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Thread: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

  1. #1
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    Default Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    This may have been discussed on here before but I`ll ask it again....

    What are peoples opinions about the value of a Nashville made Flatiron Festival F-5 mandolin now that they are being made in China? I see where they are selling at a price far below what the ones made in Nashville are selling for, I have heard that they aren`t much to be compared with the Nashville made ones...

    In my opinion if Gibson wanted to have a mandolin made in China they should have called it something else instead of maybe running down the name of an excellent mandolin like the Flatiron Festival....I also see where they are being called a "Epiphone
    Flatiron Festival"...I guess that is a way of telling them apart from the ones made in Nashville...

    I have a made in Nashville one that I bought new and hate to think that this will cause mine to go down in value....

    Willie

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  3. #2
    Registered User belbein's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie View Post
    What are peoples opinions
    You can contact me by PM if you want my opinion. Though I don't know why you would.
    belbein

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    Mando accumulator allenhopkins's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie View Post
    ...if Gibson wanted to have a mandolin made in China they should have called it something else instead of maybe running down the name of an excellent mandolin like the Flatiron Festival...
    Amen! I've posted about this until it got tiresome. There are some respected, discontinued US labels that have been picked up by distributors and assigned to Asian-made instruments, and then the distributors' websites blather about the "long, glorious history" of Washburn, Epiphone, Oscar Schmidt, Regal, Harmony, Kay (well, maybe the last four aren't so "glorious"). Guild may be next, Fenders are made all over the world so you have to recognize their "secondary" labels like American Standard, Squier, etc.

    Original Flatiron instruments were first-rate. After Gibson bought the company, then moved production to Nashville, they were still first-rate. No one that I've heard from has called the FlatAsians "first-rate"; they're sorta OK low-to-mid-range imports, from what I read.

    You'll just have to advertise your Festival as a "Nashville Flatiron." People who know mandolins will understand what you mean, and those who don't probably won't be in the market for it. Nothing we can do about the degradation of some long-standing US labels, but IMHO it's a shame.
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    Loarcutus of MandoBorg DataNick's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    The asian flats are still being made?

    I don't think there's cause to worry Willie, Nashville Flats seem to hold their value well...
    1994 Gibson F5L made by Bruce Weber's team


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    Moderator MikeEdgerton's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    Here's an interesting past thread with a link in it to more discussions.
    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them". These are the words of J. Garber.

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    Registered User RichM's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    I used to have a Nashville Flatiron Festival F-5, and it was a wonderful mandolin, best value for money I think I ever got. No way those are going down in value, they are a bargain and half as it is.

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    Site founder Scott Tichenor's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    I'd love to stand here and talk to you...


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    Default Re: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    I can't imagine a scenario where a person online in the 21st century is going to confuse a Japanese, Korean, or Chinese made Epiphone, let alone a Flatiron made in Montana, Nashville, or Guang Zhou Province.

    Ironically, being an owner of a Gibson A-12 Lumpy due to my father's passing. Most likely it would have been a better mandolin if it were made anywhere else besides the Continental US during the 70's.

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    Default Re: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    I must be stupid or did I miss something in your video Scott? I don`t get the connection....

    Mr Boyd, It`s been stated that some people got confused when an Asian company made a mandolin and called "The Loar", that being the case I am sure some newbies will get confused also with the Flatiron models that come out of china....

  14. #10

    Default Re: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie View Post
    Mr Boyd, It`s been stated that some people got confused when an Asian company made a mandolin and called "The Loar".
    But did this alleged confusion have any effect on the value of Loar signed Gibsons? Or any Gibsons?

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    Default Re: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie View Post
    Mr Boyd, It`s been stated that some people got confused when an Asian company made a mandolin and called "The Loar", that being the case I am sure some newbies will get confused also with the Flatiron models that come out of
    china....
    i am sure there will be and is confusion. I have held some fantastic Asian made instruments made during the 70s and 80s that were good considering, and I expected more from "Gibson" (and the same goes for Fender) regarding their imports, unfortunately
    both those names let me down in regards to their carved top acoustics. I did learn from experience, but it would have been pre-internet days, or post good research and experience. Unfortunately I still look at instruments via the $ and not by the fact that if I want a good Bowlback i need to import multi $k instrument. or when/if i get an octave mando i will want a Weber (or better). we frugal SOB's are a strange bunch. And a lot of us learn from our mistakes, or use these transitional instruments to make sure we are on the right path. Doubt anyone today is going to mistake a Stella for 20s Gibson or a 70s Gibson for an actual LL. Different world, not better, just different!

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    Moderator MikeEdgerton's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie View Post
    I don`t get the connection....
    The movie Ground Hog day is about a guy that wakes up every day and relives that same day over. I think it's in reference to the fact that you asked this same question four years ago but I could be wrong.

    Oops, my mistake, three years ago.
    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them". These are the words of J. Garber.

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    Registered User belbein's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    There's an interesting question, it seems to me, about whether a company commits some sort of violation of the law (antitrust? unfair/deceptive practice?) if it conducts itself in such a way as to devalue its own prior products. I'm not accusing anyone of this, I'm just wondering. So if a person buys a widget from Acme Widgets, let's say their Widget Festival Model, for $100,000 ... but then later Acme Widgets starts producing Widget Festival Models of a much lower quality for $100 ... is that company violating some sort of duty to their former customers in devaluing the product they've previously sold? I'm not competent to answer this question, but it seems like an interesting question.
    belbein

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  19. #14

    Default Re: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    Quote Originally Posted by belbein View Post
    There's an interesting question, it seems to me, about whether a company commits some sort of violation of the law (antitrust? unfair/deceptive practice?) if it conducts itself in such a way as to devalue its own prior products. I'm not accusing anyone of this, I'm just wondering. So if a person buys a widget from Acme Widgets, let's say their Widget Festival Model, for $100,000 ... but then later Acme Widgets starts producing Widget Festival Models of a much lower quality for $100 ... is that company violating some sort of duty to their former customers in devaluing the product they've previously sold? I'm not competent to answer this question, but it seems like an interesting question.
    I believe the phrase caveat emptor has the situation covered.

  20. #15
    Registered User belbein's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    Well, actually no. Caveat emptor was a contract law defense in the old common law. It was a complete bar to recovery, even in the case of fraud or mistake. All of the developments in the last hundred or so years have basically killed off caveat emptor. That's why every state has statutes outlawing deceptive conduct: because caveat emptor's complete bar to recovery is just plain unfair. I mean, hey, bought a car lately? Or an Acme Widget Festival Model widget? Or, heck, a package of pigs ears (for your dog)? We no longer accept the level of unfairness that "caveat emptor" implies.

    Just speculating here, but I believe that we've gone from an understanding of sales as mostly a matter of biz to biz to an understanding of sales usually being between biz and consumers. As the differential in knowledge changed--as our economy changed from mostly business oriented to mostly consumer oriented--so did the law. But I could be wrong. Surely there's some law professor on the Cafe who can chime in here.
    belbein

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    Default Re: Flatiron Festival mandolin???

    Mike, I may have asked that same question 3 years ago, I don`t remember and if I did remember I wouldn`t have asked it again, as I stated in my post, I know this has been hashed over before but wonder how people feel about the value increasing or decreasing....Hell I can remember what I did 50 years ago but not 3 years ago...gimmie a break....

    Just close out this thread if you think it is over done....Like some have been in the past....

    Willie

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