take to become proficient at those things? A traditional apprenticeship in trades is four years. Most include some schooling as well. Four years full time is a little over 8000 hours. If you are an actual degreed engineer you realize that takes about 8000 to ten thousand hours over a four year degree program in that profession just to get started.

Becoming a luthier is like any other trade. There is no easier way. Short cuts will take longer. Working for a manufacturer is also a good path as has been suggested. But you will take a pay cut and starting out at the bottom it will be pretty substantial. The program at Red Wing is good. I know a couple of people who have been through it. It is two years. The first year is a flat top instrument. The second year they build a carved top instrument, either archtop guitar or mandolin. But like all trade schools it just gets your feet wet so the real learning can begin over the next ten years. A young acquaintance who went through the program has been disappointed in the lack of financial reward because he is still starting out at the bottom but happy with the work and environment at a prominent arch top guitar maker.

Not to be discouraging. If you want to do it as a hobby while you do a day job the investment in shop equipment does not have to be that large if you have a room to do it in. You can make up with hand work and time what a guy in business would have to automate to survive. Otherwise you have to follow one of the other paths, dive in and invest the time and effort then hope it pays off in some way.

[gavin]

Thanks everyone! This is great feedback! I really appreciate it. For the time being, I think i'll most likely be doing this as a side job and not be relying on it as my main source of income.

[Denny Gies]

Apprentice with an established luthier.

[F-2 Dave]

I'm sure it's a pretty simple process. What religion are you converting from?

[nkforster]

Thanks everyone! This is great feedback! I really appreciate it. For the time being, I think i'll most likely be doing this as a side job and not be relying on it as my main source of income.

Very sensible. If you really want to make a living in lutherie, repair is where you'll find more work, less competition, require less marketing and know what you get for an hours work.

Google "Making a living in lutherie" I wrote an ebook on the subject.

Good luck,

Nigel

[fscotte]

Well I'm not a luthier, but I play one on TeeVee.

I had a choice between building small sailboats or building mandolins. I shoulda chose boats.

[Steve Ostrander]

I had a choice between building small sailboats or building mandolins. I shoulda chose boats.

I hear that small sailboats stay in tune better....

[CarlM]

I hear that small sailboats stay in tune better....

Or stay in tuna better.......

[Bill McCall]

Paul Lestock, Arrow Mandolins, is in Mosier (about 5 miles from Hood River) and hosts a swing jam in Hood River on Sundays at Springhouse Cellars. Good place to start.

It's a long walk from finish carpentry to mandolin building. Nothing is hidden and the tolerances are much smaller.

[thistle3585]

Check out Indiana University Violin Shop. That would be a good start to learn your way around a shop and learn how to graduate an instrument.

[mirwa]

Its not hard, and you have a good background.

First start repairing friends instruments for free, start building instruments for family members as gifts, you need the hand skills and basics before touching anyones pride and joy.

People are very attached to there instruments.

Having done this for many many years, repairing is far harder than building, I know some people may get their backs up on that fact, but repairing is restoring the instrument seamlessly back to how it was made, fit and finish. With building we incorporate our mistakes into the build design.

I have done both, and manage to make a full time living out of repairing for myself and others.

All of course IMO.

Steve

(EDIT)

P.S - Here are some repair articles to get you started, be they guitars the same apply's across any stringed instrument.

http://www.mirwa.com.au/How_to_Series.html

[pops1]

Having done this for many many years, repairing is far harder than building.

.



http://www.mirwa.com.au/How_to_Series.html

Repairing is like rebuilding an old house as opposed to building a new one, much harder. It is however good experience.

[Petrus]

Having done this for many many years, repairing is far harder than building, I know some people may get their backs up on that fact, but repairing is restoring the instrument seamlessly back to how it was made, fit and finish.

Charlie Derrington knew about that like no one else, probably!

[sunburst]

I don't know...
Having repaired and built instruments for over 30 years, I don't think repairing is much harder than building.
I believe it takes the development of more different skills, more experience, more analytical thinking, and a more trained eye to excel at repair than to excel at building only, but once all of that is under control, degree of difficulty is not much higher.

[Jeff Mando]

I like the part about making sure your wife has a good job.......

I think that is the same answer to "how do I become a professional musician fulltime?"

[mirwa]

I believe it takes the development of more different skills, more experience, more analytical thinking, and a more trained eye to excel at repair than to excel at building only, but once all of that is under control, degree of difficulty is not much higher.

I totally agree with everything you said there.

Steve