Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 26 to 50 of 50

Thread: "Crusher" Value?

  1. #26
    Registered User Atlanta Mando Mike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Atlanta, Georgia
    Posts
    730

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    It's really something that can't be known because there is no market and very little to compare it to. If it was put up for sale, there is just no telling. We are talking about an instrument that is generally considered the best mandolin in the world with huge provenance. With his connection to Garcia, the possibility of an extremely rich collector paying up big is real. My opinion is that you easily double normal Loar value and you have a really good chance of many multiples of that. If I had a ton of money and the mandolin came up for sale, I'd be willing to shell out a lot of money for it... But that's just me. That's how influential he is to me, how important that mandolin is to me, etc... And I'm fully aware its him and not the mandolin that gets his sound, but still, that mandolin is the holy grail to me. I've heard rumors that Tony was offered $1m for his guitar and I have no doubt that it would sell for close to that because of some extremely rich uber fan.

  2. The following members say thank you to Atlanta Mando Mike for this post:


  3. #27

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    Agree that it is kind of a weird question, but I am just that kind of a weirdo, I guess. The trouble with an artist selling their prized instrument is that in order to benefit from its financial worth, they would have to give it up, which is their bread and butter, and maybe even part of their identity, if you will. About 25 years ago Dickie Betts sold his original Goldtop Les Paul that he used with the Allman Brothers, I believe it was in Gruhn's catalog for $35K -- good money for back then, but certainly not life-changing money, IMHO. Of course, Betts still owns plenty of guitars, if he needs one to play and he sounds great on any of them. Danny Gatton many years before death, sold his main telecaster to a fan for money that enabled him to buy a model A Ford that he got to enjoy. I think at the time, he got several times the guitars current value, but again it was certainly not life-changing money, maybe $25-30K, when you could buy a similar guitar for maybe $5K from a vintage dealer. And, again, Gatton owned many guitars, including the ones that he got new from Fender for free, so maybe not a bad deal in the scheme of things.

    In the case of Crusher or Reichman's Loar, most of the value is still based on what it is as a Loar, as I see it. Which, certainly would provide a nice retirement cushion, if either of the gentlemen need the money. As far as what an internet billionaire hipster might pay, sure, the sky is the limit, but we don't base actual sales prices on stuff like that. Microsoft co-founder Paul Allen wins every auction he bids on when it comes to historic rock'n'roll guitars because nobody can outbid him, but I'm not sure the prices he pays have any basis in reality, he just is in a rare position to "eliminate the competition." (He owns Hendrix' guitars, Clapton's blackie and brownie, etc.) To his credit, most of his collection is on public display, as far as I know.

    There is also the infamous Big Pharma billionaire who paid $2 million for the only copy of Wu Tang Clan's double CD.............

    There used to be an old expression about having more dollars than sense.....

  4. #28

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    Many of the multimillion dollar violins are owned by very rich arts patrons and lent to major soloists and symphonies, many whose concert masters play them.

    I can't see this ever happening in the mandolin world because there is no social status impact for supporting bluegrass. It would be nice to see some of the more successful country/bluegrass/Americana artists buying those Loars and lending them to young up and comers. Perhaps a year loan of a Loar to major contest winners.
    Silverangel A
    Arches F style kit
    1913 Gibson A-1

  5. #29

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    I believe Steve Martin owns a Loar and lends it out, IIRC.

  6. #30
    Registered User JAK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    California
    Posts
    804

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    I started this thread only for "brain food" and speculation, nothing more, so don't take it seriously if it is upsetting to you. Not long ago I asked John Reischman if he ever had any offers to buy his Loar, and he said he'd had a couple. He didn't say how much was offered, and I didn't ask. I'll bet Dawg has had some offers too....
    John A. Karsemeyer

  7. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to JAK For This Useful Post:


  8. #31
    Registered User Timbofood's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Kalamazoo, MI.
    Posts
    7,486

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    Well, since this is just a fishing expedition, what is Wake Frankfields Loar worth?
    Not that I’m buying any of them but, it does make one wonder.
    Timothy F. Lewis
    "If brains was lard, that boy couldn't grease a very big skillet" J.D. Clampett

  9. The following members say thank you to Timbofood for this post:


  10. #32
    Mando accumulator allenhopkins's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Rochester NY 14610
    Posts
    17,378

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    Quote Originally Posted by Atlanta Mando Mike View Post
    ...We are talking about an instrument that is generally considered the best mandolin in the world with huge provenance....you easily double normal Loar value and you have a really good chance of many multiples of that. ...I'd be willing to shell out a lot of money for it... But that's just me. That's how influential he is to me, how important that mandolin is to me, etc...that mandolin is the holy grail to me...
    Mike, you're the kind of fan who -- if you had the money -- could put the price of a mandolin like "Crusher" into seven figures, if you got locked in a bidding war with another equally committed Grisman devotee.

    The point I tried to make several posts ago, was that the astronomical prices certain instruments bring, are more related to the person who's played them, than to the inherent acoustical quality of the instruments. Hendrix's or Clapton's electric guitars, Scruggs's banjo, Gillespie's trumpet, Parker's alto sax -- are they really that much better than similar make-and-model instruments, that were played by "ordinary" musicians? My feeling is "no," that the million dollars for Monroe's Loar F-5 is about Monroe, not the instrument.

    Would "Crusher" be "generally considered the best mandolin in the world" if I played it? Doubt it -- though I stand ready to try the experiment, any time at all. It would definitely be considered the best mandolin I have, though.
    Allen Hopkins
    Gibsn: '54 F5 3pt F2 A-N Custm K1 m'cello
    Natl Triolian Dobro mando
    Victoria b-back Merrill alumnm b-back
    H-O mandolinetto
    Stradolin Vega banjolin
    Sobell'dola Washburn b-back'dola
    Eastmn: 615'dola 805 m'cello
    Flatiron 3K OM

  11. #33
    Registered Muser dang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Omaha, NE
    Posts
    1,185

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    Priceless - in his hands!

    In my hands... below regular Gibson Loar era market value
    I should be pickin' rather than postin'

  12. #34
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    4,881

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    If ever a thread needed to be dumped this is one...SO STUPID....

  13. The following members say thank you to Willie Poole for this post:


  14. #35
    Loarcutus of MandoBorg DataNick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Fallbrook, CA
    Posts
    3,837

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    I get your sentiment Willie, especially as it pertains to post after post of endless speculation. I'm not prepared to say that the OP's curiosity is stupid however.

    There is a real world bottom line answer though: Crusher is worth the appraisal value that an insurer like Lloyd's of London is willing to insure the instrument for. And that answer is something that only the Dawg knows...YMMV
    1994 Gibson F5L - Weber signed


    "Mandolin brands are a guide, not gospel! I don't drink koolaid and that Emperor is naked!"
    "If you wanna get soul Baby, you gots to get the scroll..."
    "I would rather play music anyday for the beggar, the thief, and the fool!"
    "Perfection is not attainable; but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence" Vince Lombardi
    Playing Style: RockMonRoll Desperado Bluegrass Desperado YT Channel

  15. #36
    Registered User Ivan Kelsall's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Manchester - Lancashire - NW England
    Posts
    14,187

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    Hi Nick - The other opinion is that any item is only worth what somebody is willing to play for it. As they say, 'maybe the answer lies somewhere in between' - wherever that might be ?,
    Ivan
    Weber F-5 'Fern'.
    Lebeda F-5 "Special".
    Stelling Bellflower BANJO
    Tokai - 'Tele-alike'.
    Ellis DeLuxe "A" style.

  16. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Ivan Kelsall For This Useful Post:


  17. #37
    Registered User Timbofood's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Kalamazoo, MI.
    Posts
    7,486

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    It’s rather like “Antiques Roadshow”
    Folks can “say” anything they want, when the check book come mes out is when the true value is determined.
    Timothy F. Lewis
    "If brains was lard, that boy couldn't grease a very big skillet" J.D. Clampett

  18. The following members say thank you to Timbofood for this post:


  19. #38
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    4,881

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    I didn`t mean the OP was stupid for asking, I meant it was stupid that the discussion has gone on for so long...ANYTHING is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it also I bet most of the posters on here, myself included , wouldn`t even consider buying it and taking a big chance that it would increase in value...Just maybe Dawg will really get 10 times more popular than he is now and then it might be worth discussing...

    Willie

  20. #39
    Registered User almeriastrings's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Almeria, Spain
    Posts
    5,442
    Blog Entries
    3

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    Whatever it is worth, and whatever anyone ever paid for it, they would never sound like the Dawg... and in the end, that's that! Once you discard lower end instruments, and enter the sphere of the really fine to incredibly great ones, it is the player, not the instrument that really either has it, or does not.... you can give a person a nice camera... but will they ever take a single picture as great as Cartier-Bresson? Almost certainly not. So what is Cartier-Bresson's camera worth? My answer: who cares? It was the person behind it that mattered. Not the metal or the glass.
    Gibson F5 'Harvey' Fern, Gibson F5 'Derrington' Fern
    Distressed Silverangel F 'Esmerelda' aka 'Maxx'
    Northfield Big Mon #127
    Ellis F5 Special #288
    '39 & '45 D-18's, 1950 D-28.

  21. The following members say thank you to almeriastrings for this post:


  22. #40

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    The question is.......................would the new owner remove the dog on the peghead?

  23. #41
    Registered User JAK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    California
    Posts
    804

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    Bill would have....
    John A. Karsemeyer

  24. #42
    Registered Muser dang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Omaha, NE
    Posts
    1,185

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    Quote Originally Posted by JAK View Post
    Bill would have....
    ...with a pocket knife, but only after he was mad at it cause it bit him.
    I should be pickin' rather than postin'

  25. #43

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Mando View Post
    I believe Steve Martin owns a Loar and lends it out, IIRC.
    I believe Mike Guggino of the Steep Canyon Rangers play's Steve Martin's Loar unless he's given it back in the last couple years.

  26. The following members say thank you to KEB for this post:


  27. #44
    Registered User Ivan Kelsall's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Manchester - Lancashire - NW England
    Posts
    14,187

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    From Timothy - " It’s rather like “Antiques Roadshow ”. Spot on Tim,& don't we see thing go both ways so often ?. We have a UK TV prog. called ''Flog it'' - People bring in items to be valued by professional valuers & then sold. I recently saw an item which was expected to sell for between £80 - £120 UK sell for over £2,000 . However very often it goes the other way & the items sell for their ''reserve'' (bottom line) price. https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Flog+it It really does depend on what value a person or persons put on any item,& as we know,if 2 or more people want the same item,they can bid one another through the roof,thus creating an artificially higher price. The next item of the same kind coming up for auction,might make a small % of that price if only 1 person wants it,
    Ivan
    Weber F-5 'Fern'.
    Lebeda F-5 "Special".
    Stelling Bellflower BANJO
    Tokai - 'Tele-alike'.
    Ellis DeLuxe "A" style.

  28. #45
    Registered User Timbofood's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Kalamazoo, MI.
    Posts
    7,486

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    I think you and I see much too much both ways Ivan
    Timothy F. Lewis
    "If brains was lard, that boy couldn't grease a very big skillet" J.D. Clampett

  29. #46
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    4,881

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    Tim and Ivan, I used to go to a few auctions in the town where I lived at that time, it took me a while to figure out that the fellow that was hosting the sale was getting a commission on what was sold and then I found that he also would bid on objects to get them to a higher price, one time I was bidding of two tires for my car and when I noticed that he had a special signal to make a bid I dropped out and the following week he asked me if wanted those tries at the last price that I bid for them, I asked him what if I don`t and he said he would just keep putting them up for sale until someone bought them, I did buy them but for a few bucks less than my final bid...He was a shyster from the word go...

    WE get some Antique Road Shows that are filmed in England.....

    Willie

  30. The following members say thank you to Willie Poole for this post:


  31. #47
    Registered User Timbofood's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Kalamazoo, MI.
    Posts
    7,486

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    Yep, there are shills in any business like that! I’ve spotted the “ear tug” once or twice at auctions too.
    It happens.
    Timothy F. Lewis
    "If brains was lard, that boy couldn't grease a very big skillet" J.D. Clampett

  32. The following members say thank you to Timbofood for this post:


  33. #48
    Registered User Ivan Kelsall's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Manchester - Lancashire - NW England
    Posts
    14,187

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    At most auctions,the auction house gets 2 commissions,one from the seller & one from the buyer. At many UK auctions that can be 17% (or more) + tax. getting a commission from both sides can add up to a lot of cash if an item is pretty expensive.
    http://www.exploreauctions.co.uk/auc...mmissions.html
    Ivan
    Weber F-5 'Fern'.
    Lebeda F-5 "Special".
    Stelling Bellflower BANJO
    Tokai - 'Tele-alike'.
    Ellis DeLuxe "A" style.

  34. The following members say thank you to Ivan Kelsall for this post:


  35. #49
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Location
    North Florida
    Posts
    38

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    I concur with Allen, it dovetails nicely with that old Roosevelt paradigm, particularly referenced as the "men in the arena"............. give the great instruments to them, the barvae men in the arena (the pickers), as opposed to the collectors (criticizing non-players who don't play (the timid men who never know the thrill of victory nor defeat.)

  36. #50

    Default Re: "Crusher" Value?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheephead Shawn View Post
    ............. give the great instruments to them, the barvae men in the arena (the pickers), as opposed to the collectors (criticizing non-players who don't play (the timid men who never know the thrill of victory nor defeat.)
    I agree up to a point. My buddy has a gig in a week and wanted to borrow an amp. I said sure -- then I remember why he needs an amp -- his last two amps were ruined when he knocked his beer over and fried them (yep, he did the same thing twice -- two different amps -- two different occassions -- great player, he was just having too much fun) ..........oops!

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •