I had the pleasure of visiting Tom and Pava around Thanksgiving. Pava was in the midst of making her arrangements for Wintergrass. i'm sure her mandolins will be a big hit with the crowd.
I had the pleasure of visiting Tom and Pava around Thanksgiving. Pava was in the midst of making her arrangements for Wintergrass. i'm sure her mandolins will be a big hit with the crowd.
That price is right around where you can get a used MF5. It's a tough price point to sell because you are competing with used mandolins from a lot of builders too.
"your posts ... very VERY opinionated ...basing your opinion/recommendations ... pot calling ...kettle... black...sarcasm...comment ...unwarranted...unnecessary...."
Mandobar, if that were an issue, no one would buy new mandolins because that is the case across the board. No one would ever buy a new Collings when used are available at 70% of the price...but they do. No one would ever buy a new car... but they do. Pricing a new mandolin (made from someone with increasing notoriety, high level quality, etc...) at or below the used price of what is arguably the industry standard in readily available, quality mandolins is a very strong value proposition and will be attractive to many folks.
Pricing in a narrow market is obviously a complex, multi-factorial issue. But I tend to agree, broadly, with the analysis above. You need to consider many things. But among the more important factors is what mandolins this item will compete with in the market, and what their prices may be.
Folks who tend to buy new are often (but not always) looking for something fundamentally different than folks who buy used. Some folks are willing to pay more, and in some cases, a lot more, for simply knowing that it's something new. And for knowing it's not scratched or worn or hides hidden flaws. And that it belongs "only" to them. Some folks like the reassurance of a new factory warranty, or a music store's backing. A good many buyers buy new because they seek customizations that are not readily available in the used market. Or they seek features that are mainly/only available on some new models. Or they seek a particular brand or model that doesn't come up very often in the used market. Or a model that might not be available at exactly the time they're in the market to buy. Or they may have had a bad prior experience with a used instrument, and have limited trust in buying that way (this happens a lot). And on an on.
The fact is that there is a decent market for both new and used instruments, and there is only partial crossover between these.
I played the Pava F5 at Wintergrass and it is a fine instrument. Priced at $6,500 and I would not hesitate to buy it if I wasn't already knee-deep in good mandolins.
The fact is that many of the best sounding F5's from the Ellis workshop that went out in the last 12 months were graduated and assembled by Pava K. Tom mentioned this in a post... so it's about time that she begin building them under her own mark. I don't think this will undermine Tom's work or pricepoint, as Pava will likely not use AAAAA backs, may not bind the back or neck/fingerboard, and won't offer much in the way of custom offerings... maintaining a differentiation between the two brands. That being said, sonically she makes some of the best damn instruments in the world. It's a very smart move to help her further establish her brand. They are taking a very gradual approach to building out Pava, and It shows how small business owners can work together to succeed.. what a great story.
Not to be too nit-picky, but Tom mentioned back in late 2014 that while Pava is doing most of the initial assembly of the Ellis mandolins, he is doing all of the carving, graduating and tone-barring. So Tom is still doing a lot of the core things that makes Ellis mandolins sound.. Ellis-y.
http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/sh...59#post1279059
As a proud Pava owner, I can't wait to see the finished F5 in its full glory.
I think you're generallly correct Clement, but in lieu of what Austin, TX local Capt. E. posted below, I wonder if she's getting to do more graduation work on the "Ellis" brand now that apparently she could be in the process of being groomed to take over the business..
1994 Gibson F5L - Weber signed
"Mandolin brands are a guide, not gospel! I don't drink koolaid and that Emperor is naked!"
"If you wanna get soul Baby, you gots to get the scroll..."
"I would rather play music anyday for the beggar, the thief, and the fool!"
"Perfection is not attainable; but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence" Vince Lombardi
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Speaking as an American, the part I find so beautiful and fascinating in the Pava story, is the "land of opportunity" aspect to it. Someone comes here from another country, brings/learns a trade, works hard, and becomes a success. We live in a time of cynicism, and in some cases flat out despair, so things like this are a real bright spot for me. Hard work, diligence, craftsmanship, etc. may seem old-fashioned ideas, but in truth they are timeless. Great job, Pava!
...
Where did he post that? I searched his forum posts here at the Cafe and didn't see anything.
When I last spoke to Tom (summer 2014) he pretty much said what was stated in the referenced thread from April 2014: that he did all the shaping/sanding/graduating and tone bar work on the Ellis line.
Who cares, how do they sound? Tom's business.
And Caleb, what you said. . .
this has been posted here on the Cafe in the past, but i think its an appropriate time to repost the link-nice article on Pava
http://www.themandolinplayer.net/pava-knesevic
Every day I play my Pava I am amazed at what it will do. Bark? yes. Sweet? No problem. Dark and deep? yep. It never fails to deliver.
I am so flipped out about an F style and an oval that I can hardly believe it..
I think that there is real magic coming out of Tom's shop.
Hey Tom, thanks for posting these. What kind of tuners is Pava putting on her F5?
Thanks,
David
Hi Tom - Many thanks for the info. I'm looking forward to seeing one over here at TAMCO sometime,
Ivan
Weber F-5 'Fern'.
Lebeda F-5 "Special".
Stelling Bellflower BANJO
Tokai - 'Tele-alike'.
Ellis DeLuxe "A" style.
Hi Ivan,
I have one on order.
Trevor
Formerly of The Acoustic Music Co (TAMCO) Brighton England now retired.
I got to play the Pava and Ellis F5 at Wintergrass. It was the first time I have tried their offerings and thought they were good. There were quite a few instruments in the room I would have picked over the Pava/Ellis, regardless of price. I've heard so much about Ellis and Pava on here that I guess I had pretty high expectations. Don't get me wrong, they were beautiful and played nice, but Austin Clark had his table 6 feet away and his offerings grabbed my ears and attention.
... not all those who wander are lost ...
I placed my order last week for a set of twins. One is a blonde one piece back F and the other is a blonde one piece A. The numbers will be one apart. Never owned a blonde mandolin so this is a little new for me.....but....As a dealer for Pava's, I'm actually thinking I will keep these two for my son.
I also have a later F coming that I will probably stick with sunburst on. Got an A pro blonde two piece coming soon too and the last of the one piece A's they did without up charging for it. I guess I'll have more Pava's than I've ever had at once to play against each other. Pretty excited about the F!!!!!
Looking forward to playing a Pava in the future. I'm curious if it sounds anything close to an Ellis varnished mandolin. Wish they offered a shortened fingerboard extension similar to the Ellis. I hate pick click.
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