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Thread: Changing Sound

  1. #1

    Default Changing Sound

    Really new to the instrument so not sure about this. How long does it take or how much do you have to play a mandolin before it starts to open up or begins to change its sound? Can it begin in a short length of time, days/weeks, or does it begin after a long period after the wood starts to dry out? Not sure if mine are starting or if I'm just getting use to them. They are both solid wood Kentuckys. Thanks

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    I have been playing for only seven years and still waiting for all the mandolins I have owned to open up or change sounds ! Not sure I would know if it happened !! That's the reason I drink two buck chuck ( Charles Shaw) !! I think it has to do more with my ears opening up !!

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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    Every mandolin is different and some change while others don't seem to. There is the fact of getting used to what you are hearing. I know my mandolin changed quite a bit after several years of lots of playing.
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    Mandolin user MontanaMatt's Avatar
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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    My Weber Port Orford cedar top took about three years to start to relax, but I didn't pick it hard or much then, as I was the fiddle player in my band. Mando player left town, and I promoted myself to mando/fiddle duties, and then fired myself as fiddle player(only play fiddle at gigs every now and then). Picking time on mando increased significantly. I notice changes happening every spring and fall season transition. Here in Montana there are extensive seasonal swings of average indoor temp and r.h. The Weber changes less each year now, but does improve in sustain and note richness.

    My adirondack Ratliff has changed significantly (for the o.m.g better) in my first six months with it. I've read that Adirondack takes a long time to open as well, so I am excited to see it through to the other side of broken in.

    When I was a kid, one of my fiddle mentors told me that interior wood cells flex and burst with season flexing, thus dropping out the contents of the cell and becoming upon to the air, and that it takes lots of cycles to have the whole of the surface cells transition. This is unrelated to the sugars/saps changing with age. I don't know if there was empirical evidence of this, just what a master told his student.
    Great fiddles are generally over 100 years old, so it might keep going on your mandolin for a while yet. There aren't many F5 mandolins that are much over 100 years old, so no one knows what a three hundred y.o nice F5 sounds like.
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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    Indeed they do change and believe me some sound worse when they do...If you can, record what yours sounds like now and then in a year or so record it again and compare the two recordings...

    Willie

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  7. #6
    Mando accumulator allenhopkins's Avatar
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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    So many variables: different strings, picks, changes in your technique, changes in the way you hear the instrument, physical environment (humidity, temperature, room size/shape/materials, etc., etc.), that it's hard to pick out what part of the change is "opening up," and what part is attributable to other differences.

    Even your memory of what that Kentucky sounded like five years ago -- remember, your ears get used to the way your regular instrument sounds, and whatever changes occur are probably incremental -- affects your perception of whether the mandolin sounds better, worse, or different in any way over time.

    I've heard people say something like "My mandolin was sorta quiet the first three years I played it, and then all of a sudden it seemed to 'wake up' sounding much better." I've experienced none of that type of change, either in new instruments I've purchased, or in used instruments I've acquired. Others have, to hear them tell it.

    My overall "take" is that a mandolin pretty much sounds like itself over the course of its life. Not arguing with those who've heard a dramatic change, or even a modest one; just saying I can't say the same.
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    Mandolin user MontanaMatt's Avatar
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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    Like us, mandolins are organic material in a state of decay, they do change physically. Some repairs will inevitably be needed. It's an unrealistic premise that they will remain unchanged, even if overbuilt of low quality materials. As to improvements, violin consensus is that time benefits the behavior and tone of arch topped instruments, those that pass the test of time. I suppose that the dud violins were burnt or given to kids, thus not aging into maturity.
    2007 Weber Custom Elite "old wood"
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  10. #8
    Worlds ok-ist mando playr Zach Wilson's Avatar
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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    Two years later and my Weber Yellowstone is starting "open up" and sound sweet.

  11. #9
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    I have had my black 23 Gibson A2 for over 35 years and just the other day it finally opened up. It told me that it has been having a hard time living with me and decided to move in with a much younger player. I was heart-broken. :-)

    I am with Allen on the opening up issue. No doubt there is a change over time but it is really unprovable. Way too many variables. I would never depend on a mandolin or any instrument changing for the better years after I bought it. Figure out that it should sound the way you want it from the beginning. It should only get better from there.
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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    Some of the most memorable, enjoyable, and frustrating threads on here are the ones about whether or not a mandolin opens up.
    A talent for trivializin' the momentous and complicatin' the obvious.

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  14. #11
    Registered User Ivan Kelsall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    The one mandolin that i own that really has changed in both tone & volume,is my 2001 Lebeda F5 ''Special'' mandolin. I bought it 'used',but it was very obvious that it had hardly been played. When i got it,i was very much less than underwhelmed by it's sound. Having read on here that mandolins can 'open up',i persevered with it,played the hades out of it for months & gradually it started to sound 'good'. Over many more months of playing,i realised just how good a mandolin it had the potential to be. It's a larger than 'standard' mandolin body wise,& the G & D strings are really deep toned. The trebles are clean & as clear as any mandolin i've heard.

    So - has it 'opened up' ? - you could use that term,but i think that it's simply ''reached it's potential''. It's the one mandolin of my 3 that i'll never part with. ( i'd hate to part with any of 'em !!)
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  15. #12
    Oval holes are cool David Lewis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    Quote Originally Posted by allenhopkins View Post
    So many variables: different strings, picks, changes in your technique, changes in the way you hear the instrument, physical environment (humidity, temperature, room size/shape/materials, etc., etc.), that it's hard to pick out what part of the change is "opening up," and what part is attributable to other differences.

    Even your memory of what that Kentucky sounded like five years ago -- remember, your ears get used to the way your regular instrument sounds, and whatever changes occur are probably incremental -- affects your perception of whether the mandolin sounds better, worse, or different in any way over time.

    I've heard people say something like "My mandolin was sorta quiet the first three years I played it, and then all of a sudden it seemed to 'wake up' sounding much better." I've experienced none of that type of change, either in new instruments I've purchased, or in used instruments I've acquired. Others have, to hear them tell it.

    My overall "take" is that a mandolin pretty much sounds like itself over the course of its life. Not arguing with those who've heard a dramatic change, or even a modest one; just saying I can't say the same.
    I've been trying to work out if any of my mandolins have opened up. I have 2 epiphones, a washburn and a gretsch. The oldest instrument is about 4 years old. (An epiphone MM 50 e.)

    I love the sound of all of them, but I don't think they have. The other epiphone and the washburn are oval holes - the other 2 are f-holes... Mostly spruce, but the Gretsch is mahogany...

    I'm with you, Allen - I'm NOT suggesting that it doesn't happen or it hasn't happened. Just not to me.
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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    I experience more changes in tone, volume and "opening up" by changing to different strings and/or picks !

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    Registered User fscotte's Avatar
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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    Depends on how old the mandolin is from the point when the last layer of finish was applied.

    I'll say that if you can still smell the gases from the curing finish when you open up the case, then it still has the potential for tonal change.

    Any tonal change from that point is speculation and still has yet to be observed by science.

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    Mediocre but OK with that Paul Busman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    Quote Originally Posted by Torpedotom View Post
    Really new to the instrument so not sure about this. How long does it take or how much do you have to play a mandolin before it starts to open up or begins to change its sound?
    It takes about as long as it takes you to become a better player.I'm one who doesn't put much stock in the whole opening up thing. Opening up the case frequently and playing will make YOU sound better.
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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Busman View Post
    It takes about as long as it takes you to become a better player.I'm one who doesn't put much stock in the whole opening up thing. Opening up the case frequently and playing will make YOU sound better.
    Well said ! I agree totally !!

  23. #17
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    Default Re: Changing Sound

    The old saying is "The older the violin, the sweeter the music" Someone must have thought they do open up....The tops are under so much pressure that the wood has to change and settle in and that takes a little time...I have owned a lot of new mandolins and when I first set them up I find that after a long period of time I have to re adjust the bridge because the strings seem too low and I would assess that to mean the top has settled in a little bit and actually caved (not a good word) in slightly, very slightly I might add...

    Willie

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