Fredrick Snyder #16 Ebay Purchase Need Advice

[DrewWalden]

I was the winner of the Fredrick Snyder Gibson copy that recently sold on eBay. Unfortunately for me, it was not mentioned that the top plate on this mandolin is separating. The finish is what appears to be spray paint. The neck, looks like it has had some kind of repair, but I think it may just be a finish repair and not a broken neck... the neck appears really strait to have had a break. The right F hole has cracked, the top plate appears to be extremely thin in that area.

You couldn't really tell how bad this mandolin was from the eBay pictures. It needs the top plate fixed, and refinished. I paid $900 for this mando and I am thinking I am going to send it back. I would have never bid so high had I known the top plate was separating. It was not mentioned in the listing. Anyway... there is a lot of fret-wear which leads me to believe that this is probably a heck of a mandolin when its all fixed up. So, I guess i'm asking for advice, how much is it going to cost to get the top plate fixed and get it refinished. Anyone want to take this project on? If you all where in my shoes what would you do.

You can follow the drop box link below to see more photos. Any help is greatly appreciated.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/x5utefhav...fif1FtQ2a?dl=0

[MikeEdgerton]

I liked it better at the original 49.00.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/THE-GIBSON-F...0AAOSwlXhZZAbt

http://www.ebay.com/itm/THE-GIBSON-F...YAAOSwKoRZZBQz

It's listed as a Gibson F9. It isn't a Gibson or an F9 and it was listed as a restoration project. Lots of pictures. I'd start a return through eBay.

[mrmando]

I'd send it back ... no way should you have paid $900 for something in that condition.

[Marty Jacobson]

Play wear does not guarantee a good instrument. For $900… there are surer bets out there.

[jim simpson]

I agree with Mike, send it back. The neck heal shows a glued crack, the scroll does not look good, etc. Way overpriced for the condition.

[Jeff Mando]

There is a certain funky coolness about it, sort of like folk art, but IMHO you would have to spend quite a bit just to find out what it sounds like and that would be on top of the $900 purchase price. Fairly big gamble, at least for my wallet....

[Jess L.]

... If you all where in my shoes what would you do. ...

I'm no expert, but...

I would send that thing back so fast it'd be a blur (following all the proper procedures, of course).

Seller must have a magic camera to make that thing look as good as it did on the eBay pics. No way would I accept that.

But hurry. It says on the original eBay page under the "Returns" tab:

"Items will be accepted for return if the item has been misrepresented in the actual auction listing and the item is returned in its original condition as it was shipped from the seller. Seller must be notified within 3 days of receipt of merchandise."

I would say "misrepresented" definitely, the eBay pictures barely resemble the actual instrument as portrayed in the OP pics. Yikes!

Seller also failed to portray (or maybe seller has really bad vision and didn't notice) the weird issues on the back of the neck below the peghead, as shown in OP pic "mandolin4.jpg" at Dropbox site. That's considerably worse than just "rubs, streaky, etc" that the seller mentioned, unless "etc" means 'looks like it was ate away by acid' or something.

Note that I'm not necessarily accusing the seller of *intentional* deceit, maybe their camera just somehow gets beauty shots where everyone else's camera shows the raw details. I do know several people (*not* sellers on eBay) who, before they got their cataracts fixed, their eyesight was so bad that they didn't realize when something was a disaster - I've seen that in retired hobbyist car painters, they didn't know their quality of work had declined until someone got good zoomed-in photos of it, then they were like, "Whoa, that's terrible, I didn't know it looked like that."

But back to the mandolin, whatever the reason, the seller's pictures make the instrument look way better than it is.

If I'm reading the eBay pages correctly, looks like it's already sold twice now, it sold once on July 10 for $49.95, and sold again on July 17 for $900? So does that mean that the earlier person who bought it for $49.95 *also* returned it, or that they just didn't bother to send payment? (I don't know how to interpret eBay stuff.)

But, on the other hand, who is the builder "Fredrick Snyder", is he world-reknowned like Lloyd Loar or something? If so, that could change things. The eBay page gave a link to Snyder's obit which said his "main hobby and joy was building and repairing musical instruments." I'll bet Mr. Snyder would have a fit if he could see the condition that his instrument is in now.

[DrewWalden]

Thanks for all the help, I started the return process this morning.

[fscotte]

In all fairness to the seller, he prob isnt much of an instrument dealer and isn't aware of all the caveats of a mando to know what is and isn't in need of repair. Despite that, he's still responsible for being accurate.

I'd just like to know why in the world would anyone bid this up to such ridiculous price? What made you want this one, knowing its not a gibson and knowing it is a "restoration project"?

Hope Ebay supports your misrepresentation claim.

[Bernie Daniel]

Thanks for all the help, I started the return process this morning.

Good luck -- hope eBay cooperates with you. They are fair to cloudy much of the time.

[MikeEdgerton]

A word of caution to anyone buying any used instrument online. You might love your phone but at least get a glimpse of the full sized pictures on a full sized computer. I'm guilty of buying a few instruments over the years that had small pictures on the auction and I missed some pretty critical details. I was burned more than once.

[HonketyHank]

A word of caution to anyone buying any used instrument online. You might love your phone but at least get a glimpse of the full sized pictures on a full sized computer. I'm guilty of buying a few instruments over the years that had small pictures on the auction and I missed some pretty critical details. I was burned more than once.

And the converse is also true:

Sellers: "You might love your phone but at least get a glimpse of the full sized pictures on a full sized computer." No matter how good a deal it is, if what I see when examining your photos is blurs or flash blitz, I pass.

[DrewWalden]

In all fairness to the seller, he prob isnt much of an instrument dealer and isn't aware of all the caveats of a mando to know what is and isn't in need of repair. Despite that, he's still responsible for being accurate.

I'd just like to know why in the world would anyone bid this up to such ridiculous price? What made you want this one, knowing its not a gibson and knowing it is a "restoration project"?

Hope Ebay supports your misrepresentation claim.

There was a post on the cafe about this builder and the guy said it was the best mandolin he had ever played. In the pictures the mandolin didn't appear to be in terrible condition, i figured a little glue on the f hole, a new bridge and it would be ready to go. Plus, it is an early Gibson copy, so I figured it would be an interesting conversation piece as well. I really do think it would make a great sounding mandolin if the effort was put into it. It has a nice resonance/sound when tapped. Given the required work to be done, I should have paid about $800 less. haha

[fscotte]

If you'd like to keep it, there may be a very good chance that the seller would issue a decent partial refund. He may realize that he got an awesome sale here that will likely not repeat. So either send money back to your pocket or risk selling it for $49.95 again...

[jim simpson]

I bought a project mandolin at good price a while back. It turned out to be a good sounding mandolin plus the scroll carve was really well done. There were some weird issues with it that I was comfortable correcting. I passed it on eventually in a trade. I saw in the history that it had sold for several hundred more in a previous auction and was returned before being relisted. I guess the buyer wasn't into repairs or mods.

[DrewWalden]

The seller ended up giving me a substantial refund. So I got to keep the mandolin, still think I paid a little to much for it.... but it was a price I was OK paying. Now, I just need to find someone to rebuild this thing. Audey Ratliff, Eddie Blevins, and Ray Dearstone all live within 15 minutes of the house. Hopefully one of them will want to take on this project.

[Bogle]

Drew,

Your number 16 may be the mandolin I ordered from Fred new in 1973, and I say this because mine had a separation in the neck in the identical spot as yours. Fred was a very nice guy, built great-sounding instruments at a very affordable price ($375!), and this was my first GOOD mandolin. He was upset about the neck problem it developed and immediately sent me a new F-5 copy (w/flower pot inlay) at no charge in exchange so that I would not be without an instrument. I will also state here that your mandolin is minus Fred's original finish on it!

Interestingly enough, around 2002 Fred and I re-connected via snail-mail (in fact all of our communication was via mail or phone) after an approximate 29-year gap in communication. If you'd like to more background, please feel free to PM me here on the Cafe and I'll be happy to share or answer any questions you may have.

Steve D.

[mrmando]

Audey Ratliff, Eddie Blevins, and Ray Dearstone all live within 15 minutes of the house. Hopefully one of them will want to take on this project.

Audey has to finish my mandocello first ...