Material cost to build

[Drew Streip]

Hi all! I'm soon embarking on my first mandolin build, in part thanks to other Cafe members who have supplied some of my materials.

Experienced builders: I'm wondering what your average total materials cost is per mandolin (excluding tools, because I have most of the basics).

For reference, if I input the things I already have + the parts I need to finish, I'm looking at somewhere between $350 and $400. I'm primarily using suppliers like LMII and StewMac for accessories.

Does this sound about right for a single instrument? I know there are discounts for buying in bulk, but I'm not ready spend a few thousand just to save a couple hundred

[soliver]

Cool beans Drew!... I'm excited to see how this goes for you.... I've got too many kids and home improvement projects to take on mandolin building. Have to live vicariously through somebody!

[Drew Streip]

I also have too many other projects, but I don't let things like logic stop me!

To clarify my OP a little bit, I'm not necessarily interested in finding the cheapest materials -- I will still prioritize quality. So for example, I'll probably pick some Rubner tuners, a cast tailpiece, etc.

Thanks in advance!

[Bill McCall]

What's the purpose of the question? Cost is probably really proprietary to each builder/business, and you can spend almost any amount on specific tone woods, like more than that budget just for top and back, or maybe top alone. I don't think I'd share that with people building in the same market. When I was buying material in the trade, sometimes by the truckload, I certainly didn't share suppliers and price with my competitors.

[Drew Streip]

Only to see if I'm way out of line. People talk about building their own instruments because they can't afford the one they want. I was just curious if I'm spending more than my finished product will be worth. That is, if it doesn't sound at least as good as, say, an average $400 Kentucky, then I might as well just save my money for a professionally built instrument.

I'm not a competitor to anybody, much less the builders here. I'm not trying to get anybody to spill their trade secrets. We all know how much it costs to buy a piece of tonewood -- prices are very clearly listed at Stewmac, LMI, Old Standard and others. Only curious about the economics of building one instrument.

[Dale Ludewig]

I'd say, as a builder, the first thing you have to do is separate material costs other than hardware (tuners, bridge, tailpiece) from wooden stuff and binding, truss rod, and such. Small builders' costs on the wood stuff is pretty close to each other. Certainly, you should be able to get that stuff for $200-300, easily. But when you get into MOP and abalone, and the hardware mentioned above, you can drop another $300-800, or more depending on your choices.

[Drew Streip]

For sure! Thanks Dale. Good points. It's nice to have the freedom to choose the hardware that I hang on it.

The biggest delta I've seen is between something like a $4 "adjustable compensated ebony bridge" on eBay and a $60 Randy Wood bridge from StewMac. My gut tells me to go in the middle.

Actually, my gut tells me to hold off purchasing until I've made sure that I can actually make a mandolin-shaped wooden box -- but that's another story.

[fscotte]

$500 for a plain jane A model is about right. The most expensive items for me is:

CA Bridge: $65
Tailpiece: $100 for Allen tp
Tuners: $60-$80 (grovers), although I did find some 308's for $25 a set
Carbon Fiber truss rod: $30
Pearl inlay precut: $70 for logo and flowerpot (I have David Nichols do it).

So right there is over $300 and haven't even started building the thing yet.

I find my own hard maple in long boards at my secret yellow airplane lumber supply. I get 4 backs for about $50.
For the tops I like Old World Tonewood from WV. Red Spruce $40.
Binding is expensive because of the $25 added hazardous shipping fee. So order ALOT at once.
I get fretboard with slots precut. I still shape them.
Ebony overlays are essential of course. $20
Mahogany blocks for tail and head are cheap. You can find blocks anywhere that sells exotic woods.
Fretwire, cheap.
Inlay dots, cheap.
Pearl nut, $15.
Endpin, cheap.
Truss rod cover, pearl is $20, plastic is cheap.

And of course, you need to add in the cost of a quart of nitro lacquer and dye. Then all the sandpaper and additional material to finish the thing. Spray equipment, alcohol, brushes, etc..

It all adds up quick.

[Drew Streip]

Thanks for your detailed run-down! That looks about like my spreadsheet. Some of the incidentals I already have -- I just built a ukulele kit, and I also have a dreadnought kit that I've yet to start.

Tangential: Do you use a carbon fiber truss rod in all your instruments? And if so, have you ever had issues with lack of adjustability?

[fscotte]

Have used CF rods from first build. I find if I make the neck with a very slight back bow, it will be flat when strings are up to tension. It doesnt budge from that and never will.

[HoGo]

All depends where you buy and how much you buy... When I built my first mandolin I spent more on tuners than all the rest together, I used (otherwise master grade) top wood rejected by violin makers as it had knot, but I managed to fit the top in the blank so the knot got cut away. I used plain maple for neck and ribs from lumberyard and again rejected maple back unfortunately with pin knot right in the center but the mandolin plays fine even with the knot... I made bridge from offcuts from fingerboard and headstock overlay ebony and made tailpiece out of stainless steel. Bone for nuts was from our soup. I used wood bindings for the first and simple white plastic later that came from a large sheet of plastic (old factory sign of GOK plastic).
Many makers buy wood in bulk directly in log form (heard of Gilchrist D log?) so they save a lot not only because quantity but they can use the wood more economically using pieces with knots where they know they will be carved away (but tonewood suppliers typically sell mostly defect free wedges so throw knotty pieces away.
We bought whole nice curly maple tree (raw log approx 2' downto 1 1/2' diameter over 18' length) right from the forest ground and had it cut into long wedges (2-3" wide at bark) at their new bandsaw and it cost us approximately $200. After few years of drying we cut it into more manageable lengths and planed surfaces to see defects and cut away really bad pieces. I estimate there is over 100 mandolins in there if we try to work around pin knots and many ribs and necks extra.

[Br1ck]

Many of the above posts remind me why I thought an Arches kit was a great way to start a first build. I thought my first build would have greater chance of sucess having some of the critical steps done.

There are some body shells and neck blanks sold now and then in the classifieds too.

[Drew Streip]

Many of the above posts remind me why I thought an Arches kit was a great way to start a first build. I thought my first build would have greater chance of sucess having some of the critical steps done.

There are some body shells and neck blanks sold now and then in the classifieds too.

That’s what I bought! A rim and neck set from KTerry. And some top/back wood from Spruce. I still have a LOT of work but I’m excited about trying.

I’m very far from buying a whole log

Thanks again, all! For the advice, the supplies and the knowledge.

[Tom Haywood]

Of course, it depends on what style of mandolin you plan to build too, and how plain or fancy you want it. No matter what else, basic tuners, fret wire, and tailpiece are going to run you about 70.00 - 100.00 with shipping. For an A or F model it is easy to get 300 - 800 in it before you even start building. So, looks like with Keith's rim and neck and buying basic necessary hardware, you are approaching 200.00 now. I can see another 100.00 in getting the remainder of what you need without getting too fancy.

[Dave Sheets]

About $150 to $250 in parts for a mandolin or fiddle for me, but that's with very basic tuners and tailpiece, wood binding, a good top and locally source or scavenged maple or walnut. I'm cheap, and just doing it for fun, but it makes me happy to build them. As entertainment, the cost per hour is actually pretty low

[Marty Jacobson]

Nobody has mentioned tools yet. If you haven't made an archtop yet, you'll need some. You can just put that on your spreadsheet like this:

Tools......................................... $ For everything Else There's Mastercard.00

[yankees1]

I would think that on a first build you would not want to use very expensive materials until after more experience and completion of a number of mandolins.

[Drew Streip]

Nobody has mentioned tools yet. If you haven't made an archtop yet, you'll need some. You can just put that on your spreadsheet like this:

Tools......................................... $ For everything Else There's Mastercard.00

Yeah, I’m not factoring tools. Partly because I have inherited from my grandfather or bought most of what I need (besides a curved sole plane) and because I know I’ll use them again.

Regarding materials, I’m not getting anything fancy. if the whole thing turns out to be a dud, then I’ll have spare hardware for my other mandolins or future attempts.

Thanks again!

[Br1ck]

I would think that on a first build you would not want to use very expensive materials until after more experience and completion of a number of mandolins.

On the other hand, why go to all that trouble without giving yourself the best chance for a good mandolin? I'm hoping I can build a mandolin that sounds pretty good. I know fit and finish is going to be rough and have accepted that, but I'm after something that plays and sounds good. I know any Pac Rim factory can make one prettier.

It is hard for me to find instruments to practice repair on. I don't want to waste time on an instrument that doesn't have potential, nor do I want to ruin a fine old Martin.

Yes, tools can add significantly to your cost. You have to just buy them as you go and treat it like the hobby expense it is. You can spend $400 on a golf club too, or thousands on a fly rod, or tens of thousands on a bass boat.

[Jeff Mando]

There are many ways to look at it or justify it. It sounds like a labor of love. On the surface, it looks like a great way to lose money, but as previously stated, it is a hobby and a learning experience. I'm guessing, and I may be wrong, but it looks like it would take several attempts before making a successful mandolin. And, even more attempts before creating a beautiful and great sounding mandolin. For me, the X factor is, "how artistic are you?" when it comes to woodworking and design and finishing. And, are you good at small detail work? In other words, being a great mandolin player probably has nothing to do with being a great mandolin builder.

[fscotte]

Ive never understood the build with cheap materials philosophy either. I find that I am more exact and patient when working with materials that arent expendable.

Dont cut costs. If you fail then so be it. Like the classic dovetail joint. Its hard, its complex, youll never get it right until the 20th time, dont use expensive wood..

Hogwash... I jumped into the dt joint on my very first time. I didnt get it to seat all the way down into the joint when I glued it up.. Bummer. Came here and asked how to fix it. and learned to drill two holes and build a steamer with a basketball needle. Steamed the joint and used clamps to push it down into the joint.

Problem solved and I learned two valuable lessons on my first dt joint.

[HoGo]

I would think that on a first build you would not want to use very expensive materials until after more experience and completion of a number of mandolins.

There is no correlation between price and quality of materials. It has been mentioned in many other threads that you can get excellent materials for cheap, the main difference being they are not two mouse-clicks away from your wallet but you have to look around for "other" alternative sources like lmberyards and piles of discarded wood from makers of other instruments....
Back when I started the tuners were the most expensive part of whole build, I paid what would be equivalent of $50 or so for set of Schallers while the rest of the build including all tools (I took it to extreme and built most of my tools as well) didn't cost me more than $20...

[amowry]

I average close to $1,000 for cost of goods sold per instrument. That includes Rubner tuners (Waverly on some), good woods, James tailpiece, a nice case, binding, finish materials, inlay materials, etc. Like others have said, it adds up fast Makes it mind-boggling how some Pac-rim instruments sell for less than that

[HoGo]

I average close to $1,000 for cost of goods sold per instrument. That includes Rubner tuners (Waverly on some), good woods, James tailpiece, a nice case, binding, finish materials, inlay materials, etc. Like others have said, it adds up fast Makes it mind-boggling how some Pac-rim instruments sell for less than that

You should ramp up your production a bit... to something like 1000 units a month. :-)
Hardware can be really expensive, I've used Wavs and Alessi tuners and Joames tailpiece on few mandolins. But then the rest of the mandolin shoud be worth it in the first place.

[Chris Pritchett]

Firstly I'm UK based so comparisons may be difficult. i would put my average material cost at around £250-300 per build including 'consumables'. It could be a lot cheaper if I used far-east sourced hardware but i like to use Rubner or Grover tuners and good quality bridges. I would have thought that there would be some cost advantages in being US based for some tone woods. I concur that building in small numbers usually means paying 'retail' cost for small quantities of wood.