Kentucky/Eastman Oval Comparison

[JerseyPicker]

Hey all,

I'm wanting to buy another mandolin, an oval hole this time, and am trying to decide between going with a Kentucky or Eastman. The necks of each join the body at different frets; the Eastman has a shorter neck and the Kentucky has a longer one. Which do you all prefer? Is there an appreciable difference in sound, or is it just a comfort thing of being able to play up the neck? Are there any sound samples I can reference to compare?

I already have an Eastman 605, so I'm leaning towards the Kentucky to try and mix things up a bit, but I'm curious to learn other's opinions before pulling the trigger.

[colorado_al]

It depends on what you're looking for. I played both Eastman MD-504 and Kentucky KM-272 side by side and they are quite different in feel and tone.
The Eastman is made more like older Gibson oval A4 mandolins with the fingerboard glued to the body, attached at the 12th fret, and has a more Gibson-esque sound. Woody, and a bit tubby. The neck however felt the same as the Eastman MD-505 in profile with a mild V, albeit about an inch shorter. It also is radiused and has traditional small fretwire. Whereas old Gibson necks are much thicker and D shaped.

The Kentucky is more of a modern mandolin. The neck is raised off the body like an A5 and attached at the 14th fret. The neck profile is a bit deeper than the Eastman with a D shape, but not nearly as thick as old Gibsons. The tone is punchier than the Eastman, but still had good low end like an oval usually does. The fingerboard is also radiused and has larger modern style fretwire.

Playability on both was good. If you move up the neck a lot, you might want the extra room that the Kentucky provides, if not, then either would work well.

I ended up going with the Kentucky because I liked the sound of it better, but just personal preference. If you have the chance you should play them both.

Maybe I'll go by my local Eastman dealer and bring my Kentucky and I'll video them side by side for you. I'm always looking for excuses to stop in there.

[Trav'linmando]

I have a Eastman 404. My second favorite to play. Personally I like the sound and feel of it. As Al noted above, the 404 has a different feel (neck) and sound. It is definitely a old sound. Also the back and sides of the 404 are mahogany which contributes to that tone.

[JerseyPicker]

Maybe I'll go by my local Eastman dealer and bring my Kentucky and I'll video them side by side for you. I'm always looking for excuses to stop in there.

I wish I had a local Mandolin store to try things out at. If you happen to have the opportunity (excuse?) to do this, I would greatly appreciate a side by side video.

[colorado_al]

I wish I had a local Mandolin store to try things out at. If you happen to have the opportunity (excuse?) to do this, I would greatly appreciate a side by side video.

Seems like a good day to knock off work a tad early and drop by. I'll post the video as soon as I can.

[colorado_al]

Well, they didn't have an Eastman oval in stock, but they did have a Lyon & Healy Style B.
I just had my crappy cell phone to record, so the sound quality isn't great, but here you go:

[MikeZito]

Here is a review of a Kentucky KM-272:
https://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/s...-272&highlight

and here is an audio/video sample:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HeBMkN5YcC8

I hope it helps.

[rcc56]

You might want to consider an old Gibson or L & H. You can find Gibson A's starting at $1200 in decent condition, and can probably find an L & H model C for around $1500.

Lyon & Healy's are anything but "tubby." Some Gibson A's are, some aren't. I've never played an F-2 or F-4 that I would consider to be particularly tubby. The scroll models may not be in your price range, though.

If you prefer necks that are smaller in profile, most L & H's will fit the bill, except for the earliest ones with 2 digit serial numbers. Gibson necks rarely bother me, though, except for the modern ones. I never had any trouble reaching a high A on any of the old short neck mandolins. I don't play the long "chop" chord any higher than maybe D at the most. I don't know why many people require the long neck-- many say the need it, but they don't play up there much, if at all . . .

[colorado_al]

I don't know why many people require the long neck-- many say the need it, but they don't play up there much, if at all . . .

Sometimes I play notes so high that only dogs can hear them. Sometimes I play other notes that make you wish only dogs could hear them!

I'll be in Denver on Monday and I'll stop by the Denver Folklore Center. It looks like they have an Eastman MD-404 oval. I'll try to get some clips of it and my Kentucky KM-272 for you.

[JerseyPicker]

Well, they didn't have an Eastman oval in stock, but they did have a Lyon & Healy Style B.
I just had my crappy cell phone to record, so the sound quality isn't great, but here you go:

Thanks for posting this video, sounds great! From RCC56's post, it seems that these go for $1500? Bit out of my budget, so I'm considering the Kentucky/Eastman ovals. ...Then again, there is that Gibson A at the Guitar Center in Maryland (https://www.guitarcenter.com/Used/Gi...le-Mandolin.gc). Bit of a drive, but I might go check it out.

Here is a review of a Kentucky KM-272:
https://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/s...-272&highlight

and here is an audio/video sample:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HeBMkN5YcC8

I hope it helps.

Nice review/video; thanks for sharing! What a pretty sound that one has.

[soliver]

I'm saving up for an oval myself. I wen't to the best place in the Atlanta area (Maple Street Guitars) to try some stuff out. I really wanted to play some of the Eastman ovals, but they didn't have any. I gave the Kentucky KM272 a go, but it it was the exact same one they had 2 years ago when I bought my Eastman, so it is an older model. I liked it but I've played an MD 305 for a majority of my time playing and have been very pleased, but have been feeling like its time to upgrade to that next tier, so I gave the Collings MTO a try... I had a friend tell me once that if you can't afford a Collings, don't play one... that is true... it was suweeeet. But I could never get there, so I have decided to save up for a Silverangel Econo A with an oval hole, which is much more attainable and I'm about 1/2 way there.... Maple street is expecting delivery of an Eastman MD 404 sometime soon and I hope to give that a try, but we'll see... anybody wanna buy and armrest?

[KoalaBear]

I'm saving up for an oval myself. I wen't to the best place in the Atlanta area (Maple Street Guitars) to try some stuff out. I really wanted to play some of the Eastman ovals, but they didn't have any. I gave the Kentucky KM272 a go, but it it was the exact same one they had 2 years ago when I bought my Eastman, so it is an older model. I liked it but I've played an MD 305 for a majority of my time playing and have been very pleased, but have been feeling like its time to upgrade to that next tier, so I gave the Collings MTO a try... I had a friend tell me once that if you can't afford a Collings, don't play one... that is true... it was suweeeet. But I could never get there, so I have decided to save up for a Silverangel Econo A with an oval hole, which is much more attainable and I'm about 1/2 way there.... Maple street is expecting delivery of an Eastman MD 404 sometime soon and I hope to give that a try, but we'll see... anybody wanna buy and armrest?

Great to he hear that you are frequenting reputable store to play various oval style.... the 305 has a pleasing sound almost bought it but the Kentucky KM onefifty provides the alluring sound for me so now have it.Like you have my eyes on the high end MandoLords and have been playing Collings that are out of my league but am placing the
KM 1000 on my wish list.I keep on hearing about this phantom Silverangel that you mention and it would be interesting to have specs and a photo or it. It’s oval ?

[Em Tee]

I don't know that Mr Ratcliff (silverangel) makes A style oval holes often but I believe there is one for sale at Bradford & Co. Otherwise you can commission one directly from the Luthier. Mr. Ratcliff has said that he plans to make and sell f hole a-style econos over the summer, if that strikes your fancy. You should see them in the classifieds here.

[Em Tee]

If you are going the way of high end mandos, I recommend pava. They are built by the same luthiers that build ellis mandolins and have a great sound. They sometimes come up used in the classifieds for around $1800. But whether you go any of the mid level major brands (Collings, Pava, Weber, etc) there's really no wrong choice.

[Verne Andru]

I have a short-neck oval (my avatar) and long-neck f5 style. Even though there isn't that much difference in measure, I do find a difference in playing feel. Going from the short to the long there is a noticeable "stretch" going on until I get used to it again. Not much but enough to notice.

I also find the short neck lays flatter from body to head-stock so I can set it up for better action. Not sure if that is just mine or not though.

[soliver]

...I keep on hearing about this phantom Silverangel that you mention and it would be interesting to have specs and a photo or it. It’s oval ?

Ken Ratcliff's Silverangel Mandos have a good reputation around these parts, and his "Econo A" model is very affordable. As with most Luthiers he primarily makes ff hole instruments, but if you ask, you shall receive. Here is his website: http://silverangelmandolins.com/SM/

I don't know that Mr Ratcliff (silverangel) makes A style oval holes often but I believe there is one for sale at Bradford & Co. Otherwise you can commission one directly from the Luthier. Mr. Ratcliff has said that he plans to make and sell f hole a-style econos over the summer, if that strikes your fancy. You should see them in the classifieds here.

No you don't see them that often, but you do every so often. I've exchanged a few emails with him and he will build the Econo A with an Oval hole if you ask, which is what I intend to do... whenever I get the funds saved up!

[Br1ck]

I don't know that Mr Ratcliff (silverangel) makes A style oval holes often but I believe there is one for sale at Bradford & Co. Otherwise you can commission one directly from the Luthier. Mr. Ratcliff has said that he plans to make and sell f hole a-style econos over the summer, if that strikes your fancy. You should see them in the classifieds here.

My Silverangel, while not an oval, is a mandolin leaning in that direction. If you order an Econo, Ken might just make you one if you ask. He has made them.

But my redwood top is cross braced and the G string is very resonant. While still much more focused than an old teens Gibson, I think you wiould really like one. They come up in the classifieds quite often at very attractive prices, and you can play bluegrass on one.

[itstooloudMike]

You might want to check out the Redline Traveler. Steve Smith makes those in Nashville, at his shop (Cumberland Acoustics). I've played several of these, and they sound really full, loud, and complex for a flat-top design. Last time I checked, Steve was selling these new for about $900. That's a lot of USA-made mandolin for less than $1K. And Steve's setup work is second to none.

[Em Tee]

Here is a review of a Kentucky KM-272:
https://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/s...-272&highlight

and here is an audio/video sample:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HeBMkN5YcC8

I hope it helps.

Mike, what kind of strings do you have on your 272 in that vid?

[MikeZito]

Mike, what kind of strings do you have on your 272 in that vid?

If I remember correctly, that video was done with a set of D'Addario EJ-73's that were very close to needing to be changed . . .

[JerseyPicker]

You might want to check out the Redline Traveler. Steve Smith makes those in Nashville, at his shop (Cumberland Acoustics). I've played several of these, and they sound really full, loud, and complex for a flat-top design. Last time I checked, Steve was selling these new for about $900. That's a lot of USA-made mandolin for less than $1K. And Steve's setup work is second to none.

How does the tone compare to a Big Muddy/Mid Mo? I tried one with a walnut back and spruce top; wasn't a fan of the tone. Flat tops just aren't my thing - unless maybe they sound markedly different from maker to maker or wood to wood.