How to make your child not succeed at music

[Astro]

Yep, at age 9 or 10 I had a horrible weekly lesson that lasted about 2 months where I begged and pleaded to let me stop taking and finally they gave in because I refused to practice. My sisters both kept taking for years. At age 12 or 14 my grandfather bought me an old broken bridged Harmony guitar with mile high action and he glued up the bridge for me. I still have it and love it. Had it reworked and it plays and sounds wonderful.

Weird that even though both sisters have pianos in their house, I'm the only one in the family that still plays music.

I've tried to buy my kids instruments many times over the years, but they have no interest.

Go figure.

[rubydubyr]

Well said Marc

[fatt-dad]

this is a disturbing thread.

f-d

[Steve L]

I can't believe how many people I meet who spent 8, 10, 15 years taking music lessons they didn't want counting the minutes till they could quit. Sometimes they find a way to enjoy music, often with a different instrument...often they don't. A lot of them had some sort of horrible moment with a teacher that just destroyed music making for them.

I think a lot of kids end up taking lessons to have another activity on a college application or because someone read one of those articles about how music lessons hone one's wits to a razors edge. A lot of them hardly ever listen to music and can't name you three songs they want to play. I think if the passion isn't there, it's like pushing a rope up a flight of stairs.

[Hallmark498]

Great thread!

Some of the OP 1 -10 is why I didnt play music until turning 25. My kids are around music and instruments are laying around availible to them "if" they want to mess with them. It taught me to encourage and not worry about whats being done wrong, but to focus on what is right!

[rubydubyr]

this is a disturbing thread.

f-d

fer sure, was meant to be...

[bratsche]

Wow, I feel sorry for people who went through those kinds of experiences, but it is hard for me to relate. When I was 8, I heard a violinist for the first time, and that was it - he played Greensleeves on Christmas Eve 52 years ago, it was magical, and I just had to do what he was doing. It became my obsession. I come from a non-musical family. When my elementary school opened string lessons to 4th graders the following year, I was the one who picked up and filled out all the forms, and took them home to my parents to sign. They soon had to chase me out of the practice room sometimes, because they felt I wasn't playing outside enough with the other kids. Go figure. Now I am a sexagenarian starving musician. Well, this is the life I wanted. No regrets... so far. ;-)

bratsche

[rubydubyr]

But that's the point, bratsche. Its what YOU wanted. (Not to change the subject..... but the two refuges from life's miseries should state music and DOGS... )

[bratsche]

I know, and I'm thankful I was able to pursue what I wanted, and that my mom (may she RIP, she died very young when I was 13) didn't try to force me into home economics, which was her "thing". although I still have her sewing machine that gets used about once every decade. LOL

And as to your other point, well, I hope it's just your "lack of knowledge" about cats that makes you say that; otherwise, you'll have to take it up with Albert Schweitzer. ;-)

bratsche

[rubydubyr]

I know, and I'm thankful I was able to pursue what I wanted, and that my mom (may she RIP, she died very young when I was 13) didn't try to force me into home economics, which was her "thing". although I still have her sewing machine that gets used about once every decade. LOL

And as to your other point, well, I hope it's just your "lack of knowledge" about cats that makes you say that; otherwise, you'll have to take it up with Albert Schweitzer. ;-)

bratsche

[Tommcgtx]

Yup, that too. Texas schools used to have choir and violin and band lessons starting in the 3rd grade, for those who wished to come to school 30 minutes early for the lessons. Now....... the kids get a 45 minute singing lesson 1 or 2 times a week, and lessons on the recorder in 4th grade...... And the states wonder why academics is going down and kids aren't learning math...... guess they never heard of the studies that show a link between learning to PLAY music and being better mathematically......

Well, I live in El Paso, and both my kids have violin classes, my Daughter has taken guitar, and currently has violin and piano classes during every school day. I think it depends on local school districts, so saying "Texas" schools is a bit of a blanket statement.

[Dave Wrede]

My daughter-in-law ran afoul of that "bad teacher" and quit playing violin for years. I've spent the last 10 years trying to encourage her to start playing again. I know that if she does my grandkids will start wondering where that sound is coming from and how they can do it too. Music will send them on a lifetime journey of discovery that will do them nothing but good!

[rubydubyr]

Well, I live in El Paso, and both my kids have violin classes, my Daughter has taken guitar, and currently has violin and piano classes during every school day. I think it depends on local school districts, so saying "Texas" schools is a bit of a blanket statement.

point taken

[Mandobart]

Sorry to hear of the negative experiences. I also chose violin when I was 10 (way too old to start if you ever want get serious) but I sure enjoyed it all thru school. The really good players I knew growing up were forced to play, and dropped it as soon as they left home. Most of them haven't touched it now for over 30 years. For me music is my main hobby and passion and has stayed with me thru the years.

So I had both my kids start piano (which I have not yet taken up) in grade school just to try it. Both chose to drop it after about a year. My son went on to dabble with violin, trumpet, clarinet and bassoon. He is now in college and not playing any instrument. My daughter (now in high school) has become a serious voice student and about a year ago chose to restart piano. I've tried to nudge them into guitar and mandolin, but it just doesn't pull them in like it did me.

[mandroid]

My Dad had A Hammond Organ in the Living room, but hated The players that Knew what to do with them
like Jimmy Smith. ie, .. Jazz

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Smith_%28musician%29

being in the Living room was not helpful as The TV was usually On , instead.

[Frank Russell]

Good old hindsight. My poor dad tried for years to get me to play guitar, but I didn't want to because that was "his" thing, and I wanted to do my own thing. He didn't say no when I decided I'd like to play sax, but did ask me if I would be whipping out my sax at the beach to play for pretty girls. I would never tell him he was right, and never learned to play either one. Took up mandolin several years ago, and I could have really used those 20 years or so of playing an instrument, as I'm still a beginner (although a well-equipped one). He died before I started playing, but I think he would have been thrilled that I was playing an instrument. Unfortunately, my rebellion also included ignoring his advice that "computers were going to be really big," and that I should get into it before everyone jumped on. I thought he was silly. I showed him!
For my own kids, I'm trying another approach, which includes saturating them with all kinds of music, from the womb until they are old enough to choose an instrument. My oldest son is almost three, and can recognize his letters, so we got him an Autoharp to play for now. He already has his own taste in music, and loves my mandolins, a little too much. If I can get him to play with me, I'll be happy. If he keeps up with it, great. If not, at least I've given him a foundation, and he can come back to music later. Making any pursuit into a duty or a chore with kids is a mistake. Frank

[JonZ]

My kids wanted to learn violin at age 3, because the neighbor girls played. They went through ups and downs, and occasionally wanted to quit, but I told them they had to stick with it. I sensed they were frustrated or bored, rather than miserable, so I wanted them to have the experience of working through that. They never practiced that much--a little every day. But my wife made sure that they played on pitch when they practiced.

Eventually my youngest switched to double bass, and turned out to be a natural jazz bassist. So his teacher recruited him to a boarding school for the arts. My oldest son got an eye full of the actresses and dancers, and decided home schooling was no longer for him. He started practicing two hours a day, auditioned, and got a scholarship too. After six months, he switched out of the orchestra and into the jazz department.

They both love music, and are pretty good, with a surprising knack for improvisation. At certain points they would have quit, if I had let them.

Sometimes parents want answers to be black and white. "Never pick up a crying baby/Always pick up a crying baby". Sometimes saying "No, you aren't going to quit" is the right thing. Sometimes it isn't.

[OldSausage]

Poor young Tiny Tim could play a wonderful fiddle, but sadly he starved to death, and all because of my penny-pinching ways.

[Hendrik Ahrend]

JonZ, you probably admit that even in the case of your kids, there is still a good chance that "no, you aren't going to quit" wasn't the right thing after all, unless staying with music is regarded as the ultimate goal in raising children.

[JonZ]

You can second guess yourself to death on any parenting choice.

They have a talent that brings them joy. I'm good with that.

[Sterling]

My wife and I are public school band directors and professional musicians. Our son is a gifted trumpet player but does not care about his talent. Soccer is his passion. His talent is saved and always at the ready. It is his path to follow.

[JH Murray]

My proudest musical moment as a parent: my son in high school played the drums. One day after school he brought a new friend home. The friend picked up one of the electric guitars and they started to jam, very loudly. The floors were vibrating. After a while I had enough so I went down to talk to them about what was going on. The friend was rather frightened to see me, as they had really been rocking out. I told my son he wasn't keeping the tempo steady and to not race ahead. And then I left. When someone asked why I didn't tell them to turn it down, I told them I knew where my son was, what he was doing, and who he was doing it with. And they were having fun. What's not to like with that situation as a parent?

[DHopkins]

Both of my parents were vocal and instrumental musicians (gospel and country). I think I picked it up by osmosis because they never insisted that I play or sing but did compliment me when it sounded good.

[catmandu2]

You can second guess yourself to death on any parenting choice.

They have a talent that brings them joy. I'm good with that.

It's such an interesting polemic...not that parenting is/was ever particularly “free” from challenges, ironies, paradoxes…but approaches and concepts certainly have changed over time - evincing as it does in contemporary cognitive/developmental “child-centered” models, etc. Children of the future will no doubt be better improvisers (I was raised on bugs bunny, popeye, et al – all superb improvisers ) -- it comes fast and broad (or fast and bulbous, as Don Van Vliet preferred) – my daughter is learning Irish dance, ballet, Chinese, flamenco guitar, while my son fiddles on the ouds….we enjoy the luxury of choice. Music—like the rest of childrens’ diverse realms and activities--will be ever broadening. Jazz concept – freedom of elements – is our playground

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtHbxsdExlE

[Bertram Henze]

enjoy music

There it is again, that keyword totally absent from my music education history: joy.
There is a reason behind that - my parents were both professionals, and you tend to have a different view of things if your income depends on them, especially when it's not a lot. According to their stories, they had to fight for their passion in their own youth, and so they were very committed, but the chores of the job apparently had taken all the joy out of it by the time it was my turn.

I can understand that. I myself started out into my own professional life as a computer geek, and today I am still a much better systems analyst than musician, but optimism and passion disappeared by and by with two things turning up:
- end users
- Microsoft
Now I am just serving my time to pay the bills with what I am being good at, and at least that worked out alright. But never would it occur to me to encourage kids to go down the same road I travelled.