Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 38

Thread: Show us your jig? Bindings

  1. #1
    The Amateur Mandolinist Mark Gunter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    South of Cleburne, North of Hillsboro, Texas
    Posts
    5,091

    Default Show us your jig? Bindings

    I'm getting ready to make a jig for cutting binding channels with router table. I've seen a few here and on the web, but I thought it might be helpful to me and others, as well as an interesting topic, if any of you are willing to post photos and comments in one place regarding jigs for this. Shop made, store bought, with or without use of a router, doesn't matter although I'm really interested in shop made jigs. What do you use for cutting binding channels?
    WWW.THEAMATEURMANDOLINIST.COM
    ----------------------------------
    "Life is short. Play hard." - AlanN

    ----------------------------------
    HEY! The Cafe has Social Groups, check 'em out. I'm in these groups:
    Newbies Social Group | The Song-A-Week Social
    The Woodshed Study Group | Blues Mando
    - Advice For Mandolin Beginners
    - YouTube Stuff

  2. #2
    I may be old but I'm ugly billhay4's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Lakebay, Wa
    Posts
    4,162

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    This was referenced in the thread about router tables. It looks quite interesting to me, but is pricey. You might be able to rig one up on your own, but the inserts would be hard to do.
    Bill
    IM(NS)HO

  3. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to billhay4 For This Useful Post:


  4. #3

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    Just set it up. Chose to use an LMI bearing cutter.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	image.jpg 
Views:	686 
Size:	133.6 KB 
ID:	143983  

  5. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Jim Hilburn For This Useful Post:


  6. #4
    I may be old but I'm ugly billhay4's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Lakebay, Wa
    Posts
    4,162

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    Jim,
    Do you have a carriage or something to keep the body level?
    Thanks,
    Bill
    IM(NS)HO

  7. #5
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Boston West
    Posts
    591

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    Looks good Jim. What do you use to support the mandolin's carved arch?

    Sorry Bill, we must have been typing at the same time.
    -Newtonamic

  8. The following members say thank you to Larry Simonson for this post:


  9. #6

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    Pivot on the arch and like Steven G. said, think straight.

  10. #7
    The Amateur Mandolinist Mark Gunter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    South of Cleburne, North of Hillsboro, Texas
    Posts
    5,091

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    I saw that think straight comment awhile back and thought it was great. I'm looking forward to seeing your pic(s), can't see the attachment on mobile so I'll have to wait until I get home tonight.

  11. #8

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    My archtop jig works similar to Jims- except in my case the rims ride on a wood collar or donut around the cutter bit that matches the arch height. There are three points of support- two at the rim on either side of the cutter bit and the pivot point at the highest point of the arch. It sounds precarious, but it is actually very stable and most importantly, fast.
    If you have the Benedetto book, his binding cutter follows the same principle. (that is where I got the idea)

    For my Selmer style domed flat-tops I use a Ribbecke inspired overarm router jig with a cradle.
    Eric Foulke
    Boots Mandolins

    "Outside of a book, a dog is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read." Groucho Marx

  12. #9
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Boise, Idaho
    Posts
    580

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    This is a jig I made using some parts from a stewmac binding jig that never worked very well and some other bits and pieces. I prefer to use a down cut spiral bit. (In this case it cuts up)
    Austin Clark
    http://www.clarkmandolins.com

    Clark Mandolins on Facebook

    @scrollenvy on Instagram

  13. The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to Austin Clark For This Useful Post:


  14. #10

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    There you see Austin thinking straight.

  15. The following members say thank you to Jim Hilburn for this post:


  16. #11
    Registered User Jim Adwell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Ocala, FL
    Posts
    515

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    My jig works like Austin Clark's but looks a bit different. Here's some pics.

    It's clamped on the end of a bench when needed and hangs out in a corner of the shop when not. Made from various wooden bits and some funny angle brackets that nest together, re-purposed from vertical blind mountings that were replaced a while back. The router is a $28 special from Harbor Freight, with a straight 1/4" bit. A down-spiral bit would also work.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	2016-02-24 20.32.06.jpg 
Views:	283 
Size:	61.1 KB 
ID:	143990

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	2016-02-24 20.32.15.jpg 
Views:	422 
Size:	101.4 KB 
ID:	143991

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	2016-02-24 20.32.35.jpg 
Views:	315 
Size:	79.6 KB 
ID:	143989
    Last edited by Jim Adwell; Feb-24-2016 at 7:54pm.

  17. The following members say thank you to Jim Adwell for this post:


  18. #12
    The Amateur Mandolinist Mark Gunter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    South of Cleburne, North of Hillsboro, Texas
    Posts
    5,091

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Hilburn View Post
    There you see Austin thinking straight.
    Yes, and thank you Austin for providing video! Thanks all for the pics/videos posted so far. It's all been very helpful to me. The simplicity of Jim Hillburn's jig is impressive.

    So far I'm seeing two approaches, one is a fixed depth of cut determined by bearing, and the others have micro adjustments?
    WWW.THEAMATEURMANDOLINIST.COM
    ----------------------------------
    "Life is short. Play hard." - AlanN

    ----------------------------------
    HEY! The Cafe has Social Groups, check 'em out. I'm in these groups:
    Newbies Social Group | The Song-A-Week Social
    The Woodshed Study Group | Blues Mando
    - Advice For Mandolin Beginners
    - YouTube Stuff

  19. #13
    Registered User Jim Adwell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Ocala, FL
    Posts
    515

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    The advantages of the adjustable depth type are 1) if your binding thickness is a little off you can adjust the jig for it, and 2) you can cut the binding ledge a tiny bit deeper so you are scraping or sanding the sides flush to the binding rather than removing material from the binding itself which can make the binding end up thinner in places where the ledge isn't absolutely perfect and make your binding job look less than professional, especially with thinner binding material. Also if you change binding thickness you have to change the bearing on your router bit, which can get expensive if you're using a variety of bindings and purflings of different sizes.

  20. The following members say thank you to Jim Adwell for this post:


  21. #14
    The Amateur Mandolinist Mark Gunter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    South of Cleburne, North of Hillsboro, Texas
    Posts
    5,091

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    Jim Adwell, I agree, I can see the sense in all of that, and the jig I envisioned building will have depth adjustment, but I hadn't seen the need for micro adjustment. I thought to be able to adjust it into/out of bit by loosening thumbscrews and sliding in slots on my router table. I'm sure having a micro adjustment screw would be convenient, but not sure it's worth the extra effort to build that in. FWIW, the jig I have in mind would be very similar to yours in principle, but where you have what appears to be 3/4" of hardwood at the top for a guide/depth stop, I envision more like at least a couple inches. I figure if the guide up top has more surface and is parallel to the bit, "thinking straight" will be made easier. The side of the guitar's (or Mandolin's) body will be more easily kept square to the cutting edge. Any thoughts?
    WWW.THEAMATEURMANDOLINIST.COM
    ----------------------------------
    "Life is short. Play hard." - AlanN

    ----------------------------------
    HEY! The Cafe has Social Groups, check 'em out. I'm in these groups:
    Newbies Social Group | The Song-A-Week Social
    The Woodshed Study Group | Blues Mando
    - Advice For Mandolin Beginners
    - YouTube Stuff

  22. #15

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    I can use masking tape on the side where the bearing rides to change the depth of cut by a tiny amount.
    I actually built that jig with an adjustable depth stop but went to the bearing setup instead.

  23. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Jim Hilburn For This Useful Post:


  24. #16
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Boise, Idaho
    Posts
    580

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    This is the first generation of binding jig I used to use. This one had to clamp to the table and wouldn't let me get into as tight of corners as the new one. The new one (in the video) is attached to the spacer disk (collar) that goes in the table and is micro adjustable. I find the fine adjustment to be a huge bonus when sneaking up on the right depth. Both allow fairly easy depth and width of cut adjustment.
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	image.jpg 
Views:	334 
Size:	106.6 KB 
ID:	144011
    Austin Clark
    http://www.clarkmandolins.com

    Clark Mandolins on Facebook

    @scrollenvy on Instagram

  25. The following members say thank you to Austin Clark for this post:


  26. #17

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    Wow, that's all I have to say, since I am going to be making my first binding routing jig today... I made the router table yesterday. I was going to use a bit with a bearing at the top, but the idea of an adjustable top piece is something I will have to think hard on. I have stuck in my mind that if you aren't locating the instrument side at exactly 90 degrees to the line of the guide you can get variable depth, unless the diameter of the nose of the guide is exactly the right size to perfectly match the depth of the cut. I'm not sure that is true, or if it's an issue in practice.

  27. #18
    Registered User Jim Adwell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Ocala, FL
    Posts
    515

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    Mark Gunter, Brian Evans: you should take a look here. My binding cutter jig is based on this design.

    http://www.kennethmichaelguitars.com...ngmachine.html

    Read the whole thing, there is lots of information about how and why this design works, and how to use it properly. If you don't feel like you can make the jig yourself, or you don't want to for whatever reason, consider buying one from this guy. The price is reasonable, IMO. NFI

  28. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Jim Adwell For This Useful Post:


  29. #19

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    I am seeing the light. If you were to cut a 1/4" by .060" channel, using your jig with a 1/4" bit, how many passes would you make, and if more than one, would you vary the height of the cut (the 1/4" dimension) or the depth of the cut (the .060" dimension)?

    thanks very much to all who shared! I desperately hate using my router hand-held, and have been looking forward to having a table for quite a while now.

  30. #20
    The Amateur Mandolinist Mark Gunter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    South of Cleburne, North of Hillsboro, Texas
    Posts
    5,091

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    Jim Adwell, thank you for that link. There was one sentence in that page that helped me to learn something:

    Quality – The captive bit feature virtually eliminates the possibility of damage
    caused by presenting the body at the wrong angle to the bit or vise versa
    I've done a good bit of router table work over the years, and after reading and thinking about that I can see now that my idea of having more surface atop for the side to ride on is not necessary.
    WWW.THEAMATEURMANDOLINIST.COM
    ----------------------------------
    "Life is short. Play hard." - AlanN

    ----------------------------------
    HEY! The Cafe has Social Groups, check 'em out. I'm in these groups:
    Newbies Social Group | The Song-A-Week Social
    The Woodshed Study Group | Blues Mando
    - Advice For Mandolin Beginners
    - YouTube Stuff

  31. #21

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    I'd point out that you really have to tip the instrument to get a cockeyed cut. If you watch Austin, he doesn't hold it as perfectly as if you had some form of body holding set up but he never tilts it enough to cause a real problem. That's the way I've always approached it.

  32. The following members say thank you to Jim Hilburn for this post:


  33. #22
    Registered User ellisppi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Austin, TX
    Posts
    338

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    You guys are on the right track but I would advise that you always use 2 opposing spool clamps so the body rides on three points. The bottom edge of the rabbit will be much cleaner. Even for a mandolin, you need a pretty decent size table top. Make a cover for the router table and use it as a work surface (junk depot) when not in use. Don't break it down, leave it always set up ready for work. Micro adjust is not necessary, just figure out the depth and tighten it down (you do have slots for adjusting). Take first cut with tape around the bearing then remove the tape for final pass. One final tip that most people don't know is if you intend to end up with .060 thickness of ivoroid on your binding, you can't start with .060 binding, my channel is .110 for .020 white .020 black .070 ivoroidClick image for larger version. 

Name:	15 routing for binding.jpg 
Views:	858 
Size:	79.7 KB 
ID:	144019
    Tom H. Ellis
    Ellis Mandolins
    Austin, TX
    http://www.ellismandolins.com

  34. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to ellisppi For This Useful Post:


  35. #23
    Registered User ellisppi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Austin, TX
    Posts
    338

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    just for fun here's how I do itClick image for larger version. 

Name:	Picture 005a.jpg 
Views:	421 
Size:	975.1 KB 
ID:	144025
    Tom H. Ellis
    Ellis Mandolins
    Austin, TX
    http://www.ellismandolins.com

  36. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to ellisppi For This Useful Post:


  37. #24

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    I learned it from the Mcrostie video, but I leave a little wood that I clean up by hand down to the rim so I'm not as concerned about that bottom cut. But Tom makes a good point.

  38. #25
    The Amateur Mandolinist Mark Gunter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    South of Cleburne, North of Hillsboro, Texas
    Posts
    5,091

    Default Re: Show us your jig? Bindings

    Tom, thanks for the tips and for showing us your setup there.
    WWW.THEAMATEURMANDOLINIST.COM
    ----------------------------------
    "Life is short. Play hard." - AlanN

    ----------------------------------
    HEY! The Cafe has Social Groups, check 'em out. I'm in these groups:
    Newbies Social Group | The Song-A-Week Social
    The Woodshed Study Group | Blues Mando
    - Advice For Mandolin Beginners
    - YouTube Stuff

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •