Need some pick advice

[jahscrumb]

So I've been playing mandolin for about 2 months now and up until last week, I've been using just a standard .88mm guitar pick that came with my instrument. I finally decided to "upgrade" to a flat pick and settled on Mr. Grisman's Dawg picks. They got in a couple days ago and I was really excited to play with what I considered a real pick, but I soon became pretty disappointed with the sound. Compared to the regular guitar pick, the Dawg pick makes the instrument sound almost muted and a lot more mellow. It doesn't have that sharpness to it that I've come to love about the mandolin. Now, I don't know if I'm just not talented enough yet to use one of these picks or if that's just they way they always sound, but I'm now unfortunately on the market for another pick. I can't afford a blue chip or anything close to that actually, and I'm afraid of buying another flat pick in case it sounds the same even though I love the feel in my hand of a flat pick much more than that triangular guitar pick. I guess I should also mention that I play bluegrass mandolin. So, do you guys have any good suggestions for a cheaper mando pick? My ideal pick would be one that's shaped and feels like a flat pick but sounds like a thinner guitar pick. I don't know if that even exists, but I'd appreciate any advice. Thanks in advance.

[Tobin]

I can't afford a blue chip or anything close to that actually

I don't mean to sound insensitive, but is it that you really can't afford $35 for a pick, or that you just think it's too much to spend for a pick? If you really can't afford it, then what can you afford? What's your budget for a pick? The recommendations will all hinge on that.

I've heard similar comments about the Dawg picks, though I haven't used one myself. But it's the same issue I get from the Golden Gate pick (which I understand produces a similar sound to the Dawg picks). Very muted. Part of it may be the material used, and part of it may be the shape. As I recall, the Dawg picks are more rounded. You'll get brighter tone from one with more of a point, although too much of a point can make it go overboard.

While I, like many others, like the Blue Chip picks, you can get very good sound out of others too. Actually, I've sort of drifted back recently to my Wegen TF140 pick. Here's one source to buy them. $15 for a set of 4 is a lot more affordable than a Blue Chip, and may get you closer to the sound you're looking for.

You state that you're looking for more of a "thinner guitar pick" sound, but I think you'll find that a thicker pick really does produce better volume and tone in a mandolin. You just have to try one that has the right material and shape to get that sound.

[Perry]

So, do you guys have any good suggestions for a cheaper mando pick? My ideal pick would be one that's shaped and feels like a flat pick but sounds like a thinner guitar pick. I don't know if that even exists, but I'd appreciate any advice. Thanks in advance.

Uh...Fender Medium

[jahscrumb]

I don't mean to sound insensitive, but is it that you really can't afford $35 for a pick, or that you just think it's too much to spend for a pick? If you really can't afford it, then what can you afford? What's your budget for a pick? The recommendations will all hinge on that.

No offense taken, I'm just a college student on a very tight budget and $35 just seems too much for me to spend on one pick especially when I've only been playing for 2 months and am not very good yet. Perhaps in the future when I'm better I can justify spending that much.

As for that Wegen pick you linked me to, that sounds about perfect since it's in my price range. What thickness would you recommend though? What's the difference in sound between the 1mm and the 1.4mm? Like I said, I like the brighter sound as opposed to that muted sound, but that might very well be because my untrained ear doesn't know what the best tone is yet.

Sorry for all the questions, but as you can tell I'm not very knowledgeable at all about the subject. I really appreciate the advice.

[Tobin]

As for that Wegen pick you linked me to, that sounds about perfect since it's in my price range. What thickness would you recommend though? What's the difference in sound between the 1mm and the 1.4mm? Like I said, I like the brighter sound as opposed to that muted sound, but that might very well be because my untrained ear doesn't know what the best tone is yet.

I use the TF140, their 1.4mm pick. It's got more flex to it than a Blue Chip or V-Pick of the same thickness. But still has a nice thick feel and good tone. Chris Thile used to play with the Wegen TF140, if that makes any difference to you. But then again, he could play with a flattened bottlecap and still sound good.

Years ago when I bought my Wegen picks, I bought them directly from the source. They were willing to mix-and-match different styles in a set. So you may want to experiment with thicknesses. For $15, you could try the 1.0, 1.2, and 1.4 all together and see which you like best. I couldn't tell you the difference in tone between thicknesses amongst these Wegen picks, as I only stay with the thick ones. Maybe someone else can comment on that.

I'm not necessarily trying to steer you towards Wegen picks. V-Picks are another good source for a quality mandolin pick that will give you bright tone without approaching the cost of a Blue Chip. As well as many other makers.

Keep in mind also that aside from thickness and material, the bevel will have a lot to do with tone production. It really just depends on what sounds "right" to you. Sadly, there's no way to know for sure except to try them all until you find the right one. It can get expensive, there's no doubt about that.

[Ron McMillan]

You'll receive endless pointers here to 'BC' and other trendy overpriced things that will do next to nothing for your playing (unless you already happen to be a maestro). A thing I like about having a range of economical picks to hand is it gives me variety. Some songs I want a more mellow sound - so I get out the D'Andrea Pro-plec (about 60c each); if I want a more crisp tone I enjoy the Dunlop Big Stubby Triangles in a variety of thicknesses; and other times I go for Dunlop Ultex or Tortex. Sure, I've spent much more than $35 on my picks - but I have a great variety of them to enjoy, and don't worry about losing any of them.

[Eric Michael Pfeiffer]

Yes picks are a matter of taste, even so you're very used to using an extremely thin pointy pick. In my experience they produce a very thin, brittle kinda slappy sound. If that is what one is after then go for it, but I'm thinking that you're wanting to improve and change the sound of your tone by using a thicker pick or else you wouldn't have bought one or been looking for a different one. The thicker pick is going to require you to make some changes. You'll need to loosen up your grip and play more loosely with the wrist. You also may want to push it back a bit between the thumb and the forefinger. Anytime you make any kind of change or advancement, it's always uncomfortable and awkward at first. To me, thicker softer beveled picks give a much cleaner, smoother more rounded mellow tone that is more pleasing. Some folks that may not have mandolins that have great volume or projection ( not saying you by any means ) will compensate for that by using thinner picks that offer a thinner more crisp kind of sound that makes the mandolin a bit easier to be heard but generally thicker picks in my opinion just lend to better tone and control over all. Some picks come with a beveled end and a pointed end...that way you can turn it around if you want different tones or textures for different songs.

[Jim Garber]

I would not recommend a Blue Chip until you have been playing awhile and figured out what size, shape and thickness you like. There is really nothing wrong with an .88 pick, I assume it is the std Fender size. I played with that style for years, using the same one for guitar or mandolin.

Go to a store and buy a few different picks at a time. Maybe get some more of the std shape but thicker, like 1.00 and 1.20 and see how you do. I personally do not like the rounded Dawg picks but I know some players who love them and their playing soyunds wonderful. I think with those, you have to change your technique, pick angle, etc.

In any case, there is no right or wrong. BTW the reasonably priced picks I like in general are Ultem of Ultex picks. Nice bright tone.

[AlanN]

PM me your address and I'll pop a Dunlop Ultex 1.14 teardrop in the mail, it's a good utility pick.

[Richard J]

I found that the Cool Picks are perfect for me, and only cost $1.50 a piece. Comes in many types, I use the Juratex pick which has a great grip. comes in all the normal sizes. http://www.coolmusicinc.com/index.html

[CES]

If you go the Wegen route, you may want to start with a 1.2 mm pick, just because you're used to the thinner 0.88 mm pick. I use the 1.4 mm Wegen on mandolin, and the 1.2mm on octave mandolin and guitar, though I can make either work with either instrument.

Alan's suggestion of the Ultex 1.14 is a good one, and they also make that pick in a 1.4 mm that's not bad, either. I started with a 0.88 Tortex (I think upon the recommendation of Folk of the Wood's site, from way back in the day . I fiddled around with using the point for a while, rolled it over to use the rounded side for a while, and then tried a Fender Heavy pick I'd been flatpicking with on guitar, and haven't gone thinner since. Played the Fender H for about 3 years before I got a Wegen 140 for Christmas one year, and just haven't looked back. I tried a Golden Gate (Dawg-esque in shape), and had the same issue you've had. I really have to dig in to get tone and volume outta that one...I only use it now if I want to very quietly practice for some reason.

Probably the easiest thing to do is go to a guitar shop and try a bunch out, then take a couple home to play with. You'll figure out what you like and sound best with the more you play! Good luck!

[Pepe]

First, I think you've got some terminology confusion going on. Your 0.88mm guitar pick and everything else you've looked at are all called flatpicks. If it's designed to be held between a finger and an opposing thumb, the way we hominids generally do, it can usually be considered a flat pick. It might have divots or scoring or holes drilled or grippy stuff glued on . . . though most don't have any of that.

The vast majority of plectrum pushers since the dawn of twang have made countless hours of happy music with flatpicks the likes of which you can easily afford. I too recommend you buy an assortment of the affordable pick types mando players like & see what you think. If you're near a good music shop, take your mando down there & try a bunch out. Pointier or thinner picks do sound brighter, more rounded ones are as you experienced. As JG mentioned, pick angle will influence your tone; it helps to flatten it out w/rounder picks.

You'll likely find it's an evolutionary, iterative process. Don't obsess about it; there are plenty of folks here who've got your back on the that one

[pefjr]

That's like asking for girlfriend advice. Should a I try a red head or....yadda yadda. Try them all, love em and leave em, and soon you will have a collection, and have to sell them in the Classifieds.

[Tobin]

That's like asking for girlfriend advice. Should a I try a red head or....yadda yadda. Try them all, love em and leave em, and soon you will have a collection, and have to sell them in the Classifieds.

I tried selling a girlfriend in the classifieds once. She did not appreciate it.

[mandoenvy]

I used to play with a dunlop 1mm for years. A friend gave me a Wegen and I didnt like it, so tucked it away. To make a very long story short, I noticed ( for myself) when you use a thinner pick, you pick more gingerly, when you try a thick pick it sounds like you described because you are picking gingerly, you have to play aggressively with thicker picks. I love the wegen now that my picking has changed. Hard to go back to old pick now, feels to floppidy. Wegen seems to have less pick click then the faux tortoise to me and loses less tone on tremelo's.

[bmac]

People have been making great sounding manolin music with two pics for a dollar.... I like the green ones with the turtle on them. Whats the big deal?... Not so long ago lute players used a turkey feather.

[Tom Coletti]

I've been looking for new picks to try, but in the meantime I've been using the blue Dunlop Gator Grip picks (1.14mm) with the point rounded and beveled to my preferences. (If you play with one for about six months, it will wear itself down to a shape that sounds and plays better than a new one, so once I had one that sounded nice, I filed about five or six of them to a similar shape.) It gives me a decent tone & almost no pick noise.

--Tom

[Willie Poole]

Good luck with all of that pick tasting....If your mandolin don`t have"it" a pick won`t make much difference, some mandolins just don`t have a tone that you are looking for...Now when you start trying different mandolins that's when it gets expensive....I have about 100 picks lying around and try all of them at different times and I haven`t found one that I feel is a "perfect" pick for my taste...

Willie

[JeffD]

Perfect is the enemy of good. Find picks you like, keep 'em, find others, keep 'em, and so on. Enjoy.

[mandroid]

Dawg and a Fender 346 are the 2 I use , the big roundy triangle is a 'heavy' ,,
I'd have to order 72 to get the X Heavy. about the same cost as 1 BC.

[Michael Bridges]

Not hyping myself, but I've been doing a bit of pick testing lately. Write-ups on the ones I've tried out in my blog http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/me...-MikeDMandoMan
if you want to check them out. Right now I think the best bang for the buck (for me at least) are the V-Picks. Very good, at a fraction of the BC price. Thing is, everybody's mando, style, fingers and ears are different. What works best for me may not for you.

[Nick Quig]

Dunlop Ultex Triangle 1.14mm is a good (affordable) place to start.

[Alyx Hanson]

I used the Ultex 1.14mm picks for quite a while very happily. And then I got it into my head that I wanted something heavier. My next favourites were the Dunlop Tri-Stubby picks. What with one thing and another I wound up discovering Brossard Picks (NFI), and now use a horn pick for my regular mandos and a bone pick for my octave (the bone is way too bright for a regular mando, IMO). He makes them in a few different styles. I like the "Groovy" ones and the "Solo" ones, as they help my grip. But I've thought about trying the bigger triangular ones, too. Horn does wear down eventually. The bone will eventually, too, I suppose, but it's not going anywhere anytime soon.

[jahscrumb]

Well I posted this yesterday and expected just a few replies, but you guys have blown me away with all the advice. Thanks to everyone who's been responding.

I think the best course of action from here is do what some of you have suggested and go to a local shop to try out as many different picks as I can. I honestly didn't know how much the pick would affect playing style and sound until I tried something different and read all the responses from you guys. Rookie mistake. But I'm honestly very excited to try and get a decent pick collection going that can cover a variety of sounds and styles even if it's a bit intimidating. I've been checking out all the recommendations y'all have made and they all look great. I've also been spending a lot more time with my dawg pick and think I've managed to get a bit of better sound out of my Kentucky 162. I really really like the feel of it and think it's easier to play with than the .88mm I've been using, but I'm still going to search for a sound I like just a little more. Either way, I feel like I've added a bit more to my mando knowledge, and I guess that's what it's all about as a beginner.

[padawan]

PM me your address and I'll pop a Dunlop Ultex 1.14 teardrop in the mail, it's a good utility pick.

I'll second the vote for the Dunlop Ultex 1.14 especially if you like the shape/feel of regular guitar picks. You can get a bag of six for $2.19 at juststrings.com
It will be a little bit thicker than what you are using now but I bet you'll like 'em if you try 'em.

I'm still fairly new to mandolin but I've already got a wide assortment of picks (including BC and Vpics) in my case but those Dunlops are the ones I keep in my pocket.
...because I like them a lot but if I lose one I'm only out 30-ish cents.