As the Tarantella is 6/8, is it traditionally picked DUD DUD, like a jig?
As the Tarantella is 6/8, is it traditionally picked DUD DUD, like a jig?
I am interested in the answer to this too, I am pretty sure I am doing jig picking when I play one.
- Jeremy
Wot no catchphrase?
Same thing for me.
I guess I used DUD DUD when I played the Wedding Tarantella.
In the Ranieri method, triplets are taught this way. (Page 33 of Volume 2)
DUD DUD for me too, but I try to avoid turning tarantella into a jig. John La Barbera in his book Italian Folk Music for Mandolin and Fiddle notates them mostly as DUD DUD, but occasionally as DDU DDU as well.
There is almost nothing that cannot be played with (mainly) alternate picking.
I alternate pick Tarantellas. I find that I can't get the tempo up to where it needs to be if I jig pick it. I also think the triplet feel of the music is a bit more even than a jig.
I really like the first one of those; i spent ages learning it from the Youtube movie. I wouldn't recommend the flying finger fretting style, though!Like these guys:
Coming from a bluegrass/fiddle tune background, the idea of economy picking seems pretty bizarre, but I'm going to explore that and see if I can make it work.
What the Gypsy jazz guys do is keep as many downstrokes as possible when changing to a thinner string. So economy picking would use that D D U (two downstrokes in a row and an upstroke), but the first downstroke would be on say the 3rd string and the next downstoke is a continuation on the 2nd string - a single motion much like sweep picking.
I played the Wedding Tarantella again last night -we are playing it at a wedding in a few weeks- and realised that my pick direction is all over the place, and changes with the pulse of the song in each section. People seem to like the way it sounds, so for the moment I am not going to try and analyse what I do, maybe after the wedding.
- Jeremy
Wot no catchphrase?
Exploring Classical Mandolin (Berklee Press, 2015)
Progressive Melodies for Mandocello (KDP, 2019) (2nd ed. 2022)
New Solos for Classical Mandolin (Hal Leonard Press, 2020)
2021 guest artist, mandocello: Classical Mandolin Society of America
In my lessons with Giovanni Vicari, he insisted when ever you move to a new string, you start with a down stroke. He was old school Italian. He would try to keep phrases on one string when possible, not jumping to the open string and back, instead fretting the 7th fret. That way you can keep a steady DUDU picking.
I don't "Jig pick" a Tarantella, I try to keep a fluid line. It does mean the picking pattern will change when changing strings. I think this is where David is coming from. Picking patterns are not always one way or another. The pattern will change, depending on when the phrase moves to another string. Maybe this is where Jeremy is finding himself.
I will admit that later when I got into playing fiddle tunes, I used the traditional pattern of a steady alternate picking with more open strings. It just sounds right. It took some adjustment, tho.
Now, I'm stuck in between the 2 schools.
Joe B
It's probably obvious anyway, but I would say that it's better to have a systematic approach than not to, and that it matters less what the method actually is (as long as it makes some sense, of course).
I prefer the DUD DUD approach myself, mainly because I have been playing jigs for years and am practised in picking like that quickly and smoothly, all that's needed is to make sure to even out the notes in each triplet. But I wouldn't strongly press the case for it, as I can see that it would make sense for someone else to use a different approach.
John Barbera's approach, described in his book Traditional Southern Italian Mandolin and Fiddle Tunes, is DUD for triplets, except for two cases:
- DDU when crossing strings (downstroke on the new string),
- D-U when there's a slur into the second note: e.g., Downstroke hammering onto second note followed by upstroke for third note
I find that I do the first of these, but I do D-D in the second instance.
I agree with jeho2a, I find it helpful "to have a systemic approach", as a starting point. It should not be a cage, don't feel locked into using it every time, in every situation. Exceptions prove the rule.
I remember reading an interview with Jazz Pianist, Keith Jarrett, about this this same subject. He was saying, from a Piano point of view, sometimes he uses different fingerings that break from the norm.
Joe B
I downloaded the e-book Mandolin Duos from around 1900 edited by Barbara Pommerenke-Steel from Astute Music.
The first piece I chose to practice was a very short Tarantella by a composer names Giovanni Angeluci.
In the notes belonging to this Tarantella Barbara writes:
The groups of quavers can be played in two different ways: down-up-down/up-down-up or down-up-down/down-up-down.
Each version might have a different musical result. Make sure to select one option because of the musical result and not because it might be easier.
That made me think of this thread.
I did some experimenting and decided to pick D-U-D/D-U-D,that is, your typical jig picking. https://soundcloud.com/tele1310/tara...ovani-angeluci
To me, that kind of pick direction sounds OK for a Tarantella.
Only problem: I got to speed it up to a decent Tarantella-tempo.
If I count a 2/4time and consider the groups of three quavers as triplets, what is the right tempo for a Tarantella?
132 BpM?
Last edited by crisscross; Dec-07-2017 at 2:31pm.
Two of the videos that DavidKOS posted are at 142 bpm and 174 bpm, so probably faster than 132 bpm. I believe that when tarantellas were originally danced to, they started slowly and sped up until the dancers couldn't continue.
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