Silver Angel Mandolin - Buy in store or have built?

[MandoCando]

Hello,

I've been looking into purchasing a Silver Angel Mandolin from Ken Ratcliff, and I've also been looking for a good used one to keep costs down. One thing I have noticed is there seems to be 2018 (so maybe new) ones in stores for sale. Not everywhere, but I've found a handful. They are significantly cheaper, but I worry a little they may be a little less in quality than if I had one built for me.

Has anyone experienced this when looking? Are there any differences?

For those who have a Silver Angel mandolin, do you love it? I am new to the mandolin and fiddle is my main instrument, but I have really fallen in love with these mandolins. Help me. :-) I wonder if the finger action is easy. I'm still struggling with callouses.

Thank you for any help, advice or knowledge!!

[Br1ck]

I have never seen a new Silverangel for sale in a store. Ken Ratcliff posts instruments he has built in the classifieds all the time, as well as instruments he has taken in trade. Since there are only around four hundred of them around, checking the classifieds or e mailing Ken is your best bet.

All the instruments he builds are of the same good quality. For the last two years at least, he has built a series of basic mandolins and sold them at very reasonable prices. These Econo As sound great.

A big part of their charm is they are quite different from the average mandolin in both delsign and materials, and he is a master of aging a new mandolin. I have owned an A style for a couple of years now. It has a redwood top made from very old wood, and is x braced, and looks like a very old well cared for mandolin. They also have a more pronounced arch that limits the cases you can use. Mine is in a Travelite.

As to sound, they are certainly different, with a very warm resonance, which is a purely subjective choice. I will tell you that I had my mandolin in Gryphon for a minor tweak, and played it head to head with Weber, Collings, and Northfield, and left very satisfied my SA was the equal of any. But different, It's got it's own voice going on. I like it. I'd also like something brighter, but not instead of, but in addition to.

One thing is certain, you will get your money's worth and more. Fiddle tunes are a joy, and it can chop. Ken has been doing some very interesting shapes lately. Do not equate their affordability with any lack of quality, but do realize they're unique. I Certainly can see people not caring for them if bright is what you think the perfect mandolin should be.

They play as good as anything out there. I have yet to try the heavier strings they are voiced for.

[pops1]

A good setup can make any mandolin play easy. The first thing that is usually recommended.

[KEB]

FWIW, I got my Silverangel directly from Ken, and I love it.

I went down to Carter Vintage and played about a 1/2 million dollars worth of instruments last year, and I liked the Silverangel sound more than about 95% of them-- including those by some very well none luthiers selling instruments for over $10k.

Now that's to my ear and maybe not to others, but I'm very happy with my purchase. Incidentally there was a more-expensive Silverangel on the wall there, and I like mine more than that one, so as always, every instrument is different. Hard to make decisions based on big generalities.

[MandoCando]

I have never seen a new Silverangel for sale in a store. Ken Ratcliff posts instruments he has built in the classifieds all the time, as well as instruments he has taken in trade. Since there are only around four hundred of them around, checking the classifieds or e mailing Ken is your best bet.

All the instruments he builds are of the same good quality. For the last two years at least, he has built a series of basic mandolins and sold them at very reasonable prices. These Econo As sound great.

A big part of their charm is they are quite different from the average mandolin in both delsign and materials, and he is a master of aging a new mandolin. I have owned an A style for a couple of years now. It has a redwood top made from very old wood, and is x braced, and looks like a very old well cared for mandolin. They also have a more pronounced arch that limits the cases you can use. Mine is in a Travelite.

As to sound, they are certainly different, with a very warm resonance, which is a purely subjective choice. I will tell you that I had my mandolin in Gryphon for a minor tweak, and played it head to head with Weber, Collings, and Northfield, and left very satisfied my SA was the equal of any. But different, It's got it's own voice going on. I like it. I'd also like something brighter, but not instead of, but in addition to.

One thing is certain, you will get your money's worth and more. Fiddle tunes are a joy, and it can chop. Ken has been doing some very interesting shapes lately. Do not equate their affordability with any lack of quality, but do realize they're unique. I Certainly can see people not caring for them if bright is what you think the perfect mandolin should be.

They play as good as anything out there. I have yet to try the heavier strings they are voiced for.

Thank you, this was really helpful. This makes me believe what I found must have been trade ins. I've been listening to the sound on the internet and boy! I'm blown away.

I will contact him soon as well as keep an eye out for one here.

I appreciate your time in answering!

[MandoCando]

A good setup can make any mandolin play easy. The first thing that is usually recommended.

Wise words indeed. I have found a local shop for this, but perhaps I can find someone at a local jam.

[MandoCando]

FWIW, I got my Silverangel directly from Ken, and I love it.

I went down to Carter Vintage and played about a 1/2 million dollars worth of instruments last year, and I liked the Silverangel sound more than about 95% of them-- including those by some very well none luthiers selling instruments for over $10k.

Now that's to my ear and maybe not to others, but I'm very happy with my purchase. Incidentally there was a more-expensive Silverangel on the wall there, and I like mine more than that one, so as always, every instrument is different. Hard to make decisions based on big generalities.

We don't have large selections here, but I have sample quite a bit. While I haven't played one personally, I've heard plenty online and I can't believe how wonderful the sound is. It's good to know your background in your instrument choice. Very helpful. Thank you!

[Scott Rucker]

Ken sometimes has used ones available that were trade ins on new ones. He also builds new ones that haven't been ordered and may have some available at any time. His handle is KyKen on here if you want to message him. He does also send new ones to dealers to sell for him on commission. That oval hole that keeps showing up in my Reverb suggestions at a shop in St. Louis is an example. I am a big fan and own two of his mandolins. I have several videos of me playing his mandolins on my YouTube channel, user PickStrumFrail, and a couple of SoundCloud recordings, user Scott Rucker, if you want to hear more samples of his sound. I have recordings of me playing some of my other mandolins on both platforms, too, so you should have some comparison material there. I will echo what Br1ck said, they have their own deep sound that isn't the typical "modern" sound like Collings et al and look more hand built than most big name mandolins do. I love his varnish finish work because it has that patina that heavier spray finishes can't get for many decades.

[MandoCando]

Ken sometimes has used ones available that were trade ins on new ones. He also builds new ones that haven't been ordered and may have some available at any time. His handle is KyKen on here if you want to message him. He does also send new ones to dealers to sell for him on commission. That oval hole that keeps showing up in my Reverb suggestions at a shop in St. Louis is an example. I am a big fan and own two of his mandolins. I have several videos of me playing his mandolins on my YouTube channel, user PickStrumFrail, and a couple of SoundCloud recordings, user Scott Rucker, if you want to hear more samples of his sound. I have recordings of me playing some of my other mandolins on both platforms, too, so you should have some comparison material there. I will echo what Br1ck said, they have their own deep sound that isn't the typical "modern" sound like Collings et al and look more hand built than most big name mandolins do. I love his varnish finish work because it has that patina that heavier spray finishes can't get for many decades.

Hello, wow, this is fantastic info! I will spend some time reviewing your channel for comparison. I'll also reach out to Ken. I think I prefer a richer/deeper sound. I'm not too excited about the high sounds. Thank you for sharing this much info.

[Charles E.]

Silver angel "El Toro" in the classifieds.......

https://www.mandolincafe.com/ads/127176#127176

I bought my hardly played Girouard from Kevin a few years ago and he was a pleasure to deal with.

NFI

[Charles E.]

Silverangel Fantasma in the classifieds directly from Ken.....

https://www.mandolincafe.com/ads/127007#127007

NFI

[Boge Quinn]

I recently bought one of Ken's "El Fantasma" mandolins, and I love it. It is absolutely gorgeous and sounds wonderful, deeply mellow and resonant with mucho chop. I also bought his first "Econo A" mandolin, and there is nothing "econo" about it; all it lacks is back binding, otherwise it is fully bound, made from premium woods, and finished (aged) beautifully. Another great instrument! I can't recommend Ken highly enough.

[Br1ck]

Those El Fantasmas have me drooling. Just a postscript to my desire for a mandolin with a brighter voice. I just strung up my Arches kit build and got my wish, a mandolin that is loud, punchy and bright. The polar opposite of my Silverangel, plus it scratched the scroll itch. Boy am I stoked. Took me 10 months and it is still in the white. A mandolin for every mood....

[MandoCando]

I recently bought one of Ken's "El Fantasma" mandolins, and I love it. It is absolutely gorgeous and sounds wonderful, deeply mellow and resonant with mucho chop. I also bought his first "Econo A" mandolin, and there is nothing "econo" about it; all it lacks is back binding, otherwise it is fully bound, made from premium woods, and finished (aged) beautifully. Another great instrument! I can't recommend Ken highly enough.

If you had to choose between your El Fantasma or the Econo A, which would you prefer?

[MandoCando]

Silver angel "El Toro" in the classifieds.......

https://www.mandolincafe.com/ads/127176#127176

I bought my hardly played Girouard from Kevin a few years ago and he was a pleasure to deal with.

NFI

Thank you for looking these up and sharing them. I looked at them earnestly, went to YouTube and watched the videos over and over. That of course led to contacting Ken. YEA!!!

- - - Updated - - -

Silverangel Fantasma in the classifieds directly from Ken.....

https://www.mandolincafe.com/ads/127007#127007

NFI

This was my favorite between the two.

[Br1ck]

I've been going back and forth all day between my SA and my new Arches kit. These are very different mandolins, and I can tell you I'd not want to part with either. I do need to change strings on my SA though. This is the kind of thinking that has me owning six acoustic guitars.

[MandoCando]

Thank you everyone for your help and encouragement. I contacted Ken and I'll be a Fantasma owner very soon! Can't wait. Now, to figure out how to play it well. LOL

[Bill Kammerzell]

I have never seen a new Silverangel for sale in a store.

Bradford and Company Fret Shop in Kansas City Mo sells New Silverangels, from time to time. They have one, brand new listed very reasonably right now. A Fantasma.

https://reverb.com/item/13094541-sil...rc=aw.ds&pla=1

[soliver]

I'm at about 80% on saving up for an SA Econo A... I'm excited for the customization I can do and am Excited to get a hand made instrument built for ME at such a great price.

[Br1ck]

I'm getting vicarious goosebumps in anticipation of your pending happiness. I can't imagine a better tone for fiddle tunes, or the satisfaction of a one builder instrument.

[jdchapman]

My wife bought mine for me at Gruhn's 20 years ago. Ken was just starting then, I guess. It's currently the only mandolin I own. I've traded, bought and sold probably ten good instruments in the years since, but it remains my favorite.

[Br1ck]

Here is where it pays to be in the Southeast. Chances of finding something hanging on the wall in a store is much greater the closer you are to the builder. I bought mine on a chance 10 minutes before I was going out the door to buy a new MT. I figured buying a used Silverangel would save me enough I could live with however it sounded. It was just gravy that I loved everything about it. To this day I've never laid hands on another.

[MandoCando]

I'm getting vicarious goosebumps in anticipation of your pending happiness. I can't imagine a better tone for fiddle tunes, or the satisfaction of a one builder instrument.

Thank you! What a kind thought. Oh! I meant to ask you. Your SA is in need of strings. What will you put on there?

[MandoCando]

My wife bought mine for me at Gruhn's 20 years ago. Ken was just starting then, I guess. It's currently the only mandolin I own. I've traded, bought and sold probably ten good instruments in the years since, but it remains my favorite.

That's really a testament to how great these mandolins are and how they remain through the years.

- - - Updated - - -

Here is where it pays to be in the Southeast. Chances of finding something hanging on the wall in a store is much greater the closer you are to the builder. I bought mine on a chance 10 minutes before I was going out the door to buy a new MT. I figured buying a used Silverangel would save me enough I could live with however it sounded. It was just gravy that I loved everything about it. To this day I've never laid hands on another.

Now that would be a sweet deal!

[MandoCando]

I'm at about 80% on saving up for an SA Econo A... I'm excited for the customization I can do and am Excited to get a hand made instrument built for ME at such a great price.

YES!! I'm excited for you. It's going to be incredible.

PS: I love your armrests! Have you ever created a fiddle chin rest?